Our Kittens Life Taken By Two Dogs

[starrynightxxi]

well, a big problem with that theory, CFC is that it is completely unsupported by most if not all governments and you would end up being held accountable and being punished (especially with it clearly being premeditated), and not the person who was originally at fault.

a lot of dogs are cat aggressive but it never comes to anything because of responsible owners who don't allow it to. My dog is cat aggressive and she has very nearly caught cats in our yard before but we always watch her carefully and call her off (to which she responds grudgingly). Unfortunately dogs do not act the same outside their territories as they do within them, and a dogs in a pack can be even more unpredictable. They are more likely to chase things, and better equpped to catch something. THAT is a very natural instinct, the pack behavior, and it has been recorded in people as well as other animals. It's how mobs start. Normally mild mannered people can become violent at the drop of a hat in these situations, and we are even further removed from our wild instincts than dogs.

While the dogs killing the cat is sad and unfortunate to say the least, the fault lies much more heavily on the man who just didn't care. and it wasn't because he COULDN'T do anything. Even if he was powerless to call them off, there was another person there trying to pull them off and with two people, they probably could have altered this entire situation.

 

[juliehainsworth]

Childcrazy! I seriously hope you get this sorted out soon! Your doing the right thing by not seeing the dogs as the main problem it's a shame you cant some how name and shame this dog owner in the press somehow as well! It might make him think twice about his actions!

 

[RandomWiktor]

CFC, are you always such a fan of anthropomorphism? What do you mean, "it should know better?" Its a dog for god's sake. They can't think on levels complex enough to make a thought that even resembles, "As much as my instincts tell me anything smaller than me is fair game as prey, I'm supposed to be civilized enough to know that someone loves that animal, and because of that, even though I haven't been trained and am not on a leash, I should have the restraint to not attack." Just because a dog doesn't kill prey daily to eat doesn't mean it lacks a prey drive. I mean, god, ever hear of hunting dogs, herding dogs, or even fetch? It is all modified hunting behavior.
Do you know anything about canine behavior whatsoever? Your posts speak strongly to the contrary. The closest thing you've said to anything reasonable in this thread is that the dogs are a potential danger to other animals and maybe even the public. However, you seem to have some kind of gaping disconnect with the fact that it is the owner's responsibility to properly train and control the dogs when things like this happen. The 'blame the dog' line of thinking is the same ignorance that results in dangerous dogs remaining in the general public, because the owners that make dogs dangerous through a lack of proper training and socialization are never punished.

 

[KathyM]

A German Shepard is basically a domesticated wolf

Nope, nil points for that. They're nowhere near a domesticated wolf - no nearer than a chihuahua. You don't really know your dog facts do you *lol*.

it should actually know better than to attack and kill kittens or any other small animal that comes its way, after all you can pretty much guarantee that it has been fed on tins of dog food so certainly shouldn't be mistaking a small animal for food.

Again - how's the dog supposed to know? They're supposed to *just know*? Come on *lmao*. Dogs are a blank canvas in most cases when they're born. Their attitude to other animals is based on their socialisation, experiences and sometimes their gnetics play a part. How you're expecting a dog to know what's right and wrong without training has me stumped.

If one of these domesticated wolves suddenly shows a tendency to attack and kill other animals then it should be swiftly destroyed before it can cause further damage to other animals or even people.

Again, aggression to a cat does NOT make a dog more likely to attack a child. We have all met dog aggressive dogs that are fantastic with kids and the likes - kittens and kids arent really that similar. *pmsl*. Sounds like these dogs have been well dealt with since the attack and should the owner be responsible and do what the warden tells them, there'll be no problems in future. You're a bit blood thirsty aren't you?

I'm a real believer in an eye for an eye, something or someone hurts me or mine and they had better start getting their affairs in order before i catch up with them.

Your post is ignorant on so many levels - it's actually scary. Why take revenge on an ignorant animal? There wasn't any aspect of this that was the dogs' fault. If you can't see that, you're more ignorant than I thought

Now I suggest you develop a) some knowledge to back up your posts when you're spouting crap like this, and B) a sense of responsibility and decency - you've encouraged violence and lawbreaking throughout your posts and frankly it's immature and not what you'd exepct from a moderator.

Cichlidcrazy - I'm so sorry.

 

[Synirr]

..."As much as my instincts tell me anything smaller than me is fair game as prey, I'm supposed to be civilized enough to know that someone loves that animal, and because of that, even though I haven't been trained and am not on a leash, I should have the restraint to not attack."

That tickled my funny bone!

CFC, would you want to kill a child that accidentally managed to kill your fish? It's the same thing with dogs, they can only know what they have been taught. A child not taught that he/she shouldn't put bleach in the fish tank to clean it isn't going to know any better by magic, and neither is a dog who hasn't been taught that cats aren't prey going to know any better when his instinct is to kill smaller prey-type animals. You are just taking out your frustrations on an innocent when you blame the dog. Ultimately, while wild animals don't have an owner to teach them otherwise, dogs do, and the owner is the one to blame when things go wrong, just like parents are responsible for the actions of their children.

 

[juliehainsworth]

I totally agree with Synirr!

 

[pepper]

Bagpuss was a gorgeous little kitten! I am so sorry for your loss!


You CANNOT blame the dogs for killing the kitten anymore then you can blame a cat for killing a bird. The fact that someone on here would want to hurt the dog because he killed the kitten is actually scarey and very worrying!

The dogs owners should take responsibility for there dogs actions. It is not the dogs fault, it is the dogs owners fault!

 

[CFC]

....and this is why the world is going to the dogs (excuse the pun), people have become such left wing namby pambies that must always respect the welfare of the wrong doers that problems are allowed to escalate and we end up with more and more victims. Bring back the days when justice and punishments were dealt with an iron fist and see how many people have out of control dogs then.

CFC, would you want to kill a child that accidentally managed to kill your fish?

You bet i would want to!! I wouldn't of course as I'm not quite THAT merciless and brutal but there would be a whole lot of seething anger just waiting to explode. Which is the exact reason why no one but me is allowed to go into my fish room unsupervised, anything goes wrong and the only person i can get mad at is myself, its a lot safer that way.

 

[k.o.d]

If a wolf or coyote, maybe a bear or even some kind of big cat came walking down the road and was savagely attacking and killing domestic pets then i have no doubt that the animal would be shot and killed by the local authorities before it could become a danger for people. A German Shepard is basically a domesticated wolf, the domesticated part meaning it should actually know better than to attack and kill kittens or any other small animal that comes its way, after all you can pretty much guarantee that it has been fed on tins of dog food so certainly shouldn't be mistaking a small animal for food.
If one of these domesticated wolves suddenly shows a tendency to attack and kill other animals then it should be swiftly destroyed before it can cause further damage to other animals or even people.


I'm a real believer in an eye for an eye, something or someone hurts me or mine and they had better start getting their affairs in order before i catch up with them.

Every dog in the world is a domesticated wolf, they are all descendants from the same line, no matter how small or how large so that makes no difference.
What does make a difference is how they are trained, how they are made to understand their level in the 'pack'. We deal with Akita rescue and have seen some awful cases of neglect and a total lack of understanding of what their responsibilities are.
I have never come across a 'bad' dog that has not been screwed up by its lack of training/understanding by its owner.
You can own a pet, but to look after it properly needs much more time and patience.

I am afraid you come across as just as bad as the owner that watched as his dogs attacked the kitten

Steve

 

[OohFeeshy]

Hey, leave the dog alone. It's not its fault it's living under the rulings of a sadistic Chav.

I'm sure you wouldn't blame children who had been bought up as Nazis for what they beleive, it is the responsibility of their carers to tell them right from wrong.

Have you seen those two girls who have been brought up to sing Nazi propeganda by their parents? You don't see anyone saying 'What evil little children! They should be executed for those horrible racist views!'. You do, however, see people making comments about what awful parents those children have, and giving the girls pity for being brought up like that.

But as soon as it's a different species of animal involved, logic seems to go out of the window. In every instance of 'dog attacks' I have heard about, either the dogs are the so-called 'vicious' breeds like rottweilers, who seem to have been purchased becasue of their apparent nature, and brought up to kill anything that isn't their owner, or something where the dog was acting in self defence, or pure accident (take the woman whose dog bit her face because she was having a fit). Then, everybody automatically assumes the dog is a vicious bloody minded killer of its own free will.

In the first example, while the article usually mentions that the owners set the dog on that person, or were encouraging it or whatever, none of them seem to have the slightest mention that, in fact, the dogs attacked becasue they were raised to eleive that is the 'right' thing.

I'm sorry for your loss, having recently got a kitten myself, I know how crafty they can be at escaping.

Oh, the first thoguht that came into my head when I read this

A German Shepard is basically a domesticated wolf

Was that, in all essence, so are chiuauas, shi tzus, great danes, dalmations, and any other dog. It's just that german shepards have been bred to look more like wolves than the others.

 

[KathyM]

....and this is why the world is going to the dogs (excuse the pun), people have become such left wing namby pambies that must always respect the welfare of the wrong doers that problems are allowed to escalate and we end up with more and more victims.

Nooo, nobody's questionning that some sort of action needs to be taken (and it has, he has to muzzle/lead them now, and if he doesn't he could be taken to court for having dogs dangerously out of control in a public place). BUT, the "wrong doer" as you put it isn't the dogs, it's the owner.

I rattles everyone's cage that people get away with things like this, but sensibility says that it's not the animal's responsibility and they shouldn't have to "pay".

In this day and age there's no place for breed discrimination either - I'm personally sick of some people's ignorance on dog breeds, having a Bullmastiff myself that wouldn't hurt a fly. In cases like this, the dog, or breed, suffers - when it's not their fault. While I'm sure threatening an animal makes you feel all big and manly, it doesn't solve a thing.

 

[lljdma06]

Sorry for the loss of your cat Cichlidcrazy. It's an aweful thing to have to go through, the loss of a pet. I would keep your other cat inside until she's an adult, but that's just my opinion. My cat is not allowed outside, way too dangerous and it's my opinion that cats should be just kept indoors. Too much disease, from exposure to strays, and other legitimate dangers (cars, dogs without proper supervision, birds of prey, chemicals, alligators [my neck of the woods], etc...). But I understand that my opinion is not shared by some.

On a lighter note, CFC, your comments are hysterical. He's just saying what's on his mind and that's great. Everyone is entitled to their opinion, KathyM, CFC, everybody. And this is coming from a left wing namby pamby, well actually, more of a middle wing namby pamby with a wicked streak. I apologize for the chuckle in what is supposed to be a sad thread.

I truely feel for your loss Cichlidcrazy.

 

[RandomWiktor]

....and this is why the world is going to the dogs (excuse the pun), people have become such left wing namby pambies that must always respect the welfare of the wrong doers that problems are allowed to escalate and we end up with more and more victims.

Man, reasoning with you is like spitting back at the rain.

No one here does not want to see justice be served; the only people who would not want to see any punishment are indeed spineless pansies who think no one can be held accountable for their actions. However, for something to be justice, it has to be just - the ones responsible must be held accountable... and in this case, it is the owner. He should be slapped with a massive fine, have his dogs taken away, and be barred from having animals if he can not control them in a way that is safe to other animals and the general public. That is the kind of justice that keeps more dangerous, uncontrollable dogs from existing; if you just kill the dogs, the moron who made them that way will just get more dogs and create more dangerous animals. But I guess veangance is a much more noble cause then doing something to prevent future tradgedies, eh?

 

[red-devil0602]

I have xposted this to the rescue forum and will get back to you if we come up with anything.

 

[cichlidcrazy]

I have xposted this to the rescue forum and will get back to you if we come up with anything.

Thanks very much for that .I appreciate your help .

I spoke to the dog warden today who told me they will be visiting this man with the R.S.P.C.A they will inform me of the out come.Any information that you may come up with in the meantime will all help to hopefully get these dogs rehomed with a responsable owner.
We wont give up untill something is done .