Uk Election

[kaivalagi]

i'm going with Honey with a tint of red.

I'll take that....it was half way between red and yellow...

 

[Ace Of Spades]

i'm going with Honey with a tint of red.

I'll take that....it was half way between red and yellow...

amber "yellow when newer to orange or reddish-orange when older."

Reddish Orange

 

[kaivalagi]

i'm going with Honey with a tint of red.

I'll take that....it was half way between red and yellow...

amber "yellow when newer to orange or reddish-orange when older."

Reddish Orange

You just like an argument aye, all I was trying to make the point on was that his tie was half way between red and yellow in my opinion so did it suggest anything, at the time it was appropriate, now however not so...
I'm not going to take the bait anymore...

 

[andywg]

Unfortunately we are a monarchy.

However being the complete royalist that I am, I think they should all be killed, and we should go to a presedency.

I'm not confused between royalists and republicans, I merely use the term to describe someone who is a supporter of having a royal family.

I can only assume the lack of a sarcasm tag causes the confusion marrying up the above. There's not too many supporters of the royal family who want them all killed and replaced with a president

You voted without knowing whose manifesto you agreed with?

I didn't read any of the manifestos and I bet almost no one who voted did. And reading it is pretty pointless as anyone who takes a careful look at what is promised compared to what actually happens. In support is the judgment of Bromley London Borough Council v Greater London Council [sup][1][/sup] where the House of Lords held that a manifesto is issued to get votes and should not be regarded as bond, signed, sealed and delivered as very few of the electorate read them in full or at all, knowing of them only what they read in the paper and nobody votes for the entire manifesto in the polling booth.

As such, a party is not bound by its manifesto pledges and therefore making sure you read them all cover to cover will not necessarily give you a better idea of what they really will do when they get in any more than keeping an eye or an ear on Question Time or Any Questions.


[sup][1][/sup] [1983] 1 AC 768

 

[chrisbassist]

You sure it wasn't purple?

Could have been green I suppose.

 

[chrisbassist]

Andy...

Yeah I would not seriously suggest the mass murder of our royal line and mean it. Violence wouldn't solve anything.

But whether a manifesto is going to be held or not, will at least show you the things they think are important.

While you will learn more by following the debates, you only really learn more about the man, not the party as a whole.

I suppose there is no perfect way, but call me an idealist, the manifestos should be presented to voters so everyone can read all of them without having Internet connections or rely on being visited by all parties and said visitors actually having it with them.

I know these things have little to nothing actionable. But at least giving some info would help the undecided start to grasp where the parties lie on issues that matter to them.

 

[andywg]

But whether a manifesto is going to be held or not, will at least show you the things they think are important.

Or it will show you what they think the middle ground thinks are important and will get them elected

While you will learn more by following the debates, you only really learn more about the man, not the party as a whole.

I suppose there is no perfect way, but call me an idealist, the manifestos should be presented to voters so everyone can read all of them without having Internet connections or rely on being visited by all parties and said visitors actually having it with them.

I know these things have little to nothing actionable. But at least giving some info would help the undecided start to grasp where the parties lie on issues that matter to them.

I think you need a little more cynicism when it comes to those that desire to rule over us

The problem is that the manifesto pledges are broken so often that you don't get a good idea from reading it what you are really voting for (also due to what is left out). Look at the Lisbon Treaty/European Constitution fudge, or Labour raising taxes in each government in direct contravention of what they promised or the Tories raising VAT after the 1979 election. And how many people wanted a government prepared to try and increase pre-charge detention to 90 days? I somehow doubt that the Labour party manifesto will give details on where they stand ideologically on civil liberties and interference of the state in the private lives of the public (the collection of data on the public from ISPs, the illegal DNA database, CCTV surveillance, extension of pre-charge detention and the use of anti-terrorist legislation to check people are going to the right school).

The manifesto is not really a document of the party and its values so much as an advertising brochure trying to get you to vote for them. The nasty bits or those they don't think you really want to know about are left out (You would not expect a Toyota advert to mention recent recalls). Look at VAT; most people expect it to go up, none of the parties said they would raise it.

The best thing the undecided can do is to read a paper or two and listen to a couple of programs and avoid the propaganda (which probably rules out most of the papers...). Sadly many do not want to learn more or to challenge their preconceptions, but will just vote as they (and their family) always have, hence there being a number of constituencies that would return a donkey if it had the right coloured rosette on it. Universal suffrage means letting the ignorant vote with just as much say as those who have tried to learn as much as possible.

I understand what you are saying, and in an ideal world the manifesto would do as it should and we could then make up our minds, but spin plays too much of a part in it all now. Given how much all three parties fight for the middle ground there really is little in it these days so the spin has to take over to prevent apathy.

 

[chrisbassist]

I don't dis agree, unfortunately I'm still fairly new to all this. I don't read papers, I don't watch much news etc, and feel that if it weren't for the Internet, I wouldn't have an avenue to find clear facts about policies.

I remember at the last election, even though I didn't vote, I spent many many hours Reading every bit of info I could on all the parties, what their basic values were, and what their policies were, and an idea of the parties general ideology, While policies will change (and do on a regular basis) the ideology should remain the same.

This election has been a massive learning experience for me, and has also somewhat dampened my general optimism.

I've also learnt more about tactical voting rather than just voting for the prefered party.

I have to say though, my vote was primarily decided by the track record of the candidate who has spent over 10 years as the local mp. And the fact he is a brilliant mp, who actually gets things done.

Lastly, let me say thanks andy, it's great to hear a different perspective on issues.

 

[JoshuaA]

Voted UKIP, though the candidate only got about 900 votes. Its always between Labour and Tories, Tories always win and all the surrounding areas are labour. I generally live in a "well off" constituency, where the vast majority of the population are above average earners, however that's not me!! I Live on the border haha.

I voted UKIP because all the policies are in the right places and purely to show support, otherwise I would of voted Labour. Realistically I wanted Labour to return to power, so I hope its a Labdem coalition rather than Libcon. (I opted not to say Con-Dem for a particular reason haha)

 

[hughessomefish]

from the united states I have been watching the whole election,I hope Gordon Brown stays as prime minister he is very good to our country.

 

[chrisbassist]

That's looking very unlikely at the moment.

 

[kaivalagi]

from the united states I have been watching the whole election,I hope Gordon Brown stays as prime minister he is very good to our country.

I think you'll find all our leaders are very nice to your country, we're the 51st state you know

 

[andywg]

This election has been a massive learning experience for me, and has also somewhat dampened my general optimism.

They tend to do that The biggest problem with this one is you have the cloud of expenses and the fact we are still battling out of a recession and trying to avoid a depression or stagflation. When there are funds in the country the elections can be more about the ideologies of the parties, especially if they start to drift from the middle to their core votes.

I have to say though, my vote was primarily decided by the track record of the candidate who has spent over 10 years as the local mp. And the fact he is a brilliant mp, who actually gets things done.

This is how everyone should vote. We are a representative democracy. We vote for someone to represent us, not a party and not a prime minister (making all the lines about Gordon not being elected somewhat irrelevant). Ideally we should ban whipping and allow all MPs a free vote on all legislation. This would make a far bigger difference than having PR (which would result in a party full of drones all doing what the leader tells them so they can climb higher, and therefore safer, on the party list for the next election). I was a little undecided even until I got to the ballot box, and then I thought about how there was only one candidate on the paper who had actually got anything delivered through my door. I was happy to see later that she visited all 68 polling locations within her constituency. Since this is a country seat, that involved 130 miles and took about 7 hours. Effort like that gets a reward in my book.

Lastly, let me say thanks andy, it's great to hear a different perspective on issues.

Indeed, life is boring when everything is the same. On the plus side, I reckon there's a good chance we can do it all again before Christmas!

from the united states I have been watching the whole election,I hope Gordon Brown stays as prime minister he is very good to our country.

If only the coverage you receive had also shown quite how loathed he is by the members of the public. He is not far off making Bush Jnr look as popular as JFK. If labour had dumped him a year or so ago there is a pretty good chance they would be the largest party and maybe even still in government right now.

And whilst he might be good for your country, he has been pretty awful to ours!

 

[Betta5]

TBH the worst thing that could happen at the moment would be a con/lib join. The Libdems differ on so many key issues with the conservatives and I would guess would lose them alot of votes making it further imposible for them to be respected as a viable party. If I voted lib dem I would be pissed off if he ends up going with the colab.

I think a Labour/Lib dem join could be good if they had enough seats alone.

That being said, I think it may be good for Labour if they lose, to rethink and maybe restructure and maybe go back to their roots, so to speak.

I do not see the current situation as a cry for the conservatives in any situation. A few months ago they were predicted to win in excess of 50 seats. I think Labour have done well to retain as many seats as they have in the current golbal situation.

 

[kaivalagi]

For me whatever decision is made to get things moving quickly is the best one, after things have settled if there is no majority then we vote again...I just hope they get a move on as stalling for very long in my opinion will devalue the pound and put the country in an even worse position than being ruled by any of the main parties ever would.