How much interaction?

[_fish_a_holic_]

I have two non-breeding males in large vases next to each other. They are round/oval, not rectangular vases. So they can see each other but it's not like a [box][box][box] affair, if you know what I mean?

How much interaction should I give these guys? Should I put a piece of cardboard between the vases most of the time and just give them flaring time a couple of hours a day? I know they are kept side by side in LFS, but then again... *sigh* what can we say about betta treatment at LFS! It just seems to me that it would be really stressful for them to be able to see each other all the time...

Please offer me some guidelines!

BTW, yes I do (daily) water changes. Or is it just WRONG to have bettas in vases altogether? Room is heated. Vases are about 5 litres each.

PS: I'm relatively "afraid" of getting into bettas again as they were my first fish and things went tragically wrong (whole tank got a disease and were wiped out one by one). Sorry if this question has been answered before. I just don't want a repeat of my first fish experience.

 

[veen]

how many gallons does 5 litres translate into? i would think that as long as each vase is at least 1 gallon and you're doing water changes then it should be fine.

i have my 2.5 gallon tank divided and my guys can see each other. they do flare at each other sometimes but also tend to hang out on opposite sides of the tank where they can't see each other for a good portion of the nights that i've observed them.

i think it has more to do with each betta's individual temperament. if they seem to be flaring away all day that's probably a little stressful. but if they don't flare too much then i would think having them next to each other is fine.

 

[BettaMomma]

Those vases translate into about 1.3 gallons, which is just fine a size to keep them in.
However, I always worry about vases because the more surface area they have to get air, the better in my opinion.
But like I said, that size isn't really what most of us would consider cruel or inhumane. In fact, 2 of my boys are each in little 1G tanks. One day they'll be upgraded, but it's all I have room for right now. Besides, look at the size of the 1G tanks as compared to where they were before you got them...

As for the flaring - you will have to judge it based on how crazy they go while they're able to look at each other. My 2 boys Charlie and Jasper went completely BONKERS when I removed the paper between theri tanks so I could only let them see each other for a few minutes every day.

Test them - set them next to each other while you step back and watch. If they go nuts and flare non-stop without ever giving it a rest, you will need to separate them so they can't really see each other. However, if they seem like they don't really mind each other's presence, it doesn't really matter much. I have discovered, as you probably have too, that the boys who are sitting right next to each other in the nasty little cups at the lfs are so unfazed anymore by someone in the aquarium/tank/cup next to them that they just don't care about it.

Hope this helps

 

[Kiarra]

It really does depend on the fish in question.

There are some Bettas that have to be limited in their interactions because otherwise they WILL cause harm to themselves, whether by biting off their own tails, blowirng their tails, stress, etc. There are some that don't mind the interaction. And there are even some that HAVE to have it.

I have one---Duncan---who HAS to be next to another male named Merlin. I moved Duncan's tank just out of sight of Merlin's, and it was about three seconds before Duncan went down to the bottom, laid down on his side, and basically played dead. HE DOES THIS EVERY SINGLE TIME I TAKE HIM AWAY FROM MERLIN!!!!! So I just gave up and keep them side-by-side. They flare at each other often throughout the day, but Duncan plays dead and won't eat or flare or nest or do anything at all when I take him away from Merlin, so it's really the only option I have. Weird fish....

 

[_fish_a_holic_]

However, I always worry about vases because the more surface area they have to get air, the better in my opinion.

These vases are narrower at the bottom, and slightly flare out at the top. There's quite a bit of surface area.

BUT, is this really a major problem? As they are labyrinth breathers?

Test them - set them next to each other while you step back and watch. If they go nuts and flare non-stop without ever giving it a rest, you will need to separate them so they can't really see each other. However, if they seem like they don't really mind each other's presence, it doesn't really matter much.

These guys are in front of me as I type! It's cool to be able to touch type and watch fishies at the same time...

OK, Let's say a 9-minute interval they will flare for 2 minutes, take a break for half a minute, look at me sayin "Hey Mum where's more food??" for half a minute, flare for 2 minutes, repeat x2!

I've decided to move their vases further apart. They can still see each other (in fact, they go to the "middle" and try to catch the other one's attention once in a while) but are exploring their surroundings more.

What would be the minimum size vase you could (should!) use for a betta? This vase thing is new. I've had them in separate net breeders hung onto a 75L (16.5 UK gallons, almost 20 US gallons) tank with the females and the "alpha" (hopefully, breeding) male having the run of the tank. That way the water is filtered & heated. But I feel so sorry for them in the net breeders so I thought I'd try the vase thing.

Which situation is better: vases or net breeder within main tank?

One more question:
Should I or should I not move them back and forth once in a while? Would this cause more stress than always being in a vase? I've just re-measured the volume of an exact copy of the vase they are in and in fact only have about 3L vases

 

[BettaMomma]

The vase should be fine.
I'd stick to one or the other - don't switch them back adn forth - lots of change can really stress them.
Personally it's a tossup here, about which one is better for betta boy, because while the filtered, constant temperature is really great for them, having them in a little breeder net really isn't fair.

Is it possible for you to divide off a little section for them?

 

[_fish_a_holic_]

There are some Bettas that have to be limited in their interactions because otherwise they WILL cause harm to themselves, whether by biting off their own tails, blowirng their tails, stress, etc. There are some that don't mind the interaction. And there are even some that HAVE to have it.

Not causing harm to themselves at all!!! What is blowing their tails, BTW? With these two guys (names not yet confirmed ); one is resting and the other one (he's a feisty little bugger!) is just doing his own thing, dancing around etc... I think he misses the flaring...

 

[Kiarra]

Blowing their tails is a term that encompasses several things, but includes the spontaneous separation of cells in the fins, causing them to shred. It's not finrot, but it can definitely look that way sometimes.

At least, that's my understanding of what happens. I've seen it. It looks horrible, but it doesn't seem to bother them much, if at all.

 

[_fish_a_holic_]

because while the filtered, constant temperature is really great for them, having them in a little breeder net really isn't fair.

Is it possible for you to divide off a little section for them?

THAT was my next question. What are some ideas for dividing off a large tank? The tank is 2.5x1x1.2ft (LxWxD). Acrylic screens are really hard to find/expensive here... I bought some plastic canvas today but not sure how to secure it to the tank itself.

(I'm also opening new topic, not bumping, I really need some ideas for dividing up tanks as the others are feeling a little lost in the big tank)

 

[_fish_a_holic_]

) Blowing their tail...
Hey you guys just send me to the beginners section any time I get too stoopid, m'kay! )

Does this look like little black edges at the very edges of their tails/fins? Or is that normal?

 

[Kiarra]

Blowing their fins looks like normal fins...except with chunks missing out of them. No discoloration at all. At least, that's been my experience with it.

 

[_fish_a_holic_]

Is discolouration OK? It's not much, just the very edges.

 

[Kiarra]

Discoloration may just be their normal coloration. Some of mine have fin tips that aren't the same color as the rest of the fins. If the fins are starting to disintegrate at all, however, then it's probably finrot.

As for the vases, they should be fine. Just keep up on your water changes.