Here goes - Tank Two - Low Tech/Walstad style

[NannaLou]

It’s been a week already and I can see the plant growth...

For some reason the red root floaters, that are going mad in my Betta tank are not coping in this tank. I’m going to scoop them all out and I’ve got some Salvinia arriving today, so I’ll see how that goes...

The peace lily seems to flag and go quite limp during the afternoon but it lovely for the rest of the time, it’s got about 4 new flowers growing.

I‘ve also taken a cutting off of the heart philodendron (same family as the Pathos) and have that rooting in water...it is still poisonous to the cat, but as she hasn’t attempted to eat any while she has had easy access to the coffee table I think it should be quite safe ...

I’ll check the water parameters after work ?

 

[NannaLou]

End of week two update:

The plants are growing well, I almost watched the leaves on the Dwarf Tiger Lotus move on Tuesday as it grew about an inch in a couple of hours!! I now have two leaves on top of the water ?

The biggest issue now is algae ? it looks such a mess...
today and just planted...

I‘m going to do another water check and change in a little while and ponder what to do about removing the algae. Otos seemed a very good idea, I likes the look of them and they are nice and small, but not for hard water or new tanks...although with the state of the tank they’d be feasting ?

 

[NannaLou]

Well, despite the terrible look of the tank, the parameters are reasonably good: Ammonia 0, Nitrites 0.25 ppm and Nitrates 5 ppm. Two weeks in and only plants being used to cycle. The soil was providing Ammonia and that has either stopped or the plants have grown enough to absorb it.

I‘ve changed 50% of the water, cleaned as much as I can (I’m a bit of a twit and squeamish with slimy stuff ?).
Although some of the green slimy stuff felt a bit gritty ?...

The lfs have said they can get specific fish in for me, but “it can take a little while“. Do you think I should think about ordering them for the end of June...or leave it another week to see how the water is..?

 

[NannaLou]

Not quite at the end of week three and I’m ready to give up .

The algae is SO bad... so now I have become the owner of 10 MT in the hope they would clear it...apparently they will, but could be producing up to 75 live, baby snails every month or so..? What to buy to get rid of the snails when that happens..?

Watching the tank to see where/what the snails were doing I noticed a “hill” in the substrate, thought, “I don’t remember putting a raised area there...” and then realised it was probably a pocket of trapped air. I used the pointy end of the glass scraper and pierced the hill and huge bubbles of gas came out, mud everywhere!

What to do..?
1. leave it alone - it will settle eventually?
2. strip it all out, just put a standard aquarium sand in the bottom, wash and replant the plants?

The snails will have to go back in the tank, can I put a couple in with my Betta? Or will that just be spreading the stress of a potential snail overload..?

Please share you experience...

 

[EllRog]

I'm assuming the algae is excess nutrients? How long is your light cycle? I'm not expert tbh, I just plant and hope for the best, replace what dies with something easier and waste money I'm quite lucky that my tanks are balanced on the algae front. Not sure if that's because I only use a minimal amount of tap water mixed with RO..

My experience of MTS is that they tend to stay within the substrate and churn it around under the surface. Occasionally see a few ontop of the substrate, but only ever really see them inside the vacuum when siphoning lol. I have them in all of my tanks and quite enjoy the idea of having all sorts of snails tbh, feels like more of a natural ecosystem or something. Anyway I'm waffling. My point is, I'm not sure how much good they'll do for the algae on plants, but I've never noticed an issue with a population takeover.

I've never attempted a capped soil tank, although I've seen plenty do so can't really offer much advice on that front either. To be honest, as I'm writing this, I realised I'm not being very helpful at all, but I've committed to writing too many words to stop waffling. Perhaps when the floaters take off, they'll suck the excess nutrients (if that's the problem) out and the algae won't be as bad. Same as when the stem plants get going.

My advice would be not to panic and give up, let the tank settle. Do a water change if its a bit mucky and try to manually remove as much algae as you can. Algae isn't the end of the world and once the tanks balanced, it'll disappear anyway sometimes the hobby feels alot more stressful than enjoyable and then you'll get another tank and then another just to make it even more difficult for yourself

Overall, it's just teething problems that'll work out. Tank is looking great so far and will only get better, be patient

 

[NannaLou]

I'm assuming the algae is excess nutrients? How long is your light cycle? I'm not expert tbh, I just plant and hope for the best, replace what dies with something easier and waste money I'm quite lucky that my tanks are balanced on the algae front. Not sure if that's because I only use a minimal amount of tap water mixed with RO..

My experience of MTS is that they tend to stay within the substrate and churn it around under the surface. Occasionally see a few ontop of the substrate, but only ever really see them inside the vacuum when siphoning lol. I have them in all of my tanks and quite enjoy the idea of having all sorts of snails tbh, feels like more of a natural ecosystem or something. Anyway I'm waffling. My point is, I'm not sure how much good they'll do for the algae on plants, but I've never noticed an issue with a population takeover.

I've never attempted a capped soil tank, although I've seen plenty do so can't really offer much advice on that front either. To be honest, as I'm writing this, I realised I'm not being very helpful at all, but I've committed to writing too many words to stop waffling. Perhaps when the floaters take off, they'll suck the excess nutrients (if that's the problem) out and the algae won't be as bad. Same as when the stem plants get going.

My advice would be not to panic and give up, let the tank settle. Do a water change if its a bit mucky and try to manually remove as much algae as you can. Algae isn't the end of the world and once the tanks balanced, it'll disappear anyway sometimes the hobby feels alot more stressful than enjoyable and then you'll get another tank and then another just to make it even more difficult for yourself

Overall, it's just teething problems that'll work out. Tank is looking great so far and will only get better, be patient

Thank you for for very detailed reply

I think the algae is an overload of nutrients - everything is growing like mad! I don’t have artificial lights, the tank sits under a velux window and I’m keeping the translucent shade down to stop the very bright light.

I’m glad to hear your experience with the snails - perhaps I won’t be lurching from one disaster to another...

I’ll give it a good clean out at the weekend and see what can be cleaned up; at least this time I understand the cycling process and don’t have to worry about fish getting caught up in all the drama!

And, I’ve gone from one 25ltr tank for my Betta, to this second tank (54ltrs) which will home Endlers....and I’m already thinking about an even bigger tank in a cabinet for the front room (who needs a tv when you have fish? ) because I’ve been inspired by some beautiful, more minimalist (beautifully places wood, rocks and a few plants) tanks on this site.

I have to be very strict with myself though, I won’t start anything else until this one is all “finished” or I’d have partially filled tanks everywhere

 

[NannaLou]

Well, I’m not sure what’s happened but after the exploding substrate the water seems to be looking clearer (still plenty of algae but that doesn’t seem as bad) and I’ve tested the water and am now at Ammonia 0 and Nitrites at 0.

I‘m going to do another ‘test’ by adding ammonia, and when using this method for a Betta I was advised to dose to 1 ppm.

@Essjay - will this ammonia level be the same for 18 male Endlers...or will it be higher..?

Many thanks

 

[Essjay]

I would use more ammonia this time. Try 2 ppm.

 

[NannaLou]

I would use more ammonia this time. Try 2 ppm.

Thank you

 

[NannaLou]

@Essjay what a faff this has turned into, and now I’m confused about the cycle (again)!

I’ve totally replanted the tank and just have sand now…the soil went horribly wrong. Plants are growing like mad, submerged, floating and emergent. The plants are clearing 2 ppm of ammonia in 18 hours but I can’t get the nitrites to clear. Today, again, they are sitting between 0.25 and 0.5 ppm at the 24 hour mark.

If the plants “eat” ammonia, where is the Nitrite coming from..? How can I speed up the process of removing this..? No fish yet, but they are on order (18-24 male Blue Star Endler’s) and I haven’t been given a time frame for them arriving… getting stressed

 

[Essjay]

Has the nitrite level remained constant or has it gone up?

If the plants aren't removing quite all the ammonia, bacteria will deal with the left overs and turn it into nitrite. Most plants don't take up nitrite so that will stay in the water until bacteria have grown to remove it. It sounds as though you do have some ammonia eaters but not enough nitrite eaters yet.

You could try a big water change to remove the nitrite then add 1 ppm ammonia and see if the plants can remove all of that. Then if they can, step up to 2ppm again.

 

[NannaLou]

There’s no filter, I’m relying on the plants to remove the ammonia and nitrites. They do clear, I haven’t checked them in small time increments, but it is clear at the 48 hr mark. I’ve repeated this step about four times now.
The fact that the ammonia is clearing so well (2ppm in 18 hours) is what is causing my confusion… if the ammonia has gone, where have the nitrites come from..? It sounds as if the plants take up the ammonia without turning them into nitrites first..?

 

[Essjay]

Plants turn ammonia into protein not nitrite. So the nitrite can only be coming from ammonia by the action of ammonia eating bacteria.

The bacteria will grow on any and every surface in the tank, whether there is a filter or not. At first they grow mainly in the filter when there is one as that is where the water is flowing constantly bringing food and oxygen. But in a mature tank, it is possible for bacteria growing elsewhere to be the main colonies. Without a filter, they will grow on other surfaces from the start.

 

[NannaLou]

Plants turn ammonia into protein not nitrite. So the nitrite can only be coming from ammonia by the action of ammonia eating bacteria.

The bacteria will grow on any and every surface in the tank, whether there is a filter or not. At first they grow mainly in the filter when there is one as that is where the water is flowing constantly bringing food and oxygen. But in a mature tank, it is possible for bacteria growing elsewhere to be the main colonies. Without a filter, they will grow on other surfaces from the start.

So, would it help if I added some bacterial starter to boost the levels in the tank..? I haven’t done that this time as there is no filter and I thought the filter is where the bacteria were …

 

[Essjay]

That's where they usually are in a new tank, but after a few years they are everywhere. With no filter, they have to grow everywhere from the start.

If you have a bacterial starter you may as well use it.
Or remove the nitrite with a water change and add less ammonia until the plants are bigger.