The Start Orf A New Begining!

[waterdrop]

Yes, I actually agree with this, I think they (water changes) are more and more effective the later you can wait. There seem to be two reasons why we've gotten in to recommending them sometimes in the second phase (the nitrite spike phase) and the two are separate from each other. One, and I think its been around a while, is just the thing that lowering nitrites down into a range where the nitrite test can show movement instead of being above its max, is a way to appease some fishless cyclers who are going crazy to know if anything is happening. The second reason came from Hovanec, either some things he said here on the forum this past summer or from some of his papers. It was that he thought very high nitrates and/or nitrites could have a slowing effect on N-Bac growth. There was not a lot of specificity to it but if you've ever read his papers, you know this guy knows a -lot- about the details of how these bacteria grow.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[Tuppers]

Day 17: Fishless Cycle on 16G/60L - 90% Waterchange @ 13:30 hrs

tested my tap water and got:

PH 7.4
Ammonia 0.0-0.25 (trace amounts I would say very close to 0.0 but not quite!)
Nitrite 0.0
Nitrate 0.0 - 5.0

Temp 27C (thermostat altered but having a few problems in keeping the water around 29C or lower!)
PH 7.4
Ammonia 0.0-0.25 (trace amounts I would say very close to 0.0 but not quite!)
Nitrite 0.0
Nitrate 5-10
dKH 12.2

I hope this sorts its self out now!! I think I am going crazy like WD has said just cant see anything happening!! It seems my previous test were lieing when it came to ammonia and nitrates in the tap water!! Not tested the KH of the tap water will do later!

Should I add some baking soda to raise the PH or with the KH being so high it should be ok?

 

[Tuppers]

Day 18: Fishless Cycle on 16G/60L - just interested tests!! 6 hours before 24 hour ones are due

This morning @ 11:10 hrs

PH 7.4
Ammonia 0.25 (not sure about this, I guess the waterchange will only kick in after a few days? Also my thermometer reads 30C but no way is the water that warm off hunting for a new one later today!)
Nitrite 1.0 (but like above I guess the water change will kick in soon! I HOPE!!!)
Nitrate 10.0
dKH not tested

Well we shall see, i was wondering as I have a Nutrafin CO2 thing in the tank, I have been reading and this is what is probably helping the PH lower its self! Should I leave it or take it out? Sorry I didnt mention it earlier!!

 

[waterdrop]

Assuming you are doing everything right, your results look pretty good to me. You did a big water change, added some ammonia and very quickly your A-Bacs showed evidence of having produced a bunch of nitrites(NO2) and then some N-Bacs must have taken that and quickly started producing some nitrates(NO3.)

You certainly don't need any baking soda as your KH is sky high already. When you do a KH test, you slowly drip the reagent into your vial of tank water and each drop turns light blue, right? And eventually when you get way out to the 12th drop, it turns pale yellow, right? That would be how a test went that returned a reading of KH=12.

You seem overly worried about your temperature, considering how steady its been kept. Never bad to check your thermometer with another one but you're probably ok.

I can't remember what part of what "phase" of fishless cycling we think you're in (we've filled up the thread with so much chat!) but it can't be bad with all the signs of processing we've got going on. My own fishless cycling results did all kinds of seemingly crazy things, but I was thinking this weekend when I tested and did my weekend clean that now every time I test, those ammonia and nitrite results are sitting there on zero and my nitrate now just sits at 10. This will happen to you too eventually.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[rabbut]

Looks to me like the processing times have taken a temerary steap back, but should recover after the waterchange. It is better than processing grinding to a total halt like it would have if you haden't waterchanged after the small slow-down

CO2 can lower the pH very easily, usualy by about 0.8-1.5 of a point, depending on the starting pH and KH readings

HTH
Rabbut

 

[Tuppers]

Day 18: Fishless Cycle on 16G/60L - 24 Hour test

This evening @ 20:10 hrs

Temp 30-31C (still cant keep it down! doesnt feel that warm either! even when i have set my thermometer at 24C now! wondering if either thermom or heater are not working prop! well I have a new heater on the way for signing up to a mag! so will test that! and get a new thermom just to double check!)
PH 7.4
Ammonia 0.00
Nitrite 0.0
Nitrate 5.0-10.0
dKH not tested

Well we shall see, i hope that the ammonia and nitrites drop after 24 hours! I know I have done the tests a little after the 24 hour mark more like 27 hour mark but I am trying to move the 24 hour add time for the ammonia to fit in with my shifts! Seems to be working well! 2.ml added at test time

Ammonia was tested @ 21:00 hrs and ammonia @ 4ppm!

 

[waterdrop]

So you're saying it took 27 hours, but 5ppm of ammonia was dropped to zero ammonia and zero nitrite?

~~waterdrop~~

 

[Tuppers]

Day 19: Fishless Cycle on 16G/60L - 12 Hour test

This morning @ 08:10 hrs

Temp 29.5C
PH 7.4
Ammonia 0.50
Nitrite 5.0
Nitrate 40
dKH not tested

For WD the nitrites dropped to 0 after 27 hrs after ammonia was upped to 4ppm.

The tests this morning seem to have shown a larger production of Nitrites and Nitrates! Here we go again!!

 

[waterdrop]

Day 19: Fishless Cycle on 16G/60L - 12 Hour test

This morning @ 08:10 hrs

Temp 29.5C
PH 7.4
Ammonia 0.50
Nitrite 5.0
Nitrate 40
dKH not tested

For WD the nitrites dropped to 0 after 27 hrs after ammonia was upped to 4ppm.

The tests this morning seem to have shown a larger production of Nitrites and Nitrates! Here we go again!!

So for this one:
1) Ammonia dropped from 4ppm to 0.50ppm in about 12 hours.
2) Nitrite(NO2) went up from the zero from yesterday, to full 5.0 reading, in the 12 hours.
3) Nitrate(NO3) appeared to go up.

If this is correct, it seems to confirm that you are getting into the last bit where both bacterial populations are there and doing good work and just need to get even bigger to make the drops happen in 12 hours. Don't be surprised if the N-Bacs try your patience, as they often start dropping to zero in less than 24 hours, getting you excited, but then seem to take forever to be able to drop to zero in the 12 hours.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[Tuppers]

Day 19: Fishless Cycle on 16G/60L - 24 Hour test

Last Night @ 23:10 hrs

Temp 29.5C
PH 7.4
Ammonia 0.00
Nitrite 0.0
Nitrate 10 (not sure it was dark so no real proper light to use bar artificial I think it was 10 ppm but could of been upto 40 ppm)
dKH not tested

Well the little ones seem to be doing their job! Like WD says just need to get them to do it quicker!!

Tested this morning too for an almost 12 hour test 10:10 hrs

Temp 29.5C
PH 7.4
Ammonia 0.5-1.0
Nitrite 5.0
Nitrate 40
dKH not tested

Hopefully will be back on time to give a closer reading to the 24 hours! But then again a job always comes in just at the EOT!!

See you all tomorrow when I post tonights readings!!

Again wanted to say thanks for all the advice!

 

[Miss Wiggle]

do you mean 5.0 for nitrite, or 0.5??

 

[Tuppers]

I meant 5.0 for nitrite. I will post in a bit the mornig and last night nights results.

 

[Tuppers]

Day 20: Fishless Cycle on 16G/60L - 24 Hour test

Last Night @ 23:10 hrs

Temp 29.5C
PH 7.4
Ammonia 0.00
Nitrite 0.0-0.25 (bearing in mind this was nearly bang on 24 hours and not 27 like the other days so I guess its nearly at 24 hours for the process of the 2.5ml I add every day)
Nitrate 10-20
dKH not tested

Tested this morning too for an almost 12 hour test 10:10 hrs

Temp 29.5C
PH 7.4
Ammonia 0.5
Nitrite 5.0
Nitrate 40 (not sure about this reading very close to but I would say a little more than 40 maybe!)
dKH not tested

Hopefully will be back on time again to give a reading near to the 24 hours to see if the N-Bacs are sorting themselves out in 24 hours or not!!

See you all tomorrow when I post tonights readings!!

I am off tomorrow and friday back on at the weekend, would it be alright to add the ammonia a couple of hours earlier each day to get the 24 hour mark down to around 19:00 i.e. 22:00 tomorrow night then say 21:00 hrs Friday with a view to adding the ammonia @ 20:00 hrs on Saturday, then fianlly 19:00 on Sunday? as this will help with my early shifts Sat-Tue?? also with me being off pretty much after this apart from a couple of nights the time will remain the same for around 6 weeks.

 

[rabbut]

Should be mine to do that IMO

 

[Tuppers]

Day 21: Fishless Cycle on 16G/60L - 24 Hour test

Last Night @ 23:10 hrs

Temp 29.5C
PH 7.0 (but a little unsure!!)
Ammonia 0.00
Nitrite 0.0 (bearing in mind this was nearly bang on 24 hours!)
Nitrate 20-40
dKH not tested

Tested this morning too for an almost 12 hour test 10:30 hrs

Temp 29.5C
PH 6.8-7.0
Ammonia 0.5
Nitrite 5.0
Nitrate 40
dKH 10.8

Well my only concern is the PH dropping! Should I ignore this for now?