Prime Seachem - does it doesn't it work

[Lynnzer]

Just been browsing the reef topics on youtube about control of water parameters. I see some clips that suggest, in fact make positive comments about Seachem Prime taking the toxicity out of ammonia and nitrite in the water. Not remove it, just neutralise the toxicity.
The addition of extra large dose is supposed to use as a safequard when the ammonia level becomes rather high.
Has anyone done this? Does it work, and how does the reduced/removed toxicity affect the fish?
Obviously a water change is always the best but it's not always possible in marine tanks as the LFS is miles away and I can't make my own mix.

 

[Essjay]

Seachem claim that Prime detoxifies both ammonia and nitrite for something like 24 to 36 hours, after which time they become toxic again. The idea is that ammonia and nitrite in tap water is rendered non-toxic while the bacteria remove it, and by the time the detoxification period ends, the bacteria should have removed it all. Prime is not intended as a treatment to be added to a tank other than to treat new water at a water change.

Seachem won't say what's in Prime, but it is something of a chemical soup. I know little about marine tanks, but I am led to believe the fish etc are more sensitive to chemicals than in freshwater tanks. If this is true, I would be wary of adding Prime even to treat new water change water in a marine tank.
A marine expert like @Donya should be able to confirm if it is safe to overdose Prime in a marine tank.

 

[Donya]

Has anyone done this? Does it work, and how does the reduced/removed toxicity affect the fish?

Yes. Prime was an essential tool I've used in moving the contents of two 20gal marine tanks in a multi-day drive with everyone in coolers and then having to wait several days after that with everything for the tanks to be set up again with no RO unit hooked up yet (and thus minimal access to new water). It's a useful tool for emergencies where there is a massive ammonia dump into the water or a big hit to the biological filtration when a water change isn't an option for whatever reason. In my case, one of those emergencies was that my tub of LR and filter media got cooked in transit, so it wasn't safe to add to the tank for ages and I had to start over my other filters with brand new media.

Dont' dump it right on an animal of course, and be sure to add it to an area of active flow. Add it slowly. If the water volume is small like in my moving cooler situation, a drop at a time right into the area of highest water movement and let it dissolve. Add an airstone during treatment if you can; surface aggitation is very important for usage of it as anything but a basic water conditions. And then you just kind of have to trust that the amount you calculated to add is doing the thing - the test kit won't respond right away, so it will look like it's doing nothing but I have seen visible difference in animal behavior that suggests otherwise. Fish are the most obvious indicator and they should show less gill reddening and should generally behave more normally if it's working. Crustaceans and snails won't show much change, nor will corals (which respond very slowly to changes anyway). With API ammonia and nitrite kits, typically the color disappears in the test kit eventually, but only if you let it sit for a lot longer than you're supposed to according to the instructions (like hours), while a control tube of untreated water will retain its color over the same length of time.

I have used Prime on tanks with fish, Crustaceans, snails, Echinoderms, and various types of corals - no ill effects to the animals by dosing based on the bottle's instructions. However, I do try to avoid its usage because it is only a temporary solution. When I had to do a shorter 1-day move and had some larger tubs to set everything up in, I chose to stock up on spare water and completely avoided usage of Prime (but I also had mostly functional LR since it didn't get cooked that time).

 

[jaylach]

I use prime but just for chlorine and chlorimide. I've done both salt and fresh tanks and, if properly cycled, nothing more should be needed.

 

[Alice B]

Just been browsing the reef topics on youtube about control of water parameters. I see some clips that suggest, in fact make positive comments about Seachem Prime taking the toxicity out of ammonia and nitrite in the water. Not remove it, just neutralise the toxicity.
The addition of extra large dose is supposed to use as a safequard when the ammonia level becomes rather high.
Has anyone done this? Does it work, and how does the reduced/removed toxicity affect the fish?
Obviously a water change is always the best but it's not always possible in marine tanks as the LFS is miles away and I can't make my own mix.

I recommend a DI unit or an RO unit and a nice bucket of salt. You can't use zeolite in saltwater, it doesn't work. ChemiPure may not be around anymore, that is what my LFS back in the 90s suggested after a power outage, but since I did the water change instead I can't swear by it. I've heard a lot about Prime but I don't use it, and I don't use StressZyme and I don't use AmmoLock.

 

[Donya]

I use prime but just for chlorine and chlorimide. I've done both salt and fresh tanks and, if properly cycled, nothing more should be needed.

OP can correct me if I'm wrong, but I think what's in question here is not whether to use it as a regular regime dosing to a healthy, cycled tank but rather what can be used when something goes wrong in a sw tank and the cycle/filtration/LR isn't keeping up when there is little/no spare water with which to do WCs. Things can easily go wrong in cycled systems that result in ammonia/nitrite spikes.

 

[Donya]

ChemiPure may not be around anymore

Haven't used it personally but looks like it's still on Amazon? There's also Purigen which I have used - expensive, though can supposedly be "recharged" with bleach (which would then have to be detoxified from the media with something else). Never tried that since I really hate working with bleach.

 

[Alice B]

I don't know how good chemi-pure is. Only had a 0.5 ammonia spike, and water change and getting everything working again fixed it. I gave up my reef in 2001 when I moved so its been a while

 

[Lynnzer]

OP can correct me if I'm wrong, but I think what's in question here is not whether to use it as a regular regime dosing to a healthy, cycled tank but rather what can be used when something goes wrong in a sw tank and the cycle/filtration/LR isn't keeping up when there is little/no spare water with which to do WCs. Things can easily go wrong in cycled systems that result in ammonia/nitrite spikes.

Exactly that. And of course, what effect would it have on the fish over a week or so.

 

[strangeworld2002]

I've been doing a fish in cycle with 4 guppies using Seachem Prime and Seachem Stability dosed daily, as some people are suggesting is a good way of cycling a tank and keeping the fish safe BUT after observing the fish and speaking to people on here its clear that Prime is troublesome. I have always done fish in cycles on my tanks but as I was out of the hobby for about 10 years I thought I would do some research and see what the current tricks are and I stumbled upon the Prime and Stability method as suggested by some Youtubers. The stability seems fine although it is debatable whether it does anything.

Anyway back to Prime, my observations now are how it deals with oxygen and the overall concern about how long it can deplete oxygen or bind compounds for. Seachem say up to 48 hours, saying up to is always a problem because when do you re-dose?, some people say 24 hours and there is the element of the bottle saying it can be used safely up to 5x times the recommended dose in an emergency but again how long is it active for? no one seems to know.

I had been dosing 1 cap of prime every day to detoxify approx 1ppm of ammonia however 1 cap is for 250l, I have 100l so I should in theory have used only half a cap or less but as I thought I had plenty of aeration I went with it. Over the last 24 hours my guppies have not been as active and have been spending more time near the top although they do still swim around and go down to the bottom etc. I have good flow and have a diffuser fitted with an air pump, they are also eating but not as much so I have stopped with the Prime as recommended to do so by people on here and I have to say that initial thoughts are they are right, I think it has a "totting up" effect to be honest as my fish were absolutely fine for about a week before their behavior changed.

If it binds compounds for up to 48 hours as suggested by Seachem then it can take oxygen too in my opinion for the same amount of time, again Seachem say the oxygen depletion is a short lived side effect lasting no more than an hour but is it, in my opinion if something is "active" in the water for up to 48 hours then it is constantly depleting oxygen and if you keep re-dosing daily like I have been doing then it is clear what is going to happen, and that is only with slightly over the recommended dose I dread to think what would happen if you trusted their 5x times the recommended dose in an emergency.

In closing I do think it detoxifies Ammonia/Nitrite but as it depletes Oxygen too for an undetermined period of time it can't be trusted really.

Also as a separate area of concern is I spilled some on an item of clothing and it has bleached it?? which is very worrying.

 

[Oxstock]

I've been doing a fish in cycle with 4 guppies using Seachem Prime and Seachem Stability dosed daily, as some people are suggesting is a good way of cycling a tank and keeping the fish safe BUT after observing the fish and speaking to people on here its clear that Prime is troublesome. I have always done fish in cycles on my tanks but as I was out of the hobby for about 10 years I thought I would do some research and see what the current tricks are and I stumbled upon the Prime and Stability method as suggested by some Youtubers. The stability seems fine although it is debatable whether it does anything.

Anyway back to Prime, my observations now are how it deals with oxygen and the overall concern about how long it can deplete oxygen or bind compounds for. Seachem say up to 48 hours, saying up to is always a problem because when do you re-dose?, some people say 24 hours and there is the element of the bottle saying it can be used safely up to 5x times the recommended dose in an emergency but again how long is it active for? no one seems to know.

I had been dosing 1 cap of prime every day to detoxify approx 1ppm of ammonia however 1 cap is for 250l, I have 100l so I should in theory have used only half a cap or less but as I thought I had plenty of aeration I went with it. Over the last 24 hours my guppies have not been as active and have been spending more time near the top although they do still swim around and go down to the bottom etc. I have good flow and have a diffuser fitted with an air pump, they are also eating but not as much so I have stopped with the Prime as recommended to do so by people on here and I have to say that initial thoughts are they are right, I think it has a "totting up" effect to be honest as my fish were absolutely fine for about a week before their behavior changed.

If it binds compounds for up to 48 hours as suggested by Seachem then it can take oxygen too in my opinion for the same amount of time, again Seachem say the oxygen depletion is a short lived side effect lasting no more than an hour but is it, in my opinion if something is "active" in the water for up to 48 hours then it is constantly depleting oxygen and if you keep re-dosing daily like I have been doing then it is clear what is going to happen, and that is only with slightly over the recommended dose I dread to think what would happen if you trusted their 5x times the recommended dose in an emergency.

In closing I do think it detoxifies Ammonia/Nitrite but as it depletes Oxygen too for an undetermined period of time it can't be trusted really.

Also as a separate area of concern is I spilled some on an item of clothing and it has bleached it?? which is very worrying.

They say it doesn’t bind oxygen unless it’s grossly overdosed.

Otherwise it will not. Nitrites also deplete oxygen for the fish so I guess it’s a case of pick your weapon.

 

[Alice B]

I choose 5 feeder guppies, a simple chlorine remover, and a little bit of FritzZyme 7 or turbo to get the thing started. After that feed lightly, keep pumps or filter going ( I use U/G), no water changes, takes about a month

 

[jaylach]

I choose 5 feeder guppies, a simple chlorine remover, and a little bit of FritzZyme 7 or turbo to get the thing started. After that feed lightly, keep pumps or filter going ( I use U/G), no water changes, takes about a month

Sigh, as the Moody Blues song title goes,"Days of Future Past" I so much wish I had a good aquatics store like I had in Ohio and Texas! Buy a tank and be given live substrate to cycle the tank right away. The one in Ohio would even 'rent' you damsels and and blow fish along with some anemones to get a marine tank going. They would then buy back the starter fish at full price with the cost applied to the fish you actually wanted. Sadly it is unlikely that you will find such a store these days.

 

[Alice B]

I know. But I raise my own guppies and I never shut all my tanks down at once. I am culturing a pair of sponge filters in the 40 long right now, although I am not sure what for

 

[strangeworld2002]

They say it doesn’t bind oxygen unless it’s grossly overdosed.

Otherwise it will not. Nitrites also deplete oxygen for the fish so I guess it’s a case of pick your weapon.

They do say that but they also say this effect will only last an hour. In my experience this is not true and if anything it accumulates. I think its dangerous and should only ever be used to treat new water. I won't add it for any other reason now even though they say you can add it to detoxify ammonia in the event of a spike. Stick with water changes.