I just really dont know where the fin rot came from. because the mollies were fine before I put the tetras in and now they too have fin rot. It came in a matter of days. how is that? also I am now seeing that 1 of the mollys is scratching on the bottom (sign of ick or velvet). why is it that the fish were fine until the tetras were introduced?
New Member With A Huge Problem. Help Me!
- Thread starter B Rolls
- Start date
CezzaXV
Fish Gatherer
- Joined
- Sep 1, 2011
- Messages
- 2,662
- Reaction score
- 0
I know this wasn't aimed at me but I don't think it got answered so I'll tell you how I maintain my tank to hopefully give you an idea of how normal tank maintenance works.
I change my water twice a week. Most people only change it once a week but I'm a little on the overstocked side so I prefer to do it twice weekly. I have a 60 litre tank, so I normally change 2-3 10L buckets (30-50%, again, more than most people do or is necessary under normal circumstances). I have a siphon hose which I use to remove the water (and also remove any poop that's built up on the sand) into the buckets then I just pour it away. I use water from the tap to refill the tank, using my finger to gauge whether it's roughly the same temperature (it doesn't have to be exact), then add my dechlorinator and siphon the water back in (I dont just pour it as the difference in water may harm my fish if it's just poured in all at once and I dont want to disturb my substrate). As Fluttermoth said, I turn off my filter and heater off while this is happening to make sure they're not running dry, but don't be a numpty like I was yesterday and forget to turn them back on again! I also have a lot of live plants in my tank so I dose liquid fertiliser with my water changes.
Every now and then I'll open up my filter and check there aren't any blockages or anything going wrong. I dont have a set schedule for this, I do it maybe once every 1-2 months.
Now my tank is cycled, I don't need to test my water all the time, it's more of a when I can be bothered kind of thing or when I suspect there's something wrong in my tank!
I also have a notebook where I write down everything that goes on in my tank. It started off as a journal when I was cycling but I use it now to record test readings, any notable occasions like when I get new fish, any fish gets sick, when my bamboo shrimp sheds his skin etc etc.
Nobody here is trying to have a flame war, but it is a little true that if you don't have easy access to clean water, fishkeeping might not have been the best hobby for you. It's doable though, as long as you're prepared to put the work in. We see a lot of people get angry here because they don't like being told they're doing things wrong, but at the end of the day we have nothing to gain from telling you so and we only have the best interests of your fish at heart.
You can never be sure where it came from. A few weeks in ammonia will cause fin rot to any fish. Some are more succeptable to others and will get it faster. Fish will scratch themselves of objects, bottom, etc..(flashing) when there is an irritant in the water, or themselves. This again is more than likely the ammonia level, but keep an eye on them as they can develop any disease since their immune system is out of the window.
I sometimes think that there is more info written for fish behaviour with ick and other diseases, then ammonia poisoning. It should be the other way round. If fish are only flashing and you can't see spots, then it's not ick, but probably your ammonia is irritating the hell out of them.
Something like 90% of all fish diseases I see are caused by poor water quality.
The spores that cause fungus are all around us and in our tanks all the time. In healthy fish, the slime coat is thick enough that the fin rot fungus can't get a grip, but when the fish are ill or stressed, the slime coat becomes thinner, and that gives the fungus a chance to get a foothold.
Scratching can be a symptom of ich or velvet, but it can also be caused by ammonia irritating the fish's gills.
The reason the problems didn't start until you added the tetras is that they added to the bioload, produced extra ammonia and caused the fish to become ill. Mollies are, in general, much harder than tetras, so it wasn't until the tetras were added that the ammonia became too much for the mollies to cope with.
Sorry, can't type so fast...One of my tanks is actually the same size as yours. I have 2 filters with total flow of 1800 litres an hour, and an air bubbler. The inhabitants are guppies, platies and corydoras. I change the water once a week about 40-50%. I siphon the gravel at different places everytime, but don't bother around the plants, just the open areas. Sometimes I move the driftwood pieces and siphon under them, but that's maybe once a month. I mix the water with water from a kettle to get it to the same temperature and use Api tap safe. To be really honest, even if I skipped a weak of water change, I wouldn't notice it visually, but I like to keep the nitrates as low as possible, and the corydoras also go crazy happy after a water change.
Trick is not to overfeed. I do feed twice a day in this tank at the moment, as I have guppy and platy fry in it as well, but normally once a day a flake each(their stomach is as small as their eye).
That's it really. Can't think of anything else.
I really am having trouble because It really seems that me adding those new fish caused an infection. I have had another little tank with 4 tiger barbs in it. I had them in this tank 4 about a month and a half, then i gave them to my brother who I know doesn't even look at them and they have lived since I gave them to him. I honestly don't even think he changes the water and they have lived for 6 months with no problems. and he only lives down the road from me. I bought those fish at the same store I got these infected tetras. He also only ran the tank for one day before he put the barbs in. I just dont know how those can live in his tank which is way worse than mine, and my fish cant even live a month
One of my tanks is actually the same size as yours. I have 2 filters with total flow of 1800 litres an hour, and an air bubbler. The inhabitants are guppies, platies and corydoras. I change the water once a week about 40-50%. I siphon the gravel at different places everytime, but don't bother around the plants, just the open areas. Sometimes I move the driftwood pieces and siphon under them, but that's maybe once a month. I mix the water with water from a kettle to get it to the same temperature and use Api tap safe. To be really honest, even if I skipped a weak of water change, I wouldn't notice it visually, but I like to keep the nitrates as low as possible, and the corydoras also go crazy happy after a water change.
Trick is not to overfeed. I do feed twice a day in this tank at the moment, as I have guppy and platy fry in it as well, but normally once a day a flake each(their stomach is as small as their eye).
That's it really. Can't think of anything else.
Not everyone is as lucky as your brother. Browse a little bit around this forum and would find out yourself.
Even if the neons did bring the disease, adding them to a tank full of ammonia and probably other toxins did not help as you can see. I think you don't realise the effects and side effects of ammonia and non-cycled tank.
If you do want to keep fish as your brother does, then there is no point asking for advise on a fish forum from people that will tell you otherwise. If you want to buy another medication, then the fish store will certainly be willing to sell you a whole range, that probably also treats ear infection in horses (only joking mate
)Also if you remember from my 1st story I had a first batch of tetras then after two only two days they got fin rot. The tank was only like 4 days old. I don't even think the ammonia built up yet and they still got it. These tetras I have now were from the same tanks as the last ones that I got last time. Also the last time I filled it with tap water. I really think the tetras had something because if you know Petco isn't the best at keeping fish.
The filter in the tiger barb tank is probably cycled, especially if he never cleans it out or changes the cartridges.
That works to your advantage, as if you can get a 1/4 of his media and add it to your filter that'll give you a bacterial colony to seed your filter, and it'll soon expand in size.
Fishkeeping is an art as well as a science, and sometimes people do everything wrong and get away with it. But his fish won't live long, happy or healthy lives; the nitrate and other undesirable substances will build and build until the fish die.
That works to your advantage, as if you can get a 1/4 of his media and add it to your filter that'll give you a bacterial colony to seed your filter, and it'll soon expand in size.
Fishkeeping is an art as well as a science, and sometimes people do everything wrong and get away with it. But his fish won't live long, happy or healthy lives; the nitrate and other undesirable substances will build and build until the fish die.
CezzaXV
Fish Gatherer
- Joined
- Sep 1, 2011
- Messages
- 2,662
- Reaction score
- 0
It's possible they did have something beforehand, yes. It's also possible that they were just stressed, both from poor conditions in the store and the stress of moving home. Then they go into an uncycled tank and the ammonia was definitely rising, whether it was quickly or slowly, and it tipped them over the edge into disease. Fish can be quite delicate - if the conditions aren't right for them they get stressed and so very susceptible to disease.
So where am I at, If I just leave them, they will certainly die. If I have to go get water from the spring they could die in the time it takes to go get it and warm it up overnight. If I fill it with tap water I might poison them even more. They have something that is causing scratching so if I water change it will be hard to medicate that. What should I do out of my options?
How does the ammonia even get there because the 1st time I didn't add stress coat. Granted it wasnt cycled but I just want to know what I should do.
Ammonia can build up very, very quickly; easily to lethal levels in 24 hours.
Of course, it's possible that the tetras were carrying something, but it's not just the tetras you've had problems with, is it? It's lots of different fish and the chances of all of them coming from 'bad batches' is vanishingly small, even from a large chain store.
Anyway, even if the tetras did introduce fin rot, the best treatment is still keeping the water in tip top condition. Most fish heal very well and quickly once conditions are right.
CezzaXV
Fish Gatherer
- Joined
- Sep 1, 2011
- Messages
- 2,662
- Reaction score
- 0
Ammonia is your problem. You definitely have ammonia and you definitely need to get rid of it.
If you wait til you get the spring water, they might die. They'll definitely be recieving short and long term damage from the ammonia in the water. This will cause disease and/or death.
If you change the water with the tap water, you'll definitely be able to get rid of the ammonia, which is a massive plus. You might poison them, it's possible, but this is a possibility instead of the definite ammonia poisoning if you don't change the water.
The something that's causing them to scratch is the ammonia, whether this is the direct result of ammonia poisoning or a disease they've caught because their immune system isn't working because of the ammonia. Ammonia is your enemy, and you need to make sure your fish spend as little time in contact with it as possible.
It's not hard to medicate before or after water changes, that makes no difference. As Cezza says, you might poison them, but this is a possibility instead of the definite ammonia poisoning if you don't change the water. It's most likely the ammnoia that's causing the scratching anyway.
Fish excrete ammonia constantly; mostly in their poo and pee, but also from their gills as a side effect of respiration.
Do the water change, then get round to your brother's house and get some of his media
Similar threads
Most reactions
-
480 -
330 -
233 -
218 -
210 -
180 -
172 -
161 -
137 -
131 -
126 -
106 -
102 -
89 -
77