listlessness... getting worse... tips please

[eudielynn]

The leaves themselves are better than the extract in my opinion, but some pet stores do carry the extract, if you didn't want to wait for the leaves. Petsmart is one that carries it. I'd just call around. My LFS started ordering it for me, but they have had enough people ask for it to stock it now. Also, I'd leave the gravel out while your treating him so it will be easier to check his waste, but I'd still put a plant or hidey place in there for him to see if it made him feel more secure.

 

[BettaMomma]

Poor boy.
That's just exactly what my Sammy looks like and I can NOT figure out what is ailing him either.

I think it's a very good idea for you to pick up the maracyn. I'd go full bore with both meds - dose him with both Maracyn 2 (yep, you can treat again) and Maracyn at the same time.

With columnaris, you can see one (or many) of a long list of things happening - including moldy looking patches on the head or back that spread VERY fast, or long stringy things that hang off the fins. The gills can also start to become puffy and swollen. I don't really see any of these on this little guy, though. I think he's got something bacterial going on inside that he just can't shake.

M2 can treat columnaris - I've heard of ppl being successful in treating with either M or M2. But I think you'd be best off treating with both. The IAL could and would help him too, I think.

I'd put the plant in there - or if you're going shopping today and can pick up a live plant like hornwort or cabomba and then don't anchor it down - float it so he has a nice soft place to beach himself up top he'd be happy. He can then sit near the top and conserve his energy by not having to swim all the way up to the top each time he needs a breath.

Give those meds a try and keep us posted. You're doing everything you can for him, and he is still hanging in there!

 

[crankwalk]

Thank you so much everyone for all your help and advice. The IAL sounds like a good plan, I will see if I can get my hands on some, preferably actual leaves over the extract as recommended.

As far as the meds, tonight I will do a 100% water change and try both M1 and M2 simulatenaously as it seems to be safe to use both at once. I don't think he can get any more stressed than he is now so maybe the combo will help. I also have found another way to dose, what do you all think of this:

Dissolve one tablet in 10 teaspoons of water. Then add one teaspoon per gallon of the dosage as directed (i.e. for M2, two teaspoons first day, one teaspoon for day 2-5). I have plastic measuring spoons with the exact teaspoon amount so there's no guessing involved. Seems easier than trying to cut up the little tabs with a knife.

BettaMomma I will try to find him a plant that I can put in there so he has something else in his tank. I will check out those two types that you recommended. They should be okay in a non circulating / non filtered tank for a couple of days correct? I wouldn't want them changing the properties of the water in case the plants start dying or decaying or something. I've never had experience with live plants, I guess I should do a little research

Will keep up the posts! Thanks!

 

[SRC]

I would just buy some silk plants. For $3 you can get a 3 pack of plants form Wal-mart. They aren't the "prettiest" plants around..but for what you're doing..they would suffice. It's 3 different types as well..so he could choose whichever he prefered to rest on. Might coudl even put them close together and give him a place to "hide" if he so chose.

 

[crankwalk]

That also, is an idea. Silk plants would probably float away if not anchored by gravel so i'd have to find a way to keep them down since I dont' plan to use gravel yet. I wish they had suction cups! Thanks

 

[SRC]

These I am talking about..have weighted bases..they are not the type with the gravel tray. They require no gravel.

 

[BettaMomma]

Crank - you can't do that with the meds, unfortunately - they lose their effectiveness after 24 hours in the water which is why you have to keep redosing. You'll want to keep them dry until you are ready to put them into the tank.

Those silk plants will be fine - but if you get the cabomba or hornwort it will float right up at the top and he can lay in it and just tip his nose up to get breaths. Several of my gravely ill fish really appreciated having one in his tank. If your water level is about the same as the top of the silk plants, that would work too.

And the live plants will do nothing harmful to your water quality. In fact, it will help the quality a tad bit. They should be just fine in an unfiltered tank for several days.

 

[crankwalk]

Great ideas everyone thanks. I like the weighted plant, I didn't know there were some made like that. SRC are those the wal-mart type? I'll drop in and have a look-see.

Also as far as the live plant goes, that's still a possibility. I guess I'll decide when I get to the store.

And thank you BettaMomma for that tip on the dosing. I got that info straight from

http/www.healthybetta.com/easymeds.html

Unfortunately, it sounded much easier to do than cutting tabs so I was very interested in doing it that way. But what you say makes perfect sense. Maybe someone should inform that website about the error...

In any case, I appreciate all the discussion. Hopefully this will help not only my Trevor but maybe other fishies out there with issues. Thanks!

 

[SRC]

Yes..you get one of each of those in the Wal-mart pack..along with another one that has some yellow flowery things on it..I don't have apicture of that one though.

Reason I suggested silk plants, is once you treat with meds I was under the impression that live plants should be thrown out..as they absorb the medication and will release it back into clean water. You can sterilize silk plants after they are used (I boil them then set them in the sun to dry all day). Just seems more economical to me.

Not to mention if you don't keep enough light on 90% of plants..they can and will start to die..and dying plants raise your Nitrate levels significantly.

If you are concerned about him having to go up for air..you can lower the water level..although the plant with the yellow flowers on it...it squite tall actually.

 

[crankwalk]

Hello all.. back again. I've been treating Trevor for 4 days so far with both Maracyn and Maracyn-Two. Tonight his last dosage of each goes in, and 24 hours later it will be over, and time for a 100% water change.

He still doesn't look like he's gotten any better. He doesn't lay on the bottom as much, rather he lays around the top, either on his plant (got him a tall silk plant) or on the suction cup for the heater. But he is still listless, and still pale. He has been eating throughout all of this and will swim around occasionally but I figured with 10 days of M2 treatment and the new 5 days of M1 treatment I should have all my bases covered. :\

I am trying to rack my brain thinking of things.. there is a small possibility that it might be PH related.. what are the symptoms of too high PH? The last time I tested his PH it was high for a Betta, between 7.8-8.0. I just got off the phone with my LFS and they say says the PH in my area's tap water has changed over the past couple of months, it has gotten higher. I don't know what the PH was when I first got him up until now because I just got a freshwater test kit at the end of last month, so I don't know if its gone up enough to cause him harm, from whatever the PH was that he was "used" to. The LFS suggests using Discus Buffer to lower the PH. I don't know.. I'm willing to try just about anything. Someone else suggested to gradually work down to a 50/50 mix of distilled and tap water to lower the PH. I have also seen "Betta Water" at the local Petco -- I believe this is dechlorinated RO water, with the proper PH. But its expensive and I couldn't afford to do his water changes with this bottled water all the time.. thinking about trying to add some into his water changes right now to see if he perks up at all.

Any other ideas? Thanks all

 

[crankwalk]

First I just want to say thank you so much to everyone who's been trying to help, but I am not very optimistic right now, seeing as how it looks like the treatments aren't working. I just got home and took a look at him.. he looks miserable. He did swim over to me when i walked up to his tank. As I was looking at him from above, I noticed at times his spine is curved, and it seems he can't swim with his tail, only with his little side fins. When he tries to swim with his tail it almost looks like he's shaking his whole body trying to get his tail fin working. His fins are extremely clamped, they just look very stringy. I also notice his gills moving more than I remember them.. sometimes it looks like he's "breathing" because his gills are opening and closing. Then it stops for a while.

Here is a pic of him from a few minutes ago.. do his gills look like they're not closing all the way? See the curve in his back?

He is still hanging in there, fighting whatever is deteriorating him, I wish he could tell me what was wrong

 

[Bandit]

aw sorry to hear about your betta crank.

have you tested for nitrites.... the symptoms remind me of nitrite poisoning

 

[Alix]

this forum thing stoped on july 11...i WANNA KNOW HOW THE FISHY IS!!!

 

[crankwalk]

Hi guys.. thanks for the concern. Trevor is still here with us.. but he's not really gotten much better. I've tried moving him into an all acrylic tank (instead of the glass one with silicone seals (just in case he was allergic to silicone)) changed his water to RO water, and still nothing. He's pretty listless, still eating, but fins clamped and pale. He's been this way for almost a month. All I can think of, is he's OLD. Maybe he's just an old fish.. I tried to treat him with Maracyn and Maracyn Two, bettafix, salt, higher temperatures, nothing. He's still hanging in there and i'm out of ideas. Maybe its just natural.. what else can I do? :\ Just been quiet here in this thread because i've been trying to enjoy the time with him in case he's not around for much longer... *sigh*

 

[Alix]

mhm...try over feeding him?...my oscar got depressed an one day i accadently put WAYYYY tomuch food into his tank an he perked up. maybe a change in diet or some plants an stuff might help
i wish fish could be hugged.