Very Strange Septicemia Problem...

[victorybear]

Hey guys. I have a really strange dilemma here. First off, let me say that I keep my 10 gal tank really clean, and free of ammonia/nitrite/nitrate. Despite this though, my Betta came down with fin rot. As soon as I noticed this, I began treating him with Maracyn 2. This seemed to stop the fin rot, but shortly after I began treating, he got a bad case of septicemia. I was told that Maracyn 2 worked well for this in addition, so I continued treating for about 5 days. It did not go away however. I went to my LFS and they recommended kanamycin, which is supposed to be stronger. They also recommended treating him in a bowl and doing daily water changes, since it's easier to keep the water clean. I went ahead and did this, and it's now been about a month and I still see no improvement (isn't it supposed to clear up in a week?) The parts of the fin that aren't streaked with red have grown back completely, but the rest is still in tatters. He's still very lively and eating well, but I'm kind of at a loss about what to do next. Any advice?

Side note: No matter how clean I've kept the tank and bowl, I've noticed these white, mucus-like blobs (I'm guessing bacteria?) floating around in the water. They look very similar to the gloopy stuff you see in those Tetra SafeStart bottles. Before the whole septicemia incident, I even saw my guy eat one of them before I could take it out. What is this stuff and is it bad?

 

[loraxchick]

is it possible to post a pic of the fish and its suspected septicemia? what color is the fish and its fins? what type of filtration do you have? (ie could his fins be suck into it and shredded?) what sort of decore do you have? anything rough or jagged? also any natural wood in the tank?
real or fake plants? tankmates?
as for the mucousy blobs, not quite sure what to make of it. Ive seen white/clear mucousy-type stuff on new wood, and yes its bacterial or fungal, but generally not the type to cause disease outbreak. Snail eggs is another possibility.
if he is eating well and acting otherwise himself, id give him a break from meds for a week or so. They can cause stress on a fish which may lead to further health issues. just finish the round youre on if it isnt already and let the fish get a break for a week or so. Keep monitoring behavior in the meantime, and if starts to go downhill while off the meds, then begin new treatment.
all the best
cheers

 

[victorybear]

is it possible to post a pic of the fish and its suspected septicemia? what color is the fish and its fins? what type of filtration do you have? (ie could his fins be suck into it and shredded?) what sort of decore do you have? anything rough or jagged? also any natural wood in the tank?
real or fake plants? tankmates?
as for the mucousy blobs, not quite sure what to make of it. Ive seen white/clear mucousy-type stuff on new wood, and yes its bacterial or fungal, but generally not the type to cause disease outbreak. Snail eggs is another possibility.
if he is eating well and acting otherwise himself, id give him a break from meds for a week or so. They can cause stress on a fish which may lead to further health issues. just finish the round youre on if it isnt already and let the fish get a break for a week or so. Keep monitoring behavior in the meantime, and if starts to go downhill while off the meds, then begin new treatment.
all the best
cheers

Sorry for the late reply... My fish was originally peach-colored with opaque fins (will post photo later). As I mentioned in my previous post, I currently have him in a bowl suspended in the tank for temp regulation. His regular tank though has a tetra whisper filter which I've never seen him near in the past. As far as decor goes, I have this fake log/cavern thing (not jagged) I purchased in the fish section at Petsmart as well as a tiny live plant (Amazon Swords). There is no natural wood in the tank, and no tank mates.

I've been thinking more about what may have caused this septicemia problem, and why it isn't going away. Could it be the tap water itself? I've been treating the water liberally with Amquel+, so the water should be clean and well conditioned. However, I've been storing the water I use in a huge metal pot on the stove so I can heat the water to the right temp more easily. Could the metal somehow be affecting the water quality? Since I began considering this, I have thoroughly cleaned one of my plastic buckets, attached an extra water heater inside, and've begun conditioning a new batch of water for his next water change. Maybe this will help? What do you think?

 

[kelly528]

...are you positive it's really septicemia? I'd give a fish with septicemia a week to live at most... it's basically a blood infection so it psreads pretty fast and is quite lethal. Perhaps you just have an unusually 'veiny' betta?

 

[victorybear]

...are you positive it's really septicemia? I'd give a fish with septicemia a week to live at most... it's basically a blood infection so it psreads pretty fast and is quite lethal. Perhaps you just have an unusually 'veiny' betta?

Thanks for the reply. I've included some photos of my guy, so maybe this will help. Sorry they're kind of crappy...

There's a black streak I thought would clear up after the fin rot was cured, but it looks like it could be getting worse. Any ideas what it is?

Again, he's active and eating well, and I've been very careful about keeping his water clean. Any more input?

 

[loraxchick]

Because he is a marble I honestly would just think it was his coloration. He seems to be a young boy and likely just coloring up if the coloration is somewhat new to you. Septicemia is not that vibrant and certainly not black like that. I would stop medicating the chap and keep up on the waterchanges if you are worried. TBH, I think the streaking in the fins is just his normal color.
All the best.
cheers

ps-Bettas who are marble coloration often make dramatic changes in their color pattern. Many folks want this trait because it is fun to see what they eventually will "turn out" to be. And since he looks young (to me anyway from the photos-body still has some filling out to do) he will probably change even more, so dont be alarmed if that happens. Just monitor behavior and make sure he is acting normal (eating swimming etc.)

 

[Tolak]

Not specific to bettas, but with fish in general; septicemia will begin where the fins meet the body & spread from there, out towards the ends of the fins. I'm not seeing that whatsoever, not being up on the specifics of betta coloration I would go by what lorax has stated in that respect.

 

[kelly528]

Yep, marbles change color quite fast, and I am seeing the red on a few patches of his body and a bit of black under his gill flap. Looks like pigmentation, not an infection.

 

[victorybear]

Thanks for all the responses, guys! I'd be really relieved if it was just his coloring. However, if that's the case, why hasn't his fins healed around the red/black streaking? It's been more than a month, shouldn't it have all grown back by now like the normal parts of his fins?

 

[loraxchick]

there are many factors to fin re-growth. Severity of injury and overall health of the fish. The rays take longer to grow back than the tissue in between. I dont see any sign of infection, just needs to grow back. Water temp and diet are also consideration. Feed more high protein food like bloodworms. Meds also are harsh on a fish in the long-term. Can knock the fish down a bit (immune response and overall stress-level). Keep his water clean, lay off the meds and feed more high protein food if you are able.
Do you see any sign of the fin eroding at all in those spots? Or is it just taking some time to grow back? If it is staying the same, no worries, it may just take time.
He is an interesting little fella. I like his very unique coloration. Enjoy watching him change. You might even see some dark spots or red spots appear on his body (start as tiny spots and spread)-due to his coloration it is 100% normal.
keep us posted if you notice any differences in behavior or if the fins look worse.
Cheers

 

[victorybear]

there are many factors to fin re-growth. Severity of injury and overall health of the fish. The rays take longer to grow back than the tissue in between. I dont see any sign of infection, just needs to grow back. Water temp and diet are also consideration. Feed more high protein food like bloodworms. Meds also are harsh on a fish in the long-term. Can knock the fish down a bit (immune response and overall stress-level). Keep his water clean, lay off the meds and feed more high protein food if you are able.
Do you see any sign of the fin eroding at all in those spots? Or is it just taking some time to grow back? If it is staying the same, no worries, it may just take time.
He is an interesting little fella. I like his very unique coloration. Enjoy watching him change. You might even see some dark spots or red spots appear on his body (start as tiny spots and spread)-due to his coloration it is 100% normal.
keep us posted if you notice any differences in behavior or if the fins look worse.
Cheers

Thanks so much for your input and advice. The more I think about it, the more what you're saying makes sense to me.

When I came home from work today, I noticed a sliver of his tail was coming off up near the black part. This may just be due to stress/over-medicating though, so I'm not going to worry about it too much unless it gets worse. Either way, I'll keep everyone posted. Thanks again for all your thoughts, guys!

 

[victorybear]

Hey guys. Things got worse. I've made a new thread for it, so if you guys had any input, I'd be eternally grateful.

http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?/topic/352149-black-swolen-lump-on-bettas-body/