I have nothing against ur oppinions or u being aggressive about them tokis, nor do i have any problem with this being a "serious" thread, nor with u defending yourself, but i think u need to read what i wrote that first time, and carefully cuz it was prolly worded badly, and maybe ull see my side, maybe u wont, iunno...
i dont care really... i gotta say i did, but im not gunna try anymore because it just gets me worked up, it gets me going, and it ends up being useless anyways. Im sorry i refuse to do this all over again.
now maybe ill be back someday, maybe and prolly i wont, i respect what u people are doing helping others, but sometimes it gets outta hand when they believe in doing something differently then u do, WHETHER OR NOT U OR THEM IS RIGHT, sometimes u gotta relise that they arent changing to ur way, even if they should, and u can try to help them or not bother. The thing that always gets me going is how u guys react to it, and tear them apart. I have seen many people warn others about well ur prolly gnna get ripped apart for this and this... i seen this 3 times recently, basically just dont post if it isnt helping them, and NO tellin them ur ways better or their ways wrong 15 million times and tearin them up isnt help, tho everybody here seems to think so, but hey o well part of life eh,..
well no im not gunna defend my point here, ill say this, i believe u have valid points and my side has valid points. its clear what i think, and there isnt a thing in the world u can say to change it (my point about y u guys shouldnt post if it is just to criticise or attempt to make people think like u do), so i might be around once and a while, but prolly not. im prolly done with this forum, id love to have seen it before cuz from what ive heard it was nice but now its just fighting and arguing.
P.S. just a note to everybody, most people dont come on here to be in or listen to a debate, specially if it is a topic they want to post in but its pointless cuz the "debate" (argument) is happening.
I understand that you are probably just trying to protect Rose, but i don't think i am "ripping her apart" (i haven't shouted, sweared, been abusive, flamed/trolled, lied, exagerated points etc), but tell me straight what are your valid points in this thread, as you seem to have only participated in this thread to tell me that you don't like me so straightforward in my opinion in this thread or something like that? What are your opinions on the actual topic at hand in this thread?
This is the way i see things;
If someone has a badly stocked tank, i will tell them.
If someones fish are dying due their owners mistakes, i will tell them.
If someones fish are sick and the owner doesn't know whats wrong, i will tell them.
If someone is making light of a situation which i think should be treated with more seriousness and respect, i will tell them.
Etc..
I don't see anything wrong with me telling someone they should be doing a particular thing in a situation if i personally feel they are doing something wrong.
This is one of the friendliest forums around- but like on any forum, at certain moments people will always disagree with each other. You can't protect everyone from this inevitability, nor should you try and prevent such disagreements happen as more than often it is by disagreeing with people that people are exposed to opinions that are not nesarsary in agreence to their own, and so they become more knowledgeable on the issues facing such situations, and so can make better informed opinions for themselves etc.
I don't think it is wrong that an owner of a predatory animal like an RES turtle finds pleasure in feeding their turtle live foods like fish, most owners like doing this because for many such owners, seeing their prized pet display natural, active and happy behaviour is a sight that is a joy to behold.
However what i do disagree with is someone finding such a thing funny (it turns the whole deal into something more morbid that way), or taking the subject of feeding live foods like fish lightly etc.
IMHO But no matter how much you may enjoy feeding live fish to your prized predatory pet, you should understand that this is not a light hearted matter and should be treated with respect, the feeder fish may be killed and eaten not long after you buy them, however you should still treat them with respect and not just as throw-away toys for your pred to play with etc.
I have nothing wrong with people feeding live fish as long as the below points are taken into consideration in particular when it comes to feeder fish;
a. The fish should be healthy and suitable for the pred to eat.
b. The fish should be small enough for the pred to devour/swallow quickly.
c. The fish should not be exposed to unesarsary stress, like being put in with a lot of other fish so that it takes all day for the pred to eat the fish etc.
d. The predatory animal in question should be hungry enough to eat the feeder fish quickly etc.
I primarily disagreed with rosy because she basically said that she fed guppys to her RES and couldn't care less for them because she hated them, and that because she hated them she didn't see anything wrong with causing them unesarsary stress etc.
Personally i view all fish as equal, and thus all fish should be given the same basic level of respect as each other. For example i don't particularly like parrot cichlids, however if i was feeding young small parrot cichlids to a predatory fish of mine, just because i didn't like them doesn't mean that i wouldn't respect and care for the fish well until their final moment.
I eat meat, however i would not eat a peice of meat if i knew that the animal it came from had been exposed to a lot of unesarsary suffering and stress before death- i would only eat meat if i knew that the animal had been killed in a humane manner. I treat the subject of feeding feeder fish to predatory animals in a similar respect- in my opinion a fish being put in a tank and killed and eaten within moments by the pred in question is a humane death for the fish.
However, a fish being put in a tank and subjected to a whole day of being chased around or being picked apart peice by peice (because it is too large to be swallowed or eaten quickly) etc is not a humane death for a feeder fish.
In the wild, a lot of predators will not chase their prey for a very long time (there are of course a few expections to this rule) and most predators will give up chasing after a certain period of time, and at every point the prey has of course a chance to escape. In an aquarium there is no way the feeder fish can escape, and because it can't get away, the predator may continuously chase it when it the wild it would have long given up on the fish. The fact that some of Rose's guppys took a whole day to be killed and eaten strongly leads me to the conclusion that Rose put too many guppys in at once for the RES to eat, and by doing so she caused them a lot of unesarsary stress.
Also, her attitude that she doesn't care about guppys because she hates them IMHO is an imature take on feeding fish, and i think that she should show more respect and concern for the welfare of fish even if she doesn't particularly like them (afterall, what have the guppys done to deserve this situation?).
. If you are ever unlucky enough to get chased around all day long before being eaten by a bear or some other wild predatory animal, perhaps you remember just for a moment what you deliberately put all those guppys through.
