To Drill Or Not To Drill...

[steve711]

I am going to set up a new planted tank 60"x24"x30" and plan to incorporate a sump, mainly to increase stocking capacity, I will also be running an external canister filter so effectively having two filtration systems.

My question is do I get the tank drilled for the pipe work to the sump or do I use a syphon of some kind?
I've pretty much made my mind up on having it drilled but would like others opinions.

I need to know if it's easy to plug/block the hole if I do have it drilled but in future decide not to use the hole. I plan to have it drilled at the back near the top as opposed to in the base.

My other question is what is the standard size for drilling if there is one and the corresponding pipe work?

Thanks.

 

[scotsgringo]

sorry m8 i'm no use to you i'm after the same answers as you i want sump don't know anything about sumps just know i will use external filter too for chemical use ie charcol and the likes.
will drill hole near top gravity will take it into sump then a pump to take it back OVER THE TOP of display tank and back in.
don't know what kind of media to put in sump wish there was section on sumps there seems to be heaps o people want to find out things about them will keep my eye on your post to see what answers you get BEST O LUCK TA RA
PS i'm setting up a 5ftx2x2 with a 3ft sump for malawi

 

[andywg]

If you want planted then a sump will only hinder you as they allow greater stocking volume by increased water volume and gas exchange. This gas exchange of the water running from the display tank to the sump tank will cause the co2 necessary for your plants to be driven out of the water. You can have a drilled planted tank, but it is a LOT harder.

You can drill the tank either at the top and use a mini weir (uses less space) or you can drill the bottom and have a full weir. If you go for the bottom then you can bottom feed it to prevent stuff settling on the bottom (reducing gravel vac necessities) and the bottom will be easier to mask with a patch if you decide you don't want a hole.

Pipe/hole size depends on the flow. You really want 5-7 times turnover. I would expect 32mm would handle your flow rate necessary, though you can go for 40mm for safety. Fish Fur and Feathers has a good website telling you what size hole to drill for what size pipework. Also consider a durso standpipe (do a google) as it is an amazingly useful tool.

 

[dylema]

Correct me if I am wrong but as far as media in a sump for fresh water you will still need to have the same jobs performed as a canister. ie mechanical filtratation to remove particulate waste(some sort of foam filter or similar), biological filtration to remove amonia etc. (high surface area media, bioballs, ceramic beads or tubes etc).

I don't know why you couldn't put charcoal and or chemical media (buffering etc) in a part of the sump if you needed it. It would seem like overkill to have a canister and a sump.

 

[steve711]

The main reason for the sump is to increase capacity for the number of fish I can keep.

I would run it so there is minimal surface agitation to reduce gas exchange (i.e. loss of CO2) and then pump it back to the main tank with the return pipe well below the surface again not causing surface agitation of the main display tank.

 

[scotsgringo]

YOU BOYS SEEM TO KNOW WHAT YOUR TALKING ABOUT, so can you tell me do i drill a hole at the top for the return or over the top ( i would prefer drilled ) if so how high is hole, is it the same as the overflow ?? and is it the same sized hole sorry i'm jumping on the band wagon here but like STEVE i ain't got a clue and i'm not setting up a new tank then wishing a had drilled and put in a sump as i would like to go for marines in a year or 2 just want to give the MALAWI'S a go done all the normal tropicals over the years....
and 1 more question how many compartments do i need in sump and what media do i use ???
and help for me or steve would be of great help .
thxs in advance ANDYWG and DYLEMA all info is welcomed ( ps sorry if my spelling is crap lol )

 

[dylema]

I like the sound of drilling a hole for the return. It seems silly to drill a hole for the overflow and then have a tube over the top for the return. It would be neater to have them both drilled. I guess if you want to have the return comming out at the water level ie a spray bar spraying across the surface, you may as well get it drilled at the same hight as the overflow. If you have different plans like having a spray bar under the water level and spraying down you might want it to be lower, if you want it to pour into the tank water fall style then moke it as close to the top as practical. If you change your mind you will just have to have some angled tubes and bends to position the return where you want it.

As for compartments in the sump, work out how many media types you will have. I would go with one compartment for bio balls one for foam type media one for ceramic noodles and a separate empty compartment for the return powerhead, and maybe a separate compartment for something else you might want to add in the future.

Here is my scratchy drawing for my planned new tank. You might want more compartments then me in your sump. This is for a really small tank but that shouldn't change the idea.

What you are aiming for with any type of filtration it to get your water to pass as much filter media as possible so as many good bacteria as possible can remove amonia etc from the water. It is important to get the water flowing evenly across the media. If there is an easy path the water will take it. If there is a little gap along the side of your media the water will go through there instead of going through the media. Having the water passing up through the bio balls and noodles will help the water spread out and go across the media evenly. One other point to mention is that it takes a lot of oxygen to remove amonia so having well airated water is important. Spraying water evenly over the media is great but might not be as easy as some other designs.

Hope this helps

ps sorry for changing the subject Steve