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[Ethos]

I'd buy the book that bettamomma wrote.
BUT, thats not what this thread is about.
There should be a standard somewhere about decent logistics.
Something that by law, walmart cannot sell something under the minimum gallon rule.
I know that 2 years ago, my sister bought a 1 quart bowl and put 2 goldfish in there. After 3 weeks they both died.

 

[OrkyBetta]

well of course they both died. But bettas aren't goldfish. They are anabantoids. And I bet your sister wasn't keeping up on water changes, since goldfish poop so much, which was the main complaint of your thread.

 

[Seahorse]

I agree with both sides. I see your point BM but I have to disagree sometimes.

If you have a fish that comes home with you and gets put into a 1/2 gallon bowl - that in no way says you aren't caring for your fish. If you feed it, give it attention and clean water, you are caring for it. However, if you buy a dog, stick it in your backyard on a chain and forget about it- now THAT is not caring for your animal. They're two totally different things.

You aren't taking care of a fish like you should if you stick it in a 1/2 gallon bowl. Like I said, I *fully* understand things happen. I am ALL for using 1/2 gallon tanks temporarily! Definitely! But forever? No...!

Come on, you guys would be outraged if someone came in here with a goldfish living in a 1/2 gallon and they said "Oh, but I keep it clean!". You guys would throw so many facts at them they would probably NEVER come back!

But at the same time you can't switch the word "fish" to "betta" because it just isn't fair.

Yes many fish have different needs. Some need 100 gallons, some need 10. And just like those fish, bettas also have needs. They might be able to fare well in a 1/2 gallon, but that doesn't make it okay. You might as well stick one of those flowers in and tell people it can survive off the "nutrients from the roots"

So like it or not, you guys are just as affected by the HUGE misconception that we spend so much time trying to change (that you can keep bettas in tiny spaces). We point out the bad people who keep them in small boxes of water. We can be really self righteous. But when it gets down to it, who is just as guilty? We are.

Saving a fish from a cup and putting it into a small "tank" is great. But there comes a time when you NEED to upgrade. You saving that goldfish from the petstore who would have died if it hadn't been rescued within 24 hours, that is fantastic! But let me tell you, EVERYONE here would say to get it into a bigger home ASAP.

We need to stop making standards for other fish but making exceptions for the betta.

This is the first step to changing the so called "rules" around about betta keeping, and it should start with people who know. Us.

 

[BettaMomma]

I'd buy the book that bettamomma wrote.
BUT, thats not what this thread is about.
There should be a standard somewhere about decent logistics.
Something that by law, walmart cannot sell something under the minimum gallon rule.
I know that 2 years ago, my sister bought a 1 quart bowl and put 2 goldfish in there. After 3 weeks they both died.

I totally agree with you!
I think Penn Plax should be ran out of town.
If their operation was near where I lived, I would spend every day of my vacation picketing and protesting outside their facility.

The problem with that again though is that nobody would ever be able to agree upon what the smallest tank size for fish X is.

Ya know?
Great in theory, though!

 

[Haiku]

BUT, thats not what this thread is about.
There should be a standard somewhere about decent logistics.
Something that by law, walmart cannot sell something under the minimum gallon rule.

With all due respect, the thread seemed to me to originally be about how people on "this forum" are accepting of the small tank sizes and how we don't call down people who use what some consider less than ideal living quarters. That is why people got defensive and upset. I think we all agree that pet stores and retail stores should not sell those tiny "betta bowls," and as far as minimum tank size goes, like BettaMomma said there are a wide variety of opinions on that.

 

[BettaMomma]

You aren't taking care of a fish like you should if you stick it in a 1/2 gallon bowl. sad.gif

I curently have little Sam in a 1/2 gallon tank and he's going to stay right there for quite some time. Tell me I'm mistreating him. I'd like to hear you say that.

Come on, you guys would be outraged if someone came in here with a goldfish living in a 1/2 gallon and they said "Oh, but I keep it clean!". You guys would throw so many facts at them they would probably NEVER come back!

We already do that on a regular basis right here in the betta forum. This thread, for example.

We need to stop making standards for other fish but making exceptions for the betta.

I hate to point out the obvious here, but what we are trying to do at the current moment is to get bettas UP TO the standards of other fish. Cups at WalMart - prime example.

My whole goal in all the effort that I've put into with calling around and getting people to take notice that there are a LOT of us pissed off about the conditions of fish has been to get them to TREAT THEM BETTER, not to get them into bigger tanks.

And I swear to god, the next time it is insinuated that I am self-righteous I will be exiting the forum stage left, and I won't be coming back any time soon.

 

[Seahorse]

You aren't taking care of a fish like you should if you stick it in a 1/2 gallon bowl. sad.gif

I curently have little Sam in a 1/2 gallon tank and he's going to stay right there for quite some time. Tell me I'm mistreating him. I'd like to hear you say that.

Come on, you guys would be outraged if someone came in here with a goldfish living in a 1/2 gallon and they said "Oh, but I keep it clean!". You guys would throw so many facts at them they would probably NEVER come back!

We already do that on a regular basis right here in the betta forum. This thread, for example.

We need to stop making standards for other fish but making exceptions for the betta.

I hate to point out the obvious here, but what we are trying to do at the current moment is to get bettas UP TO the standards of other fish. Cups at WalMart - prime example.

My whole goal in all the effort that I've put into with calling around and getting people to take notice that there are a LOT of us pissed off about the conditions of fish has been to get them to TREAT THEM BETTER, not to get them into bigger tanks.

And I swear to god, the next time it is insinuated that I am self-righteous I will be exiting the forum stage left, and I won't be coming back any time soon.

Naw, I wasn't calling you self righteous. There are a few cases though where users say one thing and in the next breath do exactly what they said was wrong.

And yes, the cup thing is exactly what we are trying to stop. Which was my whole point of the post Tank size does matter. Which was again, the point of my post.

See, there are no standards for bettas in tank sizes, other than the obvious cups, and that is what isn't fair. I agree, people need to take care of their bettas as far as clean water and food goes. But tank size is just as important, and in my opinion, I think it is hypocritical in some cases... But what do I know

I just think bettas need standards for tank sizes like other fish.

 

[littlefishie]

Funny, I was under the impression that a 1 gallon tank was the standard for bettas here on the forum. 1 gallon minimum, 2.5 gallon preferred. At least, that's what I've always seen posted.

There's no need to get all defensive and resort to veiled insults over this. Let's all just agree to disagree and understand that no matter how much we may tell someone, they'll do things the way that they work best for them.

Not everyone has room for individual 2.5 gallon tanks, and 1 gallon bowls are just as fine and suitable as a permanent home. Let's leave it at that, shall we?

 

[BettaMomma]

I do see what you're saying, and I'm ALL for better treatment for ALL fish everywhere.

The problem lies in that while some people see having a bigger tank as treating them better, other people see clean water and a variety of food and lots of tlc as treating them better. That's the real issue here.

As far as my own personal battles with stores around here - bitching at them and asking them to treat fish better, then dragging one home and putting him into a 1/2 gallon tank - things like that are what, I'm assuming, you're referring to with being hypocritical. I'd have to disagree. I feel like a HUGE hypocrit because I DIDN'T buy 6 little 1/2 gallon bowls and bring home the 6 dying boys I saw on Sunday.

 

[cometcattle]

I think CFC wants to join the Betta "Click".

 

[Seahorse]

There's no need to get all defensive and resort to veiled insults over this. Let's all just agree to disagree and understand that no matter how much we may tell someone, they'll do things the way that they work best for them.

I simply said, we can be self righteous. WE. Not BettaMomma or littlefishie or whomever else. You guys are GREAT, all of us are going after one thing. Fair treatment for our little guys and girls. I am sorry if it came out as an insult but I am just being realistic

YES people can be self righteous. This is with anybody. Be it with children or cats or dogs or goldfish or bettas. I am not going to be naive about this... I am sure you guys understand.

Funny, I was under the impression that a 1 gallon tank was the standard for bettas here on the forum. 1 gallon minimum, 2.5 gallon preferred. At least, that's what I've always seen posted.

1 gallon is the standard. See? That was my whole post? My signature? We are victims of the "small tank syndrome" The "anything but that blasted cup is better!" frame of mind. Which is true, with any animal. But that doesn't mean forever.

I don't know, I guess you didn't understand my post.

Not everyone has room for individual 2.5 gallon tanks, and 1 gallon bowls are just as fine and suitable as a permanent home. Let's leave it at that, shall we?

Not everyone has room for individual 40 gallon tanks, and 10 gallon tanks are just as fine and suitable as a permanent home for goldfish.

Standards and exceptions I say!


Bettamomma: I don't think it is hypocritical of you to rescue poor bettas and put them in 1/2 gals. In fact, I think that is great thing and I know you know that. And I am sure you would upgrade if you could.

I only think someone is hypocritical when in one breath they say tetras need a 10 gallon minimum, and as for your betta? Eh, throw him into that pitcher, he'll love it. This doesn't happen a lot on here, but when it does, it burns.

I am kind of going everywhere with this, but like I said in an earlier post I agree with *both* sides so nobody please think I don't. I think rescuing is great, even if it uses a 1/2 gallon, because in the end it IS better than a cup and it IS clean water etc etc. It is better than doing nothing.

 

[CFC]

I think CFC wants to join the Betta "Click".

Not on your life, id be ashamed to keep a tank smaller than 10g in my house for anything other than photography sessions. I'm just keeping a eye over the thread to make sure everyone plays nice and i dont have to use the banning stick

 

[daudy_dojo]

i believe that a 1G tank is the minimum and perfect...as long as you do your water changes and what not!!

 

[50000_tears]

i have buddy in a 1/2-1 gal bowl i clean it every 3 days i make sure its all clean for him . so even if i do that your saying its bad ethos??

 

[BettaMomma]

NEVER mind.
I just figured out what you meant CFC - you're into bigger tanks.

I see

Nevermind!!!!