Still seeing fin rot in my tank

[Reily]

I’m sure some of you have seen my posts about fin rot. It continues to be a problem in my tank.

This time I’m beginning to see it on my angels and gouramis - not like crazy yet but probably coming. I can’t seem to figure out why although I have a pretty good idea:
I think the ph is simply too high, the high range ph test reads 8.2 or so. Ammonia levels have finally leveled out to 0 ppm which is good. I did a 60% wc a week ago today with gravel clean, decoration clean, filter pad clean. I’ve included pictures of water tests. Upon testing the ph in my normal tap water where I fill the tank up from, it reads 7.6ish which is great. I can’t seem to figure out why the ph comes up so high though in the tank.

Tank size: 75 gallons, set up for 6 months
Ph : 8.2
Ammonia : 0ppm
Temperature : 84° F
Tank guests: 5 angels, 7 gouramis

*tank has plenty of oxygen

I’m not sure what else to do. Id like to switch to live plants but they just cost so much. Can anyone see anything that might raise the ph in the tank? It’s all fake decoration and the substrate is just rocks from the pet store.
Help or advice would be appreciated. Planning on doing another wc tonight or tomorrow to help lower the ph. I tested the ph last wc I did and it was closer to 7.6.

Also, I’ve included a picture of the water test for low ph range (blue one) and it seems higher than 7.6 by only a little though not like 8.2 high like the high range shoes which is strange that they’re showing two different results.

 

[TNG]

It's difficult to see fin rot in the photos, but it's good to see ammonia at 0.
Do you know what your nitrate is, ideally it should be below 10ppm, and shouldn't be higher than 20.
As for pH, could you take a small sample of your tap water (not tank water) and keep it overnight (say 10 hours) in a plastic container and test it the next day to see what it is.

 

[Naughts]

As well as the pH test on the standIng tap water, please give the KH and GH.
I wonder if you have a case of fin-nipping rather than fin rot as the damage is mainly on the dorsal (top) fins. Sit still in front of the tank for 30 minutes+ and watch for aggression. Although the tank is large you may still see territorial issues from both the angels and the gouramis.

 

[Naughts]

Id like to switch to live plants but they just cost so much.

An easy plant is anachis/ eloeda. A few bunches should be reasonably priced and it is tall enough to break up lines of sight for the fish. It grows fast so you should be able to trim the tops to make new bunches.

 

[Reily]

It's difficult to see fin rot in the photos, but it's good to see ammonia at 0.
Do you know what your nitrate is, ideally it should be below 10ppm, and shouldn't be higher than 20.
As for pH, could you take a small sample of your tap water (not tank water) and keep it overnight (say 10 hours) in a plastic container and test it the next day to see what it is.

Certainly in the early stages of fin rot for these ones but hoping it won’t worsen. Nitrate reads between 20 and 40 ppm. Which that shouldn’t be a concern right? I did a 75% water change and the ph is back to 7.6 like the tap. Ammonia still 0. I will do that with the tap water. But why would ph be rising so quickly? Tap water wouldn’t just rise on its own would it?

Also can fin rot be treated just doing water changes or does medication need to be involved? Like I said, it’s still in the early stages but I don’t want it to worsen. If medication needs to be used, could I treat the whole tank since most of not all of the fish are infected? I wouldn’t imagine stress from other tank mates is an issue, most of them get along besides two gouramis (probably males) that hash it out every now and then but no fin nipping.

 

[Reily]

As well as the pH test on the standIng tap water, please give the KH and GH.
I wonder if you have a case of fin-nipping rather than fin rot as the damage is mainly on the dorsal (top) fins. Sit still in front of the tank for 30 minutes+ and watch for aggression. Although the tank is large you may still see territorial issues from both the angels and the gouramis.

I’ll have to get tests for that tomorrow. I wouldn’t think it’s fin nipping, they all show some aggression but no fin nipping that I see? And relating to the plants: id like to switch to planted, would the gravel I have not work for plants though?

 

[Naughts]

Tap water wouldn’t just rise on its own would it?

Yes. The gases are released and the pH changes. A true reading is attained after the water has sat for 24 hours.

 

[Naughts]

he gravel I have not work for plants though?

Gravel is fine. Eloeda would even survive under gravel filtration.

 

[Reily]

Gravel is fine. Eloeda would even survive under gravel filtration.

I’ll look into getting some live plants. Could my filter pads be a reason contributing to high ph? I haven’t replaced them since I set the tank up.

 

[TNG]

Certainly in the early stages of fin rot for these ones but hoping it won’t worsen. Nitrate reads between 20 and 40 ppm. Which that shouldn’t be a concern right? I did a 75% water change and the ph is back to 7.6 like the tap. Ammonia still 0. I will do that with the tap water. But why would ph be rising so quickly? Tap water wouldn’t just rise on its own would it?

Also can fin rot be treated just doing water changes or does medication need to be involved? Like I said, it’s still in the early stages but I don’t want it to worsen. If medication needs to be used, could I treat the whole tank since most of not all of the fish are infected? I wouldn’t imagine stress from other tank mates is an issue, most of them get along besides two gouramis (probably males) that hash it out every now and then but no fin nipping.

pH
Your water may have high pH but the water company lowers the pH before supplying it to customers. When you test it straight out of the tap it has low pH, but it will gas off and revert back to high pH after sitting in your tank for a day or so.

Plants
Your fish will thank you for live plants, but I suggest you don’t have any until you sort out your water first. If the water is not suitable for your plants (pH and GH) they will decay and die, and you’ll then have another problem to deal with.
My plants grow in sand in clay pots. Photo 1 is a small tank with surplus plants, photo 2 is my main tank with the pots hidden behind rocks.

Fin rot
Now that ammonia is zero and you have done large water changes, it shouldn’t be difficult to get nitrate to around 10ppm. After large water changes your nitrate should drop and should remain low if you do weekly water change, or fortnightly if your tank isn’t overstocked.
I’d keep nitrate and pH under control and observe for any improvement before treatment.
The product I use to treat fin rot is Fungus Cure by Blue Planet, although you have different products in the States. It will turn the water blue if it contains Malachite Green, something to be aware of.

Filter
Is it a HOB filter? I don’t think filter maintenance, or the lack of, contributes to high pH. I squeeze the coarse foam in tank water or tap water to clean it every couple of week as I have live plants and plant roots get trapped in it. I clean or throw out the fine wool pad every couple of weeks (if you have fine pad in your filter).

 

[GaryE]

I don't see any signs of fin rot in any of those pictures. Where is the concern? I see some normal fin damage, as fish will fight, but no infection or fungus.

 

[DoubleDutch]

As @Naughts said : I don't see finrot either.

Edit : Gary said the same thing hahaha

 

[GaryE]

There really are only two major circumstances under which I have ever seen fin rot, in more than 5 decades keeping fish.
Number one is when you have not maintained water quality, either by not changing water on a schedule, overfeeding or overstocking.
Number two is when you have purchased as fish carelessly, and not noticed it had fin rot from the store.

It's a very avoidable condition.

From my several years here, I have the impression that the great majority of fin rot questions are about just ordinary wear and tear on the fins of active living creatures. Most of the time, there is no disease or pathogen involved - just unnecessary treatments, and unnecessary worry. Fish fins get nibbled, torn and split on a regular basis, especially with fish that have longer fin rays.