Still Have Concerns

[Byron]

I've found this online, looks like the right stuff. How much would I dose for ~50 litres? 0.5ml going by the instructions on Seachem's site, or less - or more?
 

 
At 5 ml for 250 liters, I would dose 1 ml for 50 liters.  This is 1/4 teaspoon.  Once a week, the day following the water change (as you use Prime), will be sufficient.  There is also the Brightwell Aquatics' products; their plant line is much the same, and they have a product called FlorinMulti that is comparable to Flourish Comprehensive.  Either will work, up to you.  As you can see, you don't need very much.
 

Also, the light wasn't turned on until 6pm this evening because I wasn't around and my father forgot. Yesterday and Saturday I ran it from 2pm-9pm, although I think it's odd timing what with it already being past the middle of the day by 2pm in terms of daylight. I could switch it on before I go to work at 8.20am, but then that takes it to 4-5pm if I go by 6-8 hours lighting, so I won't exactly get to see the fish while it's all lit up (not that this is the important thing). How long would be too long, and what are the best hours to do it during, as 2pm-9pm seems awkward?
 

 
It's not much of an issue, but, long-term, having a standard period of tank light each day will be better for the plants and the fish, and algae will be disadvantaged more.
 
The period of tank light during the day can be any set time.  It doesn't have to coincide with daylight, but you do need a period of total darkness for several hours, as I explained in that other thread I believe I linked previously.  Getting a small timer is advisable.
 

Also, the thermometer seems to have balanced out just above 22C (not 23C, somewhere in-between, but very close to 22C). The heater is turned all the way down now.
 

 
I would just unplug the heater.  Provided the room is not going to get very cold, this is fine for this species.  And the fluctuation between day/night in the room will be natural for the fish.  There are those who recommend different heating settings for night and day, and there is much in that.
 

Just tested, the tank is coming in at 40-80ppm (it's no lower than 40ppm according to the API chart), and the tap is coming in at ~30ppm (or at least somewhere in the middle between 20-40ppm). Either that or I shook the tests too well... My tap water therefore poses a problem, because I could really be at 50-60ppm, but a 50% change would drop me to only 40-45ppm in that case.

 
 
There isn't much I can offer here, but I would want lower nitrates.  Someone like TwoTankAmin can detail this better than I can.  One thing about the API test though; the Regent #2 (the second one you add) has to be shaken for a good two minutes before adding the drops; they used to say 30 seconds, but many had inaccurate results.  Give the Regent #2 bottle a very good shake for two minutes and see if the end result is the same.
 
Byron.

Decided to film two of the female Minnows, wondering (read worried - am I anything but?) if their gills are inflamed or enlarged, or unaturally red or irritated, and with the one female if she's clamping her fins too much (the one the video finishes on). I do notice them trying to fight the current a lot in the corner, as well as the other three Minnows.

 
Nothing there that bothers me.  I must say, they have certainly improved since the current and temperature were altered.  Very normal behaviours.  Chasing bubbles is common, they may think it could be food particles.  And standing in a current is normal too, provided they can escape it as they can now.  Quite a difference.

 

[Kaidonni]

Took more video, noticed them hanging out under the filter a lot this evening. The one male Minnow's tail looked rather brown than red this evening, but as I've not had the light on this often, I'm unfamiliar with what they look like under such light.
 
I re-did the tests, shook reagent bottle #2 for almost 2 minutes 30 seconds, and even the test tube for a good 1 minute 15 seconds. Still very similar, although I also tried reading the tests outside under different lights. I'd say there might be a hint of orange in the tank sample for nitrates, but the tap sample is still pretty much ~30ppm. Part of me entertained a 50% water change tomorrow, but I'll wait until Saturday because I might be very close to 40ppm in the tank. Even if I'm at 50-60ppm, I'm going to be having a very hard time getting it down with that tap water and then keeping it there. I'll probably go loopy on the testing (well, even more loopy than I am now). Even an 80-90% change would have limited effects, and it's such a large change for such limited benefit. I think I might need to use RO water mixed in with water changes it I want any luck in effectively bringing these nitrates down; I need as much bang for my buck as possible. Obviously RO water has it's drawbacks...
 
As to the Nutrafin ammonia test, I think it might be discolouring even tap water samples the same way, so it's possible it's how a sample looks with the chemicals present, and not any reading of ammonia. No chloramine in the tap water according to the water board's website, and besides, I don't believe any test I have is capable of detecting ammonia while it is bound to chlorine. No ammonia in the tap water either based on the same information.

 

[Munroco]

I think your worrying to much Kaidonni, in all your videos the fish look fit and happy so you must be doing something right.

 

[Kaidonni]

The light in the kitchen definitely throws the colour off on tests, while the lights in the laudrette seem just right...just tried the Nutrafin nitrate tests out. Tap is coming in lighter than on the API, I'd hazard 10-20ppm. One tank was 10-20ppm, the other somewhere in the 20-50ppm range. Not sure which test I can trust, or if I shook the test tubes enough (four tests all at once...a little bit exhausting!). The high range pH test from the API kit leaves a lot to the imagination, with it being somewhere from 7.4-8.0 depending on how it is looked at; Nutrafin pH suggests 7.4-7.5.
 
The Seachem Flourish came today, wondering when I should first dose given that I plan my weekly water change to be Saturday afternoon (I don't want to waste it, and is it safe to dose now then dose again a day after the water change? So close together?).

 

[Byron]

The light in the kitchen definitely throws the colour off on tests, while the lights in the laudrette seem just right...just tried the Nutrafin nitrate tests out. Tap is coming in lighter than on the API, I'd hazard 10-20ppm. One tank was 10-20ppm, the other somewhere in the 20-50ppm range. Not sure which test I can trust, or if I shook the test tubes enough (four tests all at once...a little bit exhausting!). The high range pH test from the API kit leaves a lot to the imagination, with it being somewhere from 7.4-8.0 depending on how it is looked at; Nutrafin pH suggests 7.4-7.5.
 
The Seachem Flourish came today, wondering when I should first dose given that I plan my weekly water change to be Saturday afternoon (I don't want to waste it, and is it safe to dose now then dose again a day after the water change? So close together?).

 
Yes on the Flourish, I would dose it today, just 1/4 teaspoon.  After the water change, add 1/4 teaspoon.  Seachem suggest waiting a day if using Prime as your water conditioner [I think you are?] because they say Prime will detoxify the "heavy metal" nutrients in Flourish.  Long-term, you can use Flourish Comp once or twice weekly, depending upon your plants.  I would recommend starting with once and give the plants a few weeks to gage their response.
 
Some recommendations on test kits.  As you've seen, the light is very important.  Whenever possible, always use daylight; never direct sunlight, but daylight in front of a clear-glass window, or open the window or door.  Some may laugh at this, but I once took my pH test to different light sources and it made a difference.  Natural daylight out of the direct sun is best.  I can always more easily discern the shades when using light from an open door.  All artificial light is comprised of colour wavelengths, and these vary from bulb to bulb and tube to tube, plus there is reflected light from walls, etc. that can alter the colours.
 
Nitrate at 10-20 ppm is much better, but keep in mind the light issue, and the brisk shaking of Regent 2 especially.

 

[Kaidonni]

The 10-20ppm was with Nutrafin, not API. In a Nutrafin kit, reagent #3 has to be shook for 30 seconds (I shook for almost 2 minutes). The test tubes need to be shook up to mix reagent's #1 and #2, then after adding #3, then after the 5 minutes, although it doesn't say for how long. Even the second tank test (I did two tap and two tank at the same time) was probably closer to the 30ppm mark (the Nutrafin chart jumps from 20ppm to 50ppm). I also never hold the test tube directly against the paper since I notice this causes the tests to go very vivid from the light reflecting back up through them (either that or I have 110ppm nitrates...).
 
I'm still paranoid about the Minnows and the water. Two bits of flake food went to the gravel this evening, I contemplated going through the ritual of washing my hands and trying to find them, but by then it'd be too late. I would have had to use my hands anyway, sucking it out wouldn't have been an option. They eat virtually everything that goes in as I put in small amounts at a time and watch them to make sure they've eaten it all before the next pinch (actually shaking bits into the lid of the catfish pellets I used to feed the Clown Loach in order to avoid touching it with my fingers...perhaps one of the pieces was not so good, which is why they didn't eat it). I also noted the one female Minnow darting and frantically going at the glass, possibly eating some of the algae (I hope).

 

[Byron]

I wouldn't fuss over flake food getting to the bottom, with just a flake or two.  The fish may find it later, or it will get broken down.  This is where snails are such a benefit; the small ones, like Malaysian Livebearing Snails (probably the best), or pond or bladder snails.  None of these three will eat plants, but they will eat every tid-bit of organics (fish waste, uneaten food, dead plant leaves) and algae, breaking all this down faster for the various bacteria to handle.
 
I would only feed once daily (not sure if I understood this correctly), just drop in a small amount of flake and let the fish chase it down as it floats/sinks.
 
Byron.

 

[Kaidonni]

I feed every other day, and by a few pinches, I mean very small amounts. Might top 10-20 small bits of flake which the Minnows demolish, but each pinch is a very small amount and I make sure they've eaten even those bits before adding any more. I suppose I could add one big pinch, but I prefer to play it safe.
 
I still don't blanch the pea I feed, but it might be having the desired effect; saw one Minnow defecate yesterday (or the day before), something sticking out from her behind (you know I would be wondering about parasites!), but it wasn't a long trail and a small bit broke off, leaving very little behind. Not that I've noticed the other Minnows defecating much...
 
I've also now turned the heater completely off. It's reading 22-23C in the tank. The room is 20-21C during the day, it was below 19C (perhaps around 18C) at 6am this morning when the central heating was starting to warm things up. Shall I keep the heater in the tank off now?
 
On Saturday when I perform the next clean (40-44-50%, not made my mind up), I'll also deal with some of that stuff on the glass behind the filter and on the end wall (when the water level is lower so it doesn't just disperse and settle on the gravel after I've conducted all the water removal). I do notice some stuff build up on the airstone, and I sometimes dab it during a water change with kitchen towel to remove it (perhaps I'm not as thorough as I should be with the airstone, I could do it every water change).

 

[Byron]

I've also now turned the heater completely off. It's reading 22-23C in the tank. The room is 20-21C during the day, it was below 19C (perhaps around 18C) at 6am this morning when the central heating was starting to warm things up. Shall I keep the heater in the tank off now?
 

 
Yes.  That fluctuation is not at all bad, and in fact is good for the fish.

 

[Kaidonni]

That's if it drops below the 22-23C in the tank...

 

[Byron]

That's if it drops below the 22-23C in the tank...

 
I had meant that the room fluctuation between 18C at night and 20-21C during the day would be good, because the tank water will adjust similarly, or should, though it will be later, meaning not exactly in line with the room.  It takes water longer to heat and cool, as you probably know.
 
I would expect the tank temp to lower, unless the tank lighting is adding heat, but that should only be during the day.

 

[Kaidonni]

Forgot to ask this earlier - since I'm now using Seachem Flourish, is their potential for it to impact any of the tests that I carry out, or to impact certain types of test (e.g. Nessler-based tests)? If so, how long after dosing should I wait before testing? I dosed 1ml on Wednesday evening, it's now approaching ~48 hours since that; I would have thought anything that could interfere with any tests would be taken up by the plants by now (but we all know what thought can do).
 
Also, is this ammonia calculator any good? Apparently, levels of 0.02ppm free ammonia can be toxic, but depending on the pH and temperature of the water, quite a fair amount of an ammonia reading might be ammonium, so as long as the free ammonia reading portion of that is below 0.02ppm...
 
And naturally, now that I've fed the fish, I'm worrying about the size of some of the flakes that I feed the Minnows... They do get eaten, virtually nothing falls to the gravel. I try to shake out small enough flakes, but some are larger than others.

 

[Byron]

Forgot to ask this earlier - since I'm now using Seachem Flourish, is their potential for it to impact any of the tests that I carry out, or to impact certain types of test (e.g. Nessler-based tests)? If so, how long after dosing should I wait before testing? I dosed 1ml on Wednesday evening, it's now approaching ~48 hours since that; I would have thought anything that could interfere with any tests would be taken up by the plants by now (but we all know what thought can do).
 

 
I have never heard that Flourish Comprehensive interferes with basic tests (ammonia, nitrite, nitrate), though it might.  there is a small amount of ammonium and nitrate in Flourish Comprehensive.  I've no statistical data on how soon plants will use the nutrients in this fertilizer.  Some might remain in the water and be taken up slowly, some might be taken up fairly soon (some plants can store certain nutrients).  This would depend upon the plants (species and number), dosage, fish load, water parameters, and of course light intensity.  Personally I would not worry after a day or two, and any tests should always be done just prior to a water change so you can see the "norm" before you change it.  I now only test pH and GH (the latter only in the three tanks in which I raise the GH), but these tests are usually weeks if not months apart, since I have consistency.  In an issue (obvious problems for the fish, disease, etc)  I would test of course, but normally, rarely indeed.  I haven't tested nitrate for months, because every test for months and even years in established tanks has always been the same.  Established tanks tend to remain stable in water chemistry, unless you do something to target this.
 

Also, is this ammonia calculator any good? Apparently, levels of 0.02ppm free ammonia can be toxic, but depending on the pH and temperature of the water, quite a fair amount of an ammonia reading might be ammonium, so as long as the free ammonia reading portion of that is below 0.02ppm...
 

 
Another member, TwoTankAmin, posted a link to one of these in another thread earlier this week I believe.  You might track that down.  Or he might see this and comment.
 
I haven't tested for ammonia in years (except when something is amiss as I mentioned above).  Obviously fish are continually releasing ammonia via respiration, and some bacteria do as well as they break down organics.  Plants and nitrifying bacteria grab this pretty quickly.  If not, we would all have dying fish, as this is an aspect of every aquarium.
 

And naturally, now that I've fed the fish, I'm worrying about the size of some of the flakes that I feed the Minnows... They do get eaten, virtually nothing falls to the gravel. I try to shake out small enough flakes, but some are larger than others.
 

 
Fish will bite flakes apart, spit out some, chew and digest some, grab more, etc.

 

[Kaidonni]

I'm still looking at the gills of the Minnows, thinking they are rather red or bloody or flared, or some combination thereof. They are acting normal and have a great appetite, but now that I use the light, I just keep taking note of it.

 

[Kaidonni]

Just ended up deleting a whole post by accident...
 
Is this a problem?
 
After any water change, I usually obsessively notice anything in the tank that needs tweaking (I flip out on the tiniest of things), and I was done when I noticed those plants by the filter. I can move the one plant to the right and get the grass away from the filter if they do pose a serious issue, but as I've washed my hands quite a bit in soap now, it'd probably be tomorrow evening now...
 
I already tried with a pipette, but my hands were touching the frame/roof inside the top opening of the tank, so I stopped and just hope no soap particles off my hand poison the fish/mix with any condensation and end up in the tank water (my hands still smell of the soap, I didn't wash them thoroughly before using the pipette because I didn't intend on getting my hands in the tank water in the first place, but I noticed my hand repeatedly touching the frame/roof inside the top opening of the tank).