So What Am I Lacking Here?

Alright bud, sorry extreamly busy finally got around to getting the pics.
 
Alright, this is the tank I was talking about before that the plants seem to be doing extremely well. I know my Golden Jenny in back is kinda floating, I need to replant that one. The very small ones in the foreground and previous plants and I had a bad brown hair algae issue until i got the sump going... think it will take time to clean off. The driftwood is almost rid of all of it ... that was covered bad too.
 
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Now update pic on the other 75 gallon where we are having issues.... one of the plants, which I think might be turning it around...  and another of my filter pad currently due to that dang tab I put in the water.
 
 
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I'm just guessing again, going from the photos.  The "OK" tank seems to have brighter lighting in the photos, thus the plants are responding better.  No CO2 here I gather, so I would do the liquid fertilizer and see how things progress.  It may be that the light is fine without additional CO2.  That "brown hair algae" on the substrate plants in photos 2 and 4 is actually a form of brush algae that is sometimes due to bright light but can also occur with too much fertilizer, I have had this with both causes in different tanks.  
 
Just to show how finicky the balance can be...in my 90g I was dosing Flourish Comp twice weekly (no other additives) and this algae began enveloping the leaves of the large swords.  I cut back to once a week, no other changes, and the algae stopped increasing; after several weeks, the new leaves were clean, so I removed the older algae-encrusted leaves bit by bit.  I decided to try twice weekly again to confirm or refute my thinking, and sure enough, after 2-3 weeks of two doses, back came the brush algae.  I have kept it away since by keeping the additives less.  Other tanks can use more, so it is just a question of balance between light and nutrients with the fish and plant species factoring in.
 
Byron.
 
Byron said:
I'm just guessing again, going from the photos.  The "OK" tank seems to have brighter lighting in the photos, thus the plants are responding better.  No CO2 here I gather, so I would do the liquid fertilizer and see how things progress.  It may be that the light is fine without additional CO2.  That "brown hair algae" on the substrate plants in photos 2 and 4 is actually a form of brush algae that is sometimes due to bright light but can also occur with too much fertilizer, I have had this with both causes in different tanks.  
 
Just to show how finicky the balance can be...in my 90g I was dosing Flourish Comp twice weekly (no other additives) and this algae began enveloping the leaves of the large swords.  I cut back to once a week, no other changes, and the algae stopped increasing; after several weeks, the new leaves were clean, so I removed the older algae-encrusted leaves bit by bit.  I decided to try twice weekly again to confirm or refute my thinking, and sure enough, after 2-3 weeks of two doses, back came the brush algae.  I have kept it away since by keeping the additives less.  Other tanks can use more, so it is just a question of balance between light and nutrients with the fish and plant species factoring in.
 
Byron.
LOL this lighting thing is so frustrating. Its funny because both the tanks have the same set up, lights.....100W 75W 75W 100W.
 
Now with that said, I guess the one thing that might be different is that the metal reflectors might be different. I got one set of 4 from menards ( 8 inch ) and then I got another 4 from farm and fleet. The bulbs are all from the same pack, I bought packages of 4.
 
What size (volume and dimensions) is the "OK" tank?  The trouble tank is 75g but I don't see the size of the "OK" tank anywhere.
 
Byron said:
What size (volume and dimensions) is the "OK" tank?  The trouble tank is 75g but I don't see the size of the "OK" tank anywhere.
Okay, the tank is bow front so
48L
12 End - center 18
22H
The height is the same as the other one.
 
BTW, I am thinking I dont need to do a full 15ml of that liquid fritz... here is why:
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Now that brown spot algae did the same thing when it came onto the other tank... almost the same height. I would think it might be the lights, but the lights are much higher up on this one vs what its on the other tank.
 
Edit: Alright I was playing around with it ( the algae ) and it seemed to "move" like wavy as I was trying to clean it off.
 
The same lighting over both tanks means the light will be more intense over the smaller tank than the larger, though the height above is a factor too.
 
Any chance of a clear photo of the algae?
 
Byron said:
The same lighting over both tanks means the light will be more intense over the smaller tank than the larger, though the height above is a factor too.
 
Any chance of a clear photo of the algae?
No not on my phone sadly.
 
It seems to be a hair of some sort green in color.
 
Alright the best I can do.
 
One thing that I do notice and why I say its a hair type, is because it kinda "shimmers" due to the water movement in the tank... like a reflection type deal hard to describe.
Anyways here is prob the best pic I can get of it.
 
I just hope this is not the start of a blue/green algae outbreak.
 
Also, like to add, the darker stuff around the tank is left over that I did not get cleaned out when I converted to sand. The water was a mess as I removed the gravel ( and to think you clean your gravel so well only to realize that its almost impossible to remove all the food and gunk, which just builds up over time ). So I was trying to clean the glass with sub par view into the tank with a bunch of fish that were super mad I was messing up their homes.
 
 
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I still cannot tell what that is.  But I would remove all you can.
 
For the future, when changing substrates it is always better to remove the fish to a temporary tank.  This allows you to take your time and do a good job, plus it gives you the opportunity of leaving the new set-up overnight.  The filter/heater can be moved to the temporary tank.
 
Byron said:
I still cannot tell what that is.  But I would remove all you can.
 
For the future, when changing substrates it is always better to remove the fish to a temporary tank.  This allows you to take your time and do a good job, plus it gives you the opportunity of leaving the new set-up overnight.  The filter/heater can be moved to the temporary tank.
 
 
The water got cloudy in the second 75 gallon tank yesterday... not sure why. Added a 40 gallon sump to is to bring the water total up to 115 gallons..... now its cloudy. I cleaned the front glass off, and noticed it was still discolored even in the sump ... so its not the glass that was fogging it up.
 
On a positive note, the first one we started talking about seems to be rebounding half way decent. Still have a lot of brown stuff on most of the leaves in the tank, but the new growth in there seems to be rather a good color so far. Think the CO2 for whatever reason was a little much.
Granted I am still getting brown spot algae in there, but honestly , nothing as rapid as before. Thinking that as time goes on and the balance is met, it will pretty much clear itself out I hope.
 
BTW, in the first 75 gallon I did not add fritz to it, just shut down the CO2.
 
Now the next thing I need to know is this Byron:
 
What kind of "cleaning upkeep" do you recommend? I think previously you mentioned that the left over food and fish waste help produce stuff the plants need, hence the reason why in some cases fritz is not even needed. I guess the real 2 points of interest would be the filter padding and vacuuming the sand. I know your supposed to turn the sand over every once in a while.. if so when? I used to try to keep the same filter pad when I was doing the HOB type filters, just a rinse and back in there... I guess the main reason I did this was the bio load that also lives on the padding too... but then again, you said they would compete with the plants also removing stuff out of the water... so would it be safe to assume that changing some of the pad here and there would not hurt things?
 
Ill post more pics later when the lights come on in the tanks.
 
The water got cloudy in the second 75 gallon tank yesterday... not sure why. Added a 40 gallon sump to is to bring the water total up to 115 gallons..... now its cloudy. I cleaned the front glass off, and noticed it was still discolored even in the sump ... so its not the glass that was fogging it up.
 
 
This is likely the new filter, a bacterial bloom.  It should clear up on its own.  I've had it clear in a couple days, to a few weeks.
 
What kind of "cleaning upkeep" do you recommend? I think previously you mentioned that the left over food and fish waste help produce stuff the plants need, hence the reason why in some cases fritz is not even needed. I guess the real 2 points of interest would be the filter padding and vacuuming the sand. I know your supposed to turn the sand over every once in a while.. if so when? I used to try to keep the same filter pad when I was doing the HOB type filters, just a rinse and back in there... I guess the main reason I did this was the bio load that also lives on the padding too... but then again, you said they would compete with the plants also removing stuff out of the water... so would it be safe to assume that changing some of the pad here and there would not hurt things?
 
 
This depends somewhat on the aquarium, as biologically every aquarium is a bit unique; I have seven tanks with much the same conditions, yet I see this all the time.
 
Cleaning the sand is not needed, depending upon the set-up, any more than gravel.  Provided you do not overload the fish, over-feed, or over fertilize, it is possible to leave the substrate alone.  I rarely if ever even go over the top in my 115g, but in the 33g and 70g I do run the water changer over the open areas, and even down in a bit.  Be careful not to suck up sand; the Python is easy to avoid this, but the manual water changers can be more forceful and pull up sand easily.  I cedrtainly wouldn't go digging down, as any organics that have worked their way down should be left to decompose, being broken down by bacteria, producing lots of CO2 and nutrients like ammonia/ammonium which the plants will grab.
 
Filters are different, and here you will find serious difference of opinion.  I rinse my sponge filters (in the smaller tanks) at every water change, unless sometimes I forget.  The filter in a plant tank is mainly there to move the water and remove suspended particulate matter to keep it clear.  Biological filtration is not that important, as it competes with the plants.  So keeping the filter sponges, pads, floss clean is best to achieve this.  My canisters I rinse thoroughly every 2-3 months, depending upon the tank.  My Rena XP 3 on the big tank has to be rinsed every two months at the most, or it gets slow and that defeats the purpose of the filter.  I have had cyanobacteria break out in a tank solely from the filter being too dirty.  I was forgetting the schedule now and then, so this year I started in January cleaning all of the canisters, one a week, and then the Rena in March, May, etc, and the other two in April, July, etc.  Easier to remember.
 
Byron.
 
Byron said:
 
The water got cloudy in the second 75 gallon tank yesterday... not sure why. Added a 40 gallon sump to is to bring the water total up to 115 gallons..... now its cloudy. I cleaned the front glass off, and noticed it was still discolored even in the sump ... so its not the glass that was fogging it up.
 
 
This is likely the new filter, a bacterial bloom.  It should clear up on its own.  I've had it clear in a couple days, to a few weeks.
 
What kind of "cleaning upkeep" do you recommend? I think previously you mentioned that the left over food and fish waste help produce stuff the plants need, hence the reason why in some cases fritz is not even needed. I guess the real 2 points of interest would be the filter padding and vacuuming the sand. I know your supposed to turn the sand over every once in a while.. if so when? I used to try to keep the same filter pad when I was doing the HOB type filters, just a rinse and back in there... I guess the main reason I did this was the bio load that also lives on the padding too... but then again, you said they would compete with the plants also removing stuff out of the water... so would it be safe to assume that changing some of the pad here and there would not hurt things?
 
 
This depends somewhat on the aquarium, as biologically every aquarium is a bit unique; I have seven tanks with much the same conditions, yet I see this all the time.
 
Cleaning the sand is not needed, depending upon the set-up, any more than gravel.  Provided you do not overload the fish, over-feed, or over fertilize, it is possible to leave the substrate alone.  I rarely if ever even go over the top in my 115g, but in the 33g and 70g I do run the water changer over the open areas, and even down in a bit.  Be careful not to suck up sand; the Python is easy to avoid this, but the manual water changers can be more forceful and pull up sand easily.  I cedrtainly wouldn't go digging down, as any organics that have worked their way down should be left to decompose, being broken down by bacteria, producing lots of CO2 and nutrients like ammonia/ammonium which the plants will grab.
 
Filters are different, and here you will find serious difference of opinion.  I rinse my sponge filters (in the smaller tanks) at every water change, unless sometimes I forget.  The filter in a plant tank is mainly there to move the water and remove suspended particulate matter to keep it clear.  Biological filtration is not that important, as it competes with the plants.  So keeping the filter sponges, pads, floss clean is best to achieve this.  My canisters I rinse thoroughly every 2-3 months, depending upon the tank.  My Rena XP 3 on the big tank has to be rinsed every two months at the most, or it gets slow and that defeats the purpose of the filter.  I have had cyanobacteria break out in a tank solely from the filter being too dirty.  I was forgetting the schedule now and then, so this year I started in January cleaning all of the canisters, one a week, and then the Rena in March, May, etc, and the other two in April, July, etc.  Easier to remember.
 
Byron.
 


Yeah this is where a person who uses a sump would be helpful lol. I need not to worry about the turnover slowing down due to the outlet into the sump would never be slowed down so to say. The surface area of the floss is like 16 inches by 12 inches and is free to flow where ever it wants.... I using it so it catches the derbs one way or another.... then trickles down onto the bio type pads.
 
Alright here you go, as you can see from the inital tank I think things are going well. I did add some Tetra plant food, posh and iron due to the yellowish leaves and transparent
 
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Here is some grass I bought from the store around the same time. No clue what plant this is, could you give me some input what this is?
 
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And now for the second tank, the plants seem to be doing very well here:
 
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Yes, that's better.  In the first photo, I think I see Java Fern planted in the lower right and centre...I would pull this up and attach it to wood or rock.  If the rhizome [the thick "stem" from which the fronds (=leaves) and the fine black hair-like roots grow] is left buried, it may rot.
 
Not sure what the "grass" is, but could be micro sword, Lilaeopsis brasiliensis.  Others will likely know.  I'm not much on the "carpet" type plants as without more light they don't do well for me, although I do have this micro sword in one tank, very slow growing.
 
Byron said:
Yes, that's better.  In the first photo, I think I see Java Fern planted in the lower right and centre...I would pull this up and attach it to wood or rock.  If the rhizome [the thick "stem" from which the fronds (=leaves) and the fine black hair-like roots grow] is left buried, it may rot.
 
Not sure what the "grass" is, but could be micro sword, Lilaeopsis brasiliensis.  Others will likely know.  I'm not much on the "carpet" type plants as without more light they don't do well for me, although I do have this micro sword in one tank, very slow growing.
You would be correct on that plant in the first photo. I have 2 bunches. How would I go about attaching it to something?
 
I was about to ask about what that stuff was on the back of the leaves on that... I was worried it was doing something bad... is that normal?
 
You would be correct on that plant in the first photo. I have 2 bunches. How would I go about attaching it to something?
 
I was about to ask about what that stuff was on the back of the leaves on that... I was worried it was doing something bad... is that normal?
 
 
If attaching Java Fern to rock or wood, sometimes you can find a crevice that the rhizome can be gently stuck in.  Otherwise, you can use black cotton thread or fishing line.  Wrap it around the rhizome and the wood/rock, once or twice; eventually it will disintegrate (the thread anyway), and you cannot see it as it looks like part of the hair roots.
 
I assume what you mean is the black spot and roots.  This is the beginning of possible new plants, which develop on the fronds (=leaves).
 
Byron.
 

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