Si's Fishless Cycle

[PDSimon]

turns out its been 21 days

 

[kaivalagi]

 

[PDSimon]

I'm not quite sure where I am in the cycle at the moment but hopefully it will become clear in a few days!

 

[PDSimon]

If i'm going to be keeping some sort of cichlid it's best to get one of these right?

GH AND KH Hardness testing kit

 

[waterdrop]

It helps to have the attitude that you are the one in charge. You basically know what the patterns of the chemicals will be...

(ammonia will be dosed at 4-5ppm and will drop to zero and be dosed again. It will be slow to drop at first but then should drop daily. Nitrite will start at zero, then slowly rise and they keep reading off the chart every day for usually weeks on end. Nitrate will be wacky and unpredictable but will hopefully sometimes seem to help confirm that more nitrates are gradually being produced. Individual tests that seem way out of wack are just that, they are wrong and the other readings for the days surrounding them are the ones to be believed)

...and you are just looking for this cheap little chemical kit to roughly confirm (most of the time, but knowing it can be wacky or off on any given day) what you expect should be happening. Its the big things you care about ("3 days of "off the chart", oh, must be spiking.. 2 days of zero, "Oh, maybe nitrite is really getting dropped to zero now, lets see if it does it tomorrow...) not the details of one particure test day per se.

I have that same GH/KH test kit and it helps me have a further understanding of my water. GH gives me an overall idea of my mineral content and KH tells my how fast my mineral content and pH might have a tendency to change. If I have low pH because of low KH then KH is a much better leading indicator of when pH will "crash." If I am a highGH, highKH person then I will have hardly any KH,pH worries.

Your fishless cycle looks quite normal so far.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[PDSimon]

It helps to have the attitude that you are the one in charge. You basically know what the patterns of the chemicals will be...

(ammonia will be dosed at 4-5ppm and will drop to zero and be dosed again. It will be slow to drop at first but then should drop daily. Nitrite will start at zero, then slowly rise and they keep reading off the chart every day for usually weeks on end. Nitrate will be wacky and unpredictable but will hopefully sometimes seem to help confirm that more nitrates are gradually being produced. Individual tests that seem way out of wack are just that, they are wrong and the other readings for the days surrounding them are the ones to be believed)

...and you are just looking for this cheap little chemical kit to roughly confirm (most of the time, but knowing it can be wacky or off on any given day) what you expect should be happening. Its the big things you care about ("3 days of "off the chart", oh, must be spiking.. 2 days of zero, "Oh, maybe nitrite is really getting dropped to zero now, lets see if it does it tomorrow...) not the details of one particure test day per se.

I have that same GH/KH test kit and it helps me have a further understanding of my water. GH gives me an overall idea of my mineral content and KH tells my how fast my mineral content and pH might have a tendency to change. If I have low pH because of low KH then KH is a much better leading indicator of when pH will "crash." If I am a highGH, highKH person then I will have hardly any KH,pH worries.

Your fishless cycle looks quite normal so far.

~~waterdrop~~

ok

I think I've had quite a big nitrite spike. I just don't like how you don't know what ppm it is but never mind

I've been changing the filter floss quite often, it seems to block up quickly (a lot of gunk from the media was in the bag and just sits in the tank) so i'm going to syphon a little bit of it up tonight and leave the filter floss until the end of the cycle. it can block up within 12 hours sometimes! which can't be helping the cycle.

So waterdrop, what do you think about in my last stabilisation week about changing the pH ready for rams? Or shall I just do a water change(i know i would anyway - I just mean so that the water is 7.5 or less) and acclimatise the fish?

edit: note: for anyone intested I got an RCD apapter. Wasn't enough space behind the fish tank though because its quite bulky so I've had too just plug the heater in on its own. The extension cable is surge protected too, i hope that doesn't effect the RCD.

Theres sort of, translucent bits hanging onto the inside of the tank less than 1mm in size in little groups. Algae forming I imagine. Going to cover the tank

 

[kaivalagi]

I got an RCD too, using it between the wall plug and all the gang sockets for everything...no issues.

The bits hanging are algae I think, hair algae of some sort...just clean them off with a magnetic algae pad...you can't stop everything unless you out compete with plants from what I've read

Are you in a hard water area do you know, if so I wouldn't concern yourself with the KH/GH tests...sort of useful to determine CO2 from pH and KH but that's not all that accurate anyway. You'll probably only really need to test for GH/KH a few time over quite a long period and if they don't change then no need to measure again I'd say.

 

[PDSimon]

I got an RCD too, using it between the wall plug and all the gang sockets for everything...no issues.

The bits hanging are algae I think, hair algae of some sort...just clean them off with a magnetic algae pad...you can't stop everything unless you out compete with plants from what I've read

Are you in a hard water area do you know, if so I wouldn't concern yourself with the KH/GH tests...sort of useful to determine CO2 from pH and KH but that's not all that accurate anyway. You'll probably only really need to test for GH/KH a few time over quite a long period and if they don't change then no need to measure again I'd say.

lol, weird that we got it the same day. I tested it and it seems to work fine. 40 milliseconds apparently...

the magnet cleaners were a bit expensive in my LFS, will order online with KH and GH API tester tonight I thought the KH/GH would be useful to test my tap water, it is quite hard(apparently), but at a pH of about 7.4-7.5.

edit: oh and I found these. What do you think? peat slugs

they've got other things on there too, peat balls, indian almond tea bags..and peat fibre. I also saw some things at my LFS which are just like the teabags, you slot them inbetween the filter sponges but they seemed more chemical than natural

 

[waterdrop]

O dear, I'm probably too tired tonight to try and start dragging all the right data out of you to figure that out, busy day. Don't remember what your tap was and what the desired fish supposedly need and all that but it sounds like one of those cases of trying to take pH down, rather than up and that's a quite difficult task to do correctly and to do consistently over time. You may need a major consult with OM as that's another of his specialties.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[kaivalagi]

Not the best beginners thing from the sounds of it...I'd take a look at the alternative fish also available which match your 7.5 pH just in case...

 

[PDSimon]

its 7.5 and would beed to be 6.5 really but it could just just be 7. Just the lower the better for Bolivian Rams.

 

[kaivalagi]

its 7.5 and would beed to be 6.5 really but it could just just be 7. Just the lower the better for Bolivian Rams.

7.5 for Bolivians is okay isn't it? remember too that the 6.5 is for the natural habitat and is an ideal, however these fish are captive breed these days and will have adjusted somewhat...I have looked at a few caresheets and the range is 6.5- 7.5 so I think you'd be A okay with your natural water pH...

I'd love to breed a pair but I'd miss all the other types of fish you can get!

I keep forgetting you want a community tank...how many types of cichlid are you planning? Some community fish would stay away from eggs etc and others would have much choice

 

[PDSimon]

its 7.5 and would beed to be 6.5 really but it could just just be 7. Just the lower the better for Bolivian Rams.

7.5 for Bolivians is okay isn't it? remember too that the 6.5 is for the natural habitat and is an ideal, however these fish are captive breed these days and will have adjusted somewhat...I have looked at a few caresheets and the range is 6.5- 7.5 so I think you'd be A okay with your natural water pH...

I'd love to breed a pair but I'd miss all the other types of fish you can get!

I keep forgetting you want a community tank...how many types of cichlid are you planning? Some community fish would stay away from eggs etc and others would have much choice

I actually really liked the setup you said

Something along the lines of

1 male 2 females bolivian rams
~10 Cardinal/rummynose/black neon/penguin/black widow tetra...
5 kuhli loach
some sort of suckerfish or something like that

I'd love to keep shrimp but i want a sort of show fish like the ram, which would eat them.

and yes bolivian rams would do ok at 7.5 although it doesn't seem that complicated to lower the pH i think its worth it if it means your fish can thrive at say 7... I think if I liked the rams I would expand the collection to various cichlids, although thats the distant future so its not worth talking about!

I already want too many fish, I can see how addictive (and expensive) this hobby already is, never mind in the future!

 

[kaivalagi]

I actually really liked the setup you said

Something along the lines of

1 male 2 females bolivian rams
~10 Cardinal/rummynose/black neon/penguin/black widow tetra...
5 kuhli loach
some sort of suckerfish or something like that

I'd love to keep shrimp but i want a sort of show fish like the ram, which would eat them.

and yes bolivian rams would do ok at 7.5 although it doesn't seem that complicated to lower the pH i think its worth it if it means your fish can thrive at say 7... I think if I liked the rams I would expand the collection to various cichlids, although thats the distant future so its not worth talking about!

I already want too many fish, I can see how addictive (and expensive) this hobby already is, never mind in the future!

I think that stocking will look fab!

I thought like you and got a Roma 125 in late October 2009, Mid April 2010 I now have a 5fter and my Roma 125...I hope you have better will power than me, 6 months isn't long My wife will not let me have another so this is it now....

 

[PDSimon]

I actually really liked the setup you said

Something along the lines of

1 male 2 females bolivian rams
~10 Cardinal/rummynose/black neon/penguin/black widow tetra...
5 kuhli loach
some sort of suckerfish or something like that

I'd love to keep shrimp but i want a sort of show fish like the ram, which would eat them.

and yes bolivian rams would do ok at 7.5 although it doesn't seem that complicated to lower the pH i think its worth it if it means your fish can thrive at say 7... I think if I liked the rams I would expand the collection to various cichlids, although thats the distant future so its not worth talking about!

I already want too many fish, I can see how addictive (and expensive) this hobby already is, never mind in the future!

I think that stocking will look fab!

I thought like you and got a Roma 125 in late October 2009, Mid April 2010 I now have a 5fter and my Roma 125...I hope you have better will power than me, 6 months isn't long My wife will not let me have another so this is it now....

It would look really nice. Can yellow convicts only be kept as pairs because of their aggression when spawning or could you even keep those with some bigger dither fish?

I don't have better will power, just living at home being a student means I can keep a tank in my room but if I want a bigger one i'll have to move out or do one for my parents They fancy one of the big fluval tanks. It would be amazing to keep discus or something like that. I already want a shrimp tank like curiosity is doing...and a breeding tank like you're doing.. as well as my community Theres too many interesting fish and shrimp!