shouldn't a responsible seller list how big a fish will grow???

[Boundava]

NO; because there are many things you need to know about a species before you buy it - i'll list a few:
size
group/single
hard/soft water
temperature range
aggression level
jumper
delicate/robust
activity level
require strong current, gentle current or no current
.
.
.
Some sites do list more information - aquaticarts, impericaltropical, ... but while they may list more information they don't list enough to determine if it is suitable for your environment. You should imho understand the fish you are buying before you buy it - else you might walk into your local petco and buy the famous red-tail shark or common pleco....

I agree 1000%, I believe it's up to you as the fish keeper to responsibly research the fish that you are interested in getting and not on someone else to tell you how big it's going to get what water parameters it needs what tank size it needs. There's so much information out today that this is not a hard thing to do. Yes the stores should be somewhat responsible but ultimately it's up to you to look into what you're getting before you buy it.
Yes back in the day before cell phones it would be nice if the stores would let you know, however back then they didn't have the diversity that they do now. Also nowadays you have your cell phone on you and how hard is it to do a quick search about what you're looking at before you buy it? There's so much information that hand that is a poor excuse to blame the individuals who are selling the fish for not giving you all the information you need to make an educated purchase, understanding the long-term needs of this animal.

 

[gwand]

I agree 1000%, I believe it's up to you as the fish keeper to responsibly research the fish that you are interested in getting and not on someone else to tell you how big it's going to get what water parameters it needs what tank size it needs. There's so much information out today that this is not a hard thing to do. Yes the stores should be somewhat responsible but ultimately it's up to you to look into what you're getting before you buy it.
Yes back in the day before cell phones it would be nice if the stores would let you know, however back then they didn't have the diversity that they do now. Also nowadays you have your cell phone on you and how hard is it to do a quick search about what you're looking at before you buy it? There's so much information that hand that is a poor excuse to blame the individuals who are selling the fish for not giving you all the information you need to make an educated purchase, understanding the long-term needs of this animal.

So you prefer the poor fish to suffer due to the laziness of the buyer?

 

[GaryE]

So you prefer the poor fish to suffer due to the laziness of the buyer?

If the buyer is lazy, he or she will ignore the information anyway, as it may be inconvenient. If this were not true, there would not be a single Bala shark, Pacu, red tailed catfish or common pleco owned by anyone with more than a year's experience in the hobby. By then, they should understand the usefulness of learning about their fish.

There is no saving fish from the bad decisions of aquarists, if those aquarists don't value them enough to want to learn how to offer them a decent life.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

"You can lead a fish keeper to water, but you can't make them think"

 

[Innesfan]

What @GaryE said. Plus, as stated before, I don't think the low-information or newbie buyer is purchasing from wetspot, aquaticclarity, imperial and the like.

If you really want to see ignorance, poor judgment and even callousness in action, eavesdrop on a betta forum, gateway species that is. The forum I checked in on was a horror show of fish abuse. A few veteran aquarists try desperately to make constructive interventions but are usually ignored, "yes but-ed" or told that they read elsewhere that it's fine to keep a betta in a milk bottle. Now there is no lack of quality betta-care information in every format you can think of. The problem isn't with the information that is available, it is with those who do not avail themselves of it.

 

[gwand]

We will agree to disagree. I am not assuming that if sellers posts crucial information for the buyer, it will save all fish from abuse. But I do think it will save some fish from abuse. And that is sufficient for me to hold to my position. Not all naïve buyers are numb skulls.

 

[GaryE]

The info should be posted from an ideal seller. There we agree. The availability of info is as important as the availability of fish. But I don't hold the seller of uncommon fish responsible for it. If they offer, I like them more.

it's hard though, as most rare fish outfits are one person operations (with Wet Spot as an exception). Curating information takes time and energy. I've spent days with rare fish sellers, and their days are nuts. Endless window shopping e-mails from people who won't buy, but like to play at it. Questions galore. Water changing, new shipments arriving at 4 AM, and going out to freight at similar hours. You can make a good living at it, but it's a labour of love. When I looked at it, there was no way I could see doing it and being a father. The airport runs alone...

My favourite annoyance was how many people requested fish they knew were protected or illegal to import, and who became belligerent when the store refused to smuggle for them.

Ideally, they should pay writers to produce that information is an accessible form, he said, as an aquarium writer who used to get paid before the internet.

 

[Innesfan]

We will agree to disagree.

Of course.

Not all naïve buyers are numb skulls.

Nor am i suggesting that. I think one of the few things that the beleaguered and belittled staff in the box stores get right, is steering newbies to newbie fish. That's my point. They are not looking or contemplating getting a $25 schooling trout minnow at wetspot or a $60 Nannostomus at Dan's.