Oliver's Tank Gives Way

[waterdrop]

OK, its Tuesday and I'm back. You TFFers are so great - I'm really glad I posted about it even though I was almost too embarrased to.

I got a new tank. The operations manager was very nice and immediately swapped out the cracked tank for a matching new one of the same model. I brought it home and rinsed it up.

But here's where this whole story took a NEW TWIST! I have discovered the REASON, I think...

As you'll recall, this is one of those matching tank/stand sets you see all the time in the LFS now, right? At least, here in the US and in the big box stores this is what you see especially. This stand has top and bottom boards that match the shape of the tank exactly, with maybe a half inch overhang all around. The right half is a cabinet with a door, the left half has 3 little open shelves and a steel pole supporting the top board on that corner.

When I brought the new tank home I was all focused on being more extreme in my leveling process. I had my 5 foot carpenters level out and decided I would get very thin shims of some sort to raise the slightly lower side to really get my bubble centered on the level. I cruised the isles of the giant hardware store and finally found the perfect thing - long strips of sticky backed vinyl very thin strips, several inches wide. I turned the cabinet upside down and measured the perfect size, cut it with a razor knife, peeled the paper and stuck it to the underside on one side of the cabinet, finally getting the cabinet even more perfectly level than before - I was very pleased with myself....

As I smoothed my hand over the newly level top surface I suddenly realized that there was a BUMP! Slowly, to my dismay, I realized that the steel post of the front left corner must have a larger washer on top of it, inside the wood but that the weight of the floating tank edge must put its weight out around the outside edge, past this washer. The top of the post is just somehow pushing up and the wood material to form a little rounded bump.

Suddenly it all came clear! The front left corner of the tank had been sitting partially on this bump (were talking maybe 1/8th inch here?) and that's right where one side of the crack in the bottom glass started. This was also the very slightly lower side (the whole left side) of the overall tank that I had just shimmed up to make it more perfectly level -- so this would have been the lower side taking slightly more water pressure on the old tank that cracked. Anyway, the STAND, not the tank, caused the failure.

This stand is just a bad design! But of course I'm trying to work within the overall situation - I have lights at this 2ft length and my filter is sized for this volume tank, not to mention the replacement tank I've just wrestled home and my poor bacteria spending yet another night out in the cold shed while the heater probably runs a lot! (You feel very attached to your bacteria after 70 odd days

So its either solve the bump via moving the tank off-center to the very left edge of the top board, to minimize the bump effect and hope that the new leveling helps. Or solve the bump with a some sort of new foam layer that must contact the plastic bottom edge of the tank frame all around between the tank and stand. Or get the operations manager to swap the stand for an identical but new stand. Or scrap the entire tank and stand and maybe even lights risking even more time for my bacteria and plants out in the bucket (sheesh!!) I had trouble sleeping last night!

Well my TFF friends, that's where I'm at... gotta go wake the kids for school, see ya later,
~~waterdrop~~

 

[Miss Wiggle]

phew, well at least you know why it cracked, and that's half the battle now.

personally if it's dodgy design i'd be v tempted to either modify the design to fix it (or rather get Ian to do it for me) or go out and get a different tank/stand combo altogether.

 

[Colin_T]

if you modify the stand you will void the warranty on it.
Take the stand back to the shop and either swap it for another stand or dump the tank/stand combo and get something else. If you opt for another stand check it out thoroughly in the shop to make sure it doesn't have the same problem.
Then once you decide what to do buy a piece of 1inch thick polystyrene foam to go under the tank as well.

 

[pastabake]

Bad luck, but good that you got it exchanged and had your wits about you to save the bacteria.

I would get the stand changed.

 

[waterdrop]

Colin,

There are a couple of types of foams out there. There is the stiff white polystyrene that stays in stiff shapes. There is stuff often seen in thin sheets that can roll up that is maybe 1/8 inch thick commonly and seems sort of milky clear but is fairly tuff. Does an inch thick of stiff polystyrene compress down with 300+ pounds of tank on it?

~~waterdrop~~

 

[Colin_T]

you want the white polystyrene foam that is available in rigid sheets that snap if you are careless.

The thin brown polyurethane foam (foam rubber) is the same stuff they make sponge filters out of. You don't want to use that stuff.

The polystyrene foam normally holds its shape. However it does squish down sometimes if there is uneven pressure on it
eg: if the stand isn't level the weight from the tank will squish down one side of the foam.
If you have a floating base on the tank then the bottom edge of tank will probably compress the foam a bit.

 

[rabbut]

Don't use polestirine on a floating base It will caurse the tank to wobble, putting increased stress on the seams, possible caursing another blow-out..

You need to bump in the stand removed. If this involves havving a new tank stand combo package, then so be it It's best to get this fixed now, rather than risk a repeate of the cracking

All the best
Rabbut

 

[Gillymore]

Sorry to read about your tank failure waterdrop. It must be every aquarists worst worry for this to happen. How has your lad taken it all? I wish you both well with the new set up. All of this talk has got me worried about my tank/stand. The tank sems to sit on the stand with about 5mm to the edge of the stand.

What concerns me is that the stands front opening cupboard doesn't have a central "bracing" support of a wooden slat. The supporting slat has like a 1/3 to 2/3 sort of confuguration. 1/3 shelving...2/3 cupboard. Just worries me about possible load distribution.

(Bracing support slat running from the bottom of the stand to the top..the top wooden board being the base for the aquarium).

Easier to draw what I mean rather than describe it!!

 

[waterdrop]

Sorry to read about your tank failure waterdrop. It must be every aquarists worst worry for this to happen. How has your lad taken it all? I wish you both well with the new set up. All of this talk has got me worried about my tank/stand. The tank sems to sit on the stand with about 5mm to the edge of the stand.

What concerns me is that the stands front opening cupboard doesn't have a central "bracing" support of a wooden slat. The supporting slat has like a 1/3 to 2/3 sort of confuguration. 1/3 shelving...2/3 cupboard. Just worries me about possible load distribution.

(Bracing support slat running from the bottom of the stand to the top..the top wooden board being the base for the aquarium).

Easier to draw what I mean rather than describe it!!

You know what Gilly, I wouldn't worry about it. I sort of regret that this thread is in "New to the Hobby" rather than general discussion because Newcomers don't really need any more things to worry about! Having a tank fail is very rare. Most designs sold are good enough to do a decent job I think. I myself have had many tanks on tight-fitting stands in previous years with years of service and no failures. Of course it is new to me to have furniture, always before I had iron stands. I'll try to mention things I've learned from the mishap in the thread.

 

[waterdrop]

from Colin:

you want the white polystyrene foam that is available in rigid sheets that snap if you are careless.

The thin brown polyurethane foam (foam rubber) is the same stuff they make sponge filters out of. You don't want to use that stuff.

The polystyrene foam normally holds its shape. However it does squish down sometimes if there is uneven pressure on it
eg: if the stand isn't level the weight from the tank will squish down one side of the foam.
If you have a floating base on the tank then the bottom edge of tank will probably compress the foam a bit.

No, wouldn't use the sponge stuff, was thinking of this thinner very tuff stuff, hard to describe. I can see where thick polystyrene would be optimal, especially on a bigger table and especially with a non-floating base.

Don't use polestirine on a floating base It will caurse the tank to wobble, putting increased stress on the seams, possible caursing another blow-out..

You need to bump in the stand removed. If this involves havving a new tank stand combo package, then so be it It's best to get this fixed now, rather than risk a repeate of the cracking

All the best
Rabbut

Very timely in combo with Colin's -- I'd been feeling like the stand just doesn't have enough extra room with only 1 cm or less beyond the floating tank base edge. It was making me wish for a preformed styrofoam with a lip but I haven't got that and cutting the foam will be an issue too with a bowfront.

I just cruised the petsmart again and the other matching stand is sitting there, the one that was under my replacement tank. Now I'm thinking I will indeed go for that as a swap. Here's hoping I haven't hardened the guy...

Here are some lesson's I've learned:
-- I'll never keep any of my instruction pamphlets or other paper-based things in the cabinet beneath a tank.
-- I plan to use plastic between any tank and a wooden stand, to keep water from swelling the wood.
-- Inside the cabinet I had my cannister filter sitting in a large rubbermaid tub, this was great as it happened to catch a lot of the leaking tank water!
-- Anything you can do to protect your power strip from water is good.
-- Cannister filters have the unexpectedly good feature that they easily set up on bucket systems!
-- If you have to set up an emergency aquarium, access to faucets and being in heated spaces is good, just like for a main aquarium.
-- My air pump was way above my tank, which protected it from the spill as well as ensuring water won't siphon in its airlines, no stop valve needed.

~~waterdripping~~

 

[backtotropical]

~~waterdripping~~

 

[waterdrop]

~~waterdripping~~

Thx BTT, need to make myself laugh some at all this.

Got the boys to haul the heavy tank stand out to the van tonight. Will attempt replacement tomorrow. Decided the bump was too much to work around.

At least I can still use the extra time to continue thinking about stocking. Discovered an old Colin post today where he advises that Black Skirt Tetras can be fin nippers, especially with Angels. I was actually thinking about a couple of both and now will reconsider.

If a stranger came into my shed, he'd have to wonder what the heck is going on in there with buckets and tubes and pumps and lights. Instead of a still, its a bacteria factory ... what an exhausting series of days and it isn't over by a long shot.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[ThatGuy]

wow man i just read the whole thing, i'm sorry to hear all of this. good luck with it all.

 

[Miss Wiggle]

Here are some lesson's I've learned:
-- I'll never keep any of my instruction pamphlets or other paper-based things in the cabinet beneath a tank.
-- I plan to use plastic between any tank and a wooden stand, to keep water from swelling the wood.
-- Inside the cabinet I had my cannister filter sitting in a large rubbermaid tub, this was great as it happened to catch a lot of the leaking tank water!
-- Anything you can do to protect your power strip from water is good.
-- Cannister filters have the unexpectedly good feature that they easily set up on bucket systems!
-- If you have to set up an emergency aquarium, access to faucets and being in heated spaces is good, just like for a main aquarium.
-- My air pump was way above my tank, which protected it from the spill as well as ensuring water won't siphon in its airlines, no stop valve needed.

~~waterdripping~~

Yeah for sure,

always try to sit external filters in a tub, if for no other reason than when i'm cleaning them i always make a mess.

ian rigged up behind one of our tanks a sheet of ply on the wall which he then hooked extension leads on to for all the stuff for the tank. tucked away behind the tank so it didn't look terrible but also way off the floor so no spillages will blow your electric

one day i will learn to not just stick instruction leaflets etc under the tanks, i've had loads of them ruined over time from little spillages, still don't learn and just stick them in there though.

 

[waterdrop]

O, good day! The operations manager at Petsmart was as nice as could be. Swapped out the tank stand furniture for a new one and put it in my van for me smooth as could be - even allowed that I can swap it again to an entirely different stand and tank type if it all fails again. This really reflects well on Petsmart and on this particular store.

Given the tight width match of tank to stand, not wanting to introduce any wobbliness, I have decided to only add a sheet of heavier black plastic moisture barrier between to tank and stand, hoping to protect the particleboard/plywood(whatever it is!) from future moisture swelling. The pressure around the support post may turn out to be unrelated to moisture swelling though, so I plan to periodically inspect it.

Whew! Soon I hope to start a happy thread and let this downer one die out - hate for newbies to fret about more negatives than they need to! Really it just shows that anything that goes wrong can be sorted out, especially "with a little help from your friends!" (friends in TFF that is!)

~~waterdrop~~