flowerhorn

Can you even find these fish at your lfs?I have never seen them and if so under what name?

Most asian LFS will have FLowerHorn. Quite expensive. Expect to pay $40 for smal FL and up to few grands for adult.

The reason they are popular and expensive because of FengSui (for Asian culture)
 
I would like to know your opinion on not exactly hybrids but fish that had been bred for their "freaky appearance"such as the japanese/chinese and the infamous gold fish.Say.......orandas,black moores,bubble eyes,there are some that have eyes like the moores only looking up with an arched back and no dorsals.They all look freaky,and it's obvious that a fish like that would not occur in nature,never mind survive.I ask this because some say it's not fare that breeders are creating these not so natural looking fish.
Another example...hairless cats,and lets not talk dogs.A chihuahua and a great dane look like totally different species to an visitor from outer space.Do you see my point?these fish are created or bred simply for our crazy need to see something weird anf freaky.People always goes for the crazy looking and thats exactly why a bood parrot will sell pretty well,the same goes with a ballon mollie(which by the way I concider much uglier than a parrot)and the gold fish mentioned above.

I really would like to hear your opinions.
 
Here is the main reason why I like FL:

If you no longer want to keep the fish, you may sell it and still make some money B)
 
Colisa lalia said:
On top of that if that thing interbreeds with it's parent species what then, a lot of weak hybrids that's what.
I though Hybrid couln't breed. things like mules and zorse's and ligers can't breed because there born steril. maybe it's only for mammels.
 
I have also heard of the blood parrot thing, and also of a liger breeding with a bengal tiger and giving birth to two perfectly healthy cubs
 
would like to know your opinion on not exactly hybrids but fish that had been bred for their "freaky appearance"such as the japanese/chinese and the infamous gold fish.Say.......orandas,black moores,bubble eyes,there are some that have eyes like the moores only looking up with an arched back and no dorsals.They all look freaky,and it's obvious that a fish like that would not occur in nature,never mind survive.I ask this because some say it's not fare that breeders are creating these not so natural looking fish.

IMO, fish like that should never be created or be in the hobby. I don't think it's a matter of purity but more of a matter of cruelty to fish. I'm not a purist in any sense of the imagination. I have no problem with hybrids if they just keep them out of the market. It's just too hard to tell what a fish is at the fry/juvie stage.
I do however, have a problem with blood parrots and the type of fish you mentioned above. I see that as totally different than hybridization.

A chihuahua and a great dane look like totally different species to an visitor from outer space.Do you see my point?

I see what you're saying but dogs are all the same species.

I though Hybrid couln't breed. things like mules and zorse's and ligers can't breed because there born steril. maybe it's only for mammels.

Almost all blood parrots are sterile but a very few are able to breed. If you put a blood parrot with a cichlid it's chances are better perhaps. FH's aren't sterile, at least most of them from what I've heard.
 
THE CABBAGE PATCH SYNDROME

I am certain that people always goes for something different and weird and usually find these "cute".Thats what I like to call the cabbage patch dolls syndrome.Remember the ugly dolls?Everybody wanted one when they first came out.Different?yeah,but cute?COME ON!!They were butt ugly!!
I believe that is exactly whats going on today with the FH and the blood parrots.People find them attractive,and like I said before, as long as there's a market forthem,there would be breeders.Not that I am all for it either but thats reality.

SMB.......About the chihuahuas and great danes.Some people expressed their opinions saying that some of these hybrids were ugly and in some cases like the blood parrot,or the fish you described without a caudal tail,are not what nature intended.And agree with everybody.However,a chihuahua?smaller than a cat,I would not call them "normal".
Dachshunds are cute,short legged long thin bodies,I mean,everybody loves them.Think for a moment and you realized they are "freaky"looking.They are not what nature intended.They have numerous medical problems with their backs and NOBODY ever says"Stop the dachshund breeding".The same goes with the diff.gold fish I mention on the previous post.

So basically what I wanted to know was......How people felt about these freaky animals,what do you think of selecting breeding within the same species like the gold fish and the balloon mollies?
 
okay I am going to say this I didn't want to but I will. Ramesses your compairison of a HUNTING dog to a fish isn't even in the same ball park. yes people breed the ancesters of these dogs because they had certin traits that they wanted, BUT there is the difference THEY WERE BRED!!!! not created in some test tube, by some sick and twisted person that all they wanted to do was test to see if it could be done, and while they were at it make a few $$$ while they were at it.
 
I'm with juanveldez many types of animal have been selectively bred, but red parrots and flowerhorns just shouldn't be. LFS shouldn't stock them since most of them have bent spines, mouths that don't close properly and fin deformaties , but the "heh lets make a quick buck anyway" attitude seems to be doing well, which is shame really because there are so many interesting fish out there to buy without having to go as low as frankenstein monsters.

David :fish:
 
must chime in and agree with juanvaldez. hybrid fish were created. they weren't bred for specific traits or functions. they were created to see what kind of weird creature was produced. as posted, people have a strange attraction to stuff that looks weird or unnatural.
by the way, do you know why dachshunds have the long bodies and short stumpy legs? they were bred with a specific purpose in mind and those traits were specifically selected and bred. they were meant to be long and and short to handle low growth brush and to fit in rodent holes. doxies were bred to hunt rodents. thats also why there are other shorter stumpy leg dogs, so they could go low.
oh, and chihuahuas and great danes aren't hybrids. they CAN reproduce. and they weren't bred to look weird (chihuahuas DO come in the long haired variety and look "normal").
dog lover, had to rant. sorry -_-
 
I was NOT talking about hybrids when I mentioned certain dogs.I simply used that as an example to what happen when people see something weird or unusual and automatically they tend to love it and even call it cute.This is what I called "the cabbage patch doll syndrome".
This is exactly what happens with the blood parrots today,people find them intriguing and yes,"cute".
I never said anything bad about those breeds of dogs,so please,simmer down!
I do love dogs and yes, I did know why the dachshunds are shapped the way they are.I had one and I had to put it to sleep after suffering from vertebrae problems.
Now,lets move on to my original question...............and remember I am not for the "hybrids" ............What do you thing about animals bred for their not so common shape or appearance?example the different gold fish like the bubble eyes,orandas and black moores among others.
The reason I want to know is,some pleople hate these new hybrids and mention that is cruel to "create" such deformed animals.But,---------and remember I am not in favor of the hybrids------------what about the poor bubble eye gold fish having to swim with two oxygen bags underneath their eyes?some dont have dorsal fins and a bent back?I would called that cruelty,and yes,they had been bred thruogh centuries yet,I dont hear anybody complain the fact that they are offered at your LFS.
 
no I am not being rude or ignorant but let me spell this out very carfuly. I don't agree with hybridization but I do agree with selective breeding, for traits but as you so carfully pointed out some of this selective breeding has resulted in extreams. and that is a shame, I just hate how people feel the need to compair dogs and fish. to further promote their point of veiw that there are just as many different variations of fish.

I was NOT talking about hybrids when I mentioned certain dogs

what do you think that this whole thing is about? I really think that it is time to stop playing devils advocate!!! this is entirely a black and white issue. there is no grey here. it is fne to say that you dissagree with hybirdiztion, but there is not a reason to keep throwing gas on the fire.
 
ramesses, you say the same thing with every post..."you aren't for hybrids but want to know what others think" and when they give you their opinion you come back with some cabbage patch doll thing or dogs or whatever but you reitterate your stance that you don't agree with hybridization but argue with those that don't agree with it also!

You wouldn't argue so much if you agreed with us. If you don't, then that's fine and perfectly within your rights and I respect that but state your ideals and take a stand on it one way or the other about this for once or this will never come to any conclusion. It's hard to debate someone when they don't have a stance and are all over the place and agree with everything but then...... they don't. :crazy:
 
Well...
I'll give my 2 cents but I'm very wishy washy on the subject. I agree that it's wrong to mess with nature. When they announced the birth of that cloned baby awhile back I instantly said "eeewwww, it should be destroyed, that's just sooo wrong" but at the same time I felt awful for saying that :/ (only a little though)

My lfs has about 6 flowerhorns right now. I see them all the time and well, they're just so sweet (but aggressive). I can't help but feel sorry for them, it seems like they're doomed to miserable homeless lives just because someone thought it would be a good idea to make some cash. So it seems to me that there IS a grey area because I'm in it on the subject.The first time I saw one I tried to be repulsed but I just couldn't, I couldn't help but feel compassion for them. The fact remains that they will continue to create these poor mutants & they'll continue to rot & die in stores :/ , it's more than likely not a "just don't buy them & they'll stop making them" type industry.
 

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