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Discus fish

Hollyk10987

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Hello. I’m new to these forums so bare with.
I’m quarantining 6 discus fish and they keep on twitching and rubbing against things so I thought it was something irritating them. They are eating just fine but peppering is getting more intense. They aren’t old enough to breed so it’s not breeding behaviour. Their poop is normal although every now and again they poop white but I think that’s the beef heart, though I’m aware that happens with internal parasites it’s odd their eating. I’ve treated for flukes and worms but it’s still happening. Tank parameters are good. I do water changes twice a week or even more. There are no visable signs off anything external but this has been happening for 3 weeks now that I’ve noticed. Any ideas would be appreciated!
 
What do you mean by peppering?
What is the temperature of the water?
What is the ammonia, nitrite and nitrate of the tank water?

What is the GH (general hardness), KH (carbonate hardness) and pH of your water supply?
This information can usually be obtained from your water supply company's website or by telephoning them. If they can't help you, take a glass full of tap water to the local pet shop and get them to test it for you. Write the results down (in numbers) when they do the tests. And ask them what the results are in (eg: ppm, dGH, or something else).

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Any chance of a picture and short 30 second video of the fish?
If the pictures are too big for the website, set the camera's resolution to its lowest setting and take some more. The lower resolution will make the images smaller and they should fit on this website. Check the pictures on your pc and find a couple that are clear and show the problem, and post them here. Make sure you turn the camera's resolution back up after you have taken the pics otherwise all your pictures will be small.

If the video is too big for this website, post it on YouTube and copy & paste the link here. We can view it at YouTube. If you are using a mobile phone to take the video, have the phone horizontal so the video takes up the entire screen. If you have the phone vertical, you get video in the middle and black on either side.

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Fish do a stringy white poop for several reasons.
1) Internal Bacterial Infections causes the fish to stop eating, swell up like a balloon, breath heavily at the surface or near a filter outlet, do stringy white poop, and die within 24-48 hours of showing these symptoms. This cannot normally be cured because massive internal organ failure has already occurred.

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2) Internal Protozoan Infections cause the fish to lose weight rapidly (over a week or two), fish continues to eat and swim around but not as much as normal, does stringy white poop. If not treated the fish dies a week or so after these symptoms appear. Metronidazole normally works well for this.

There is a medication (API General Cure) that contains Praziquantel and Metronidazole.

It's interesting that API and the Californian government have listed Metronidazole as a carcinogen. That's a concern considering it was widely used to treat intestinal infections in people.

Anyway, if you use this or any medication, handle with care, don't inhale the medication, and wash hands with soapy water after treating the fish or working in the tank.

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3) Intestinal Worms like tapeworm and threadworms cause the fish to lose weight, continue eating and swimming normally, and do a stringy white poop. Fish can do this for months and not be too badly affected. In some cases, fish with a bad worm infestation will actually gain weight and get fat and look like a pregnant guppy. This is due to the huge number of worms inside the fish.

If the fish are still eating well, then worms is the most likely cause.

You can use Praziquantel to treat tapeworm and gill flukes. And Levamisole to treat thread/ round worms. If you can't find these medications, look for Flubendazole, which treats both lots of worms.

Remove carbon from filters before treatment and increase aeration/ surface turbulence to maximise oxygen levels in the water.

You treat the fish once a week for 4 weeks. The first treatment will kill any worms in the fish. The second, third and forth treatments kill any baby worms that hatch from eggs inside the fish's digestive tract.

Treat every fish tank in the house at the same time to prevent cross contamination.
You do a 75% water change and complete gravel clean 24-48 hours after treatment.
Clean the filter 24 hours after treatment too.

Do not use the 2 medications together. If you want to treat both medications in a short space of time, use Praziquantel on day one. Do a 75% water change and gravel clean the substrate on day 2 & 3. Treat the tank with Levamisole on day 4 and do a 75% water change and gravel clean on day 5, 6 & 7 and then start with Praziquantel again on day 8.

The water changes will remove most of the medication so you don't overdose the fish the next time you treat them. The gravel cleaning will suck out any worms and eggs that have been expelled by the fish. Repeating the treatment for 3-4 doses at weekly intervals will kill any worms that hatch from eggs. At the end of the treatment you will have healthier fish.
 
Just to add some information since Colin had covered most of it.

Seems to me that your Discus is having:
1)Internal parasites - white poop
2)External parasites - either skin flukes or gill flukes that caused them to scratch. Watch for any fast breathing which can be caused by gill flukes.

The peppering is natural for Red/orange colour Discus when there is dark/black bottom and background.
Change your tank background and bottom to something lighter colours to reduce the peppering.
I like blue for background and something very light for the bottom. I used a very light pink which is almost like white colour.
Don't use dark bottom as the fish can see their own reflection and get frightened by it.

What medications have you been using to treat the flulkes and worms?
Some medications are no longer effective any more due to overused(according to Colin). The parasites have developed immunity against the medications.

Also, you may need to treat them longer as the flukes eggs can last for a long time.
I have been treating my tank for months but still the flukes keep coming back.
 
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It sounds like you have two issues as already pointed out by Colin_T and Lajos_Detari, being internal and external parasites. In the case of external parasites, I’m a big proponent of 3% salt dips for discus provided they are healthy enough to endure a little stress.

Also worth noting, do you know the source of your discus? Are these Stendker, Asian, American bred or a generic LFS Discus? It makes a difference as they all have generations exposed to different conditions and have different immunities to certain bacterial strains. The mixing of Stendker and Asian lines in the same aquarium, for example, is very frowned upon. Similar to how the Columbian exchange brought smallpox to the New World, German Stendker lineage is not immune to bacterial strains found in Asian lines and may result in death quickly. The “discus plague” is a study in epidemiology playing out in our home aquariums.
 

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