A Bad Day in an LFS

Hey again
Just read your last post directed at Jeff.
This sounds like a great idea if Jeff would do it, he is a friend who is studying law, this means he will know all the right people anyway and this will more than likely scare the shop into submission.
 
Stand by your legal rights, please, if you don't you will regret it later, especially when you see something for $84 that you really like and you can't have because that money went to this lfs for a tank they themselves never actually bought!!!!!!!!!! Believe me you will kick yourself!!

It's happened already, LOL. I'm sore (bruises) and tired (lack of sleep last night...) and would love to be able to surf the net and just relax while in bed...but my network cable doesn't reach that far. So I said, more just thinking out loud than anything else "I'd love to be able to just rest in bed and mess around with my laptop."

And my husband, God love him, says: "Wireless cards are about $85." LOL. I said "Really, he said "Hell if I know anymore, I just pulled a number out of my a$$." LOL. But yeah. :p
 
Becca said:
What I've done since the phone calls:
Wait, it gets better. Thanks to michiganreefers.com - I've been in contact with the fellow who's tank I landed in. :p He's not pissed at me at all (fortunately)! In fact, he's actually quite happy that the store was honest about it. (According to him, the store called, said "We have your tank, it was finished, but a customer broke it. We're replacing it.") Apparently, if I'm understanding the situation right, the store did not buy the tank...he bought it and brought it in for drilling. (?) If I understand this correctly, the store paid NO money in ANY way to buy the tank.

They simply took the tank in, drilled it, then set it out on the floor, sideways, in front of another stack of tanks, that held some items for sale. They have set him up with a new tank, though of a different brand. It's not a Great Lakes tank, I wish I knew what brand it was, because quite honestly, they're charging me retail (and I know this now) for a Great Lakes Drilled tank.
if i am understanding this correctly the mans tank was at the store to be drilled. it was not the stores. so it should be settled between you and the man, not you and the store owners.


[SORRY IF MY SPELLING OR INFORMATION IS MISSLEADING I WAS JUST IN ARIZONA TO GIVE SUPORT WHEN A FRIENDS HORSE HAD TO BE PUT DOWN]
 
my dad says "the store had it, they are responsible for it. she don't have to pay ####."

just thought i'd quote his opinion on it :D
 
i dont know why some of you people are so cheap and selfish. becca doesnt mind paying for the tank, perhaps becca is not even legally required to pay for the tank. although morally she should. i guess it boils down to morals, which lawyers, espically second year ones, lack.

some of you people really let me down.
 
csr, your completely right.....if she wants to completely waste a bunch of money on something so stupid when she probably doesn't even have to....i guess she could :rolleyes:
 
When I was a kid, my Dad would always say to us, "Don't touch! I don't want to end up buying that." :lol:
 
Ok, we've got all the facts now, so let's look at this from an outside perspective. The bad thing is, now I'm coming up with a "You know...I really don't think I should have to pay anything...". I don't want to be branded a bad person here, but given the facts of the matter, I'm just well - confused.

Customer A has a 75-Gallon tank that he wants to have drilled. The warranty expired on the tank, and he purchased it second hand from a fellow fish hobbyist. He takes the tank into his LFS and asks them to drill it for an overflow tank.

The LFS warns Customer A that they may damage the tank during the process of drilling, and if that is the case - they cannot be held responsible for the damages. Customer A agrees to these terms and goes on about his merry way. Customer A's tank goes through drilling and comes out great. LFS calls him to tell him it's done and he's excited. LFS sets the tank on the sales floor and waits for the customer to pick it up.

Customer B comes in to look at rock and other various decorations for her tank. She notices a piece of driftwood sitting in 55-Gallon tank, which is doubling (as many other empty tanks in the store are) as a make-shift storage contaner. Since there are no signs posted saying to ask for assistance with certain items...and since she's been in the store before and has seen, and participated in, rummaging around items left in the tanks/storage bins, she attempts to help herself.

Unfortunately, the storage bin Customer A is trying to access is a 55-Gallon tank, set on top of about 2 or 3 other tanks. Immediately in front of this stack of 55-Gallon tanks/storage bins is a 75-Gallon tank, laying on it's front pane of glass (so the blue back panel is facing the ceiling). It's protruding out about an inch or so from the rest of the line of tanks to it's right and left. But, this isn't anything major.

Customer A - attempts to reach inside of the top 55-Gallon tank, and cna't quite reach in. Without realizing the blue "object" in front of her is an aquarium, she kneels into it for a bit of support and crash...the tank crashes through.

If you end the story here, in my eyes, Customer B owes Customer A a tank. She should have realized that the blue object in front of her was a tank and been more sensitive to the item. If she couldn't reach the item in the 55-Gallon...asking a store employee for some help would have been an alternative method instead of trying to stretch even further.

But, the story does not end there.

The staff rushes to the crash site to see Customer B and her husband standing over what is now a shattered 75-Gallon tank. They're awe-struck, and she's still in a state of shock. How do we handle this? The only thing racing through Customer B's mind is that she broke it, she has to buy it, so before a word is uttered by the staff...she offers to pay for the damages.

The staff takes off to take care of business. One stands "guard" at the door, one starts to clean up the mess, and one prices out the tank. Customer B is told that the price of the tank is $150...she makes arrangements to pay the tank, still in a bit of shock.

Later that evening, it dawns on her that she's being charged retail and posts messages on forums asking for help. She's agreed to a price that she's not so sure is fair to her. She gets an overwhelming response not from one, but two, forums telling her that she shouldn't have to pay a dime, let alone wholesale.

She sits on it a while, still of the opinion that regardless of who was at fault, the tank was broken by her body, so she owes the store a replacement.

Then she meets, and talks to, Customer A. Customer A has already been taken care of. The LFS has pulled one of their 75-Gallons from their stock, painted the back blue (to match his previous tank) provided him with a new warranty (since it's a new tank) and even drilled this tank for an overflow. Obviously, Customer A is very happy with the service he received, as well he should be.

But a thought has occured to me. When I check my items in for service, I'm entrusting the company to care for the product and return it to me, as I gave it to them, with any changes or modifications I've requested and paid for. For instance, let's say I take my laptop in for service. I check it in, and while it's in their care, after the fixes have been made, they place it back on the sales floor. Let's say a clumsy customer accidentally knocks it off the shelf. Sure, it could have been avoided if he/she paid more attention, but the point is, it was an accident.

In the mean time, the laptop needs to be repaired. Since there was an understood agreement between the me and the store regarding the care of my latop, shouldn't they have been the ones to restore the item?

I say yes. And that's where I'm getting confused. :/ It's basically the same situation as what happened to me with the tank; however, I just can't shake the feeling that I should be somehow responsible for the damages I caused. :( Maybe it's because I still feel bad because I broke a tank. Maybe it's because I feel guilty. Whatever the reason, I still have this nagging bit of guilt that says "I don't have to pay it, but I should." Legally, I'm not obliged to pay a dime. Morally, I feel as though I should and I'm not sure I could live with the guilt unless I somehow offered to fix the item. If they refuse my money, fine. That's another story, but at least I can say I offered and they took care of it.

The only way to really rectify the situation is to call the owner tomorrow and explain everything to him. Maybe I'll get lucky and he'll not make a big deal out of it and let it go.

Regardless of what happens - I want to thank everyone here for hearing me out and following the post through. It means a lot to me knowing that I've got people in my corner who think that even offering to pay wholesale, instead of retail, is more than I should be obligated to do. That helps making approach this whole fiasco with the owner tomorrow that much smoother.

Sorry for the long post, but I needed a good ranting. :)
 
cometcattle said:
I hope everything works out Becca.
Me too. My nerves are a wreck. I keep reading everyone saying "You shouldn't have to pay a dime" and in some respects I agree with them. But, much like you posted earlier, I was raised walking through stores with my parents echoing "Don't touch, I can't afford to buy that..."

The bottom line here is - regardless of who was more at fault for the break, I did in fact, break the tank. It doesn't matter how I broke it - I did. And because of that, with the way I was raised I just can't shake that nagging feeling that I am responsible, in someway, help to correct the situation.

Who knows, maybe tomorrow I'll call and the owner will be very nice about the whole situation and just write it off. If so, then I'll count my lucky stars, be exremely devoted to the store and probably be on cloud 9 for the rest of the week.

If not, then I'm stuck. I honestly feel like I'm obligated to pay for the tank, but I feel like I should only have to pay the store's cost for the item. I'm not getting any use or enjoyment out of the item (the tank is literally destroyed) so why should they get to make a profit off of the incident? This is where I'm hoping my courage and nerves won't fail me and I'll be able to stand firm on offering only what I know to be the store's cost for a 75-Gallon GLA.

I'll let you all know how it pans out tomorrow. Again, thanks much for being supportive of me. It's nice to know, if nothing else, I have a place that I can vent stuff like this too!
 
csr you are getting out of hand. you need to lay off the insults. everyone has a right to their opinion. everyone here has a right to express it. becca started this post for help. she got others opinions without insults. you have been nothing but insulting.

if this gets out of hand i will close this down.
 
Becca said:
Me too. My nerves are a wreck. I keep reading everyone saying "You shouldn't have to pay a dime" and in some respects I agree with them. But, much like you posted earlier, I was raised walking through stores with my parents echoing "Don't touch, I can't afford to buy that..."
I only quoted a small part.

but NEVER pay for it if your break it accidently, that goes for anything in a retail store. even test driving a car, you crash it for any reason but deliberatly, walk away.

It matters 100% how your broke it, and that is that it was not on purpose. Thats what matters.


It doesnt matter if the store was holding it for a customer, it was on the stores property and in thier RETAIL store, not in the back or anything.
the store is 100% liable for that tank.

as for your laptop analigy, if they did that you could sue them, as its your personal laptop, and has your personal information on it. you are giving the tech permision to use, no one else. but thats a whole different book. for your purpose with your laptop analigy yes the store would be responcible to replace your computer.


I know your feel the need to make right, but the make right is not letting the store perform this injustice on you.
Not only do your have the RIGHT to not pay, but have a law that says you dont have to pay.

I feel like breaking out the law books and quoting, but its summer time, and a wireless laptop sitting on the deck after getting out of hte pool is all too nice.

PS, a wireless network card is about 60 bucks, but the wireless router/hub that you need is about 90 for a good one.

or 100' of cat5 cable (network cable) is about 40 bucks if you buy from the right place.




And thanks for saying I will make a good lawyer, glad that my hard work will actually come in handy, and is.
Your lucky you didnt catch me a few weeks ago while studying for my final, or my post would be full of words that even I would have to look up if I read it later.

Hope you realize that its your right not to pay, and that paying will hurt you more then in hte pocket book, but in knowing that you let that store know they can take advantage of people.

Good Luck, hope you make the right decision.
 
Best of luck Becca. Glad you weren't hurt. Sounds like you have a plan that you're committed to in dealing with this.

I'm not sure if this question has been asked yet in this way, but what if you had been seriously injured in the accident (severed artery, permanent nerve damage, for instance)? Nobody would begrudge you for filing a lawsuit against the company for negligence (ask jeffrey, but I'll bet they'd try to settle or pay hospital bills very early in the process). So...does it make them less negligent because you weren't hurt?

I'd say no, because the potential for harm to occur was present, and you unwittingly were placed in harm's way.

Accidents happen, and when they happen on the job or at work, the employer or merchant takes responsibility if they occur as a result of their negligence. In short, I wouldn't pay them for the tank (but that's just me).

And as to the question of morality: anybody who is grappling this much with a dilemma in which there are good arguments to both sides and soliciting so many opinions must be, by definition, engaging it on a ethical level.
 
sinistral said:
Best of luck Becca. Glad you weren't hurt. Sounds like you have a plan that you're committed to in dealing with this.

I'm not sure if this question has been asked yet in this way, but what if you had been seriously injured in the accident (severed artery, permanent nerve damage, for instance)? Nobody would begrudge you for filing a lawsuit against the company for negligence (ask jeffrey, but I'll bet they'd try to settle or pay hospital bills very early in the process). So...does it make them less negligent because you weren't hurt?

I'd say no, because the potential for harm to occur was present, and you unwittingly were placed in harm's way.

Accidents happen, and when they happen on the job or at work, the employer or merchant takes responsibility if they occur as a result of their negligence. In short, I wouldn't pay them for the tank (but that's just me).

And as to the question of morality: anybody who is grappling this much with a dilemma in which there are good arguments to both sides and soliciting so many opinions must be, by definition, engaging it on a ethical level.
sinistral - no. I haven't thought of it in that way. And, quite honestly - I've worked in medical billing for a few years (I'm actually in I.T. for a Medical Billing company, but I have a good working knowledge of how Medical claims are handled.) Knowing what I do know about insurance and liability, I would have no choice but to seek medical compensation for the damanges. Regardless of whether I caused the accident or not, the accident happened within the store, and they would be required to cover the cost of my medical expenses via their Liability Insurance.

In that case, would I still pay damages for the tank - I don't know. I want to say yes, but not having been in that situation, it's hard for me to reply. I'd like to think that I'd still offer, but a part of me would truely hope that if that had happened, the store wouldn't even think of bringing up the incident.

Either way, you bring up a good point. And, I probably am just putting way too much thought into this. Accidents happen. We live, we learn, we get over it. It sounds like it's jsut time to move on. I just have to decide if that means I'm moving on with a lighter pocketbook. A good nights sleep should help me decide.
 
Sleep well. At the risk of being presumptuous, I think what is most fascinating about your dilemma is that it seems to strike right at the heart of who you believe you are. How does one navigate between two halves of the self? :)
 

Most reactions

Back
Top