29 Gallon Build

[showjyr]

I've been searching high and low on the net for over a week and can't find a tank. I'm not looking for anything special.

All I want is a 20 to 29 gallon tank(same footprint 30x12 1/2 inches) It needs to be drilled with atleast one hole for a bulkhead and have an overflow. Acrylic euro braced or rimless glass would be best but at this point anything will do.

I cannot find anyone local to drill a tank and I don't dare to myself. Glasscages.com won't ship glass UPS and says the acrylic that size is too small for an overflow and 2 holes which i don't completely understand. Then they told me a 10 gallon that i wanted was too small for them to convert to a sump.


I'm really scratching my head on this and if i can't find something soon I give up.

 

[Tommy Gun]

Have you tried Craigslist? Usually a good place to look for local deals....I believe you can narrow searches down to an exact city, or at least the nearest major city to you.

Is having a drilled tank your only desire? If not, there are other good options out there as well such as an HOB overflow. I admit that I was spoiled with my first tank because it was drilled and was skeptical about going to an HOB overflow, but found that they are just as good in nearly every aspect. I do sort of agree that having an in-tank overflow box would put a significant dent in the living area of a 20 to 30 gallon tank.

Otherwise perhaps look at the biocube (or similar brands) tanks since they basically come with everything you need, including filtration and lighting. I also have found that more and more skimmer options are becoming available for them which used to be more hard to find for a reasonable price.

I have a good friend who has found good success in drilling a tank using a dremel tool (or similar brand) and a more specialized bit on it (want to say diamond tipped, but can't be sure) versus using the key hole or large bits for a regular type drill. The thing I want to emphasize here though is that I haven't done this myself and so it is a second-hand account, but I could perhaps get you in touch with my friend if this really interests you.

 

[showjyr]

Thanks tommy. It would be great if you could get me a little info on the dremel bit used and how he did it, as i already have a dremel. I might be willing to give it a go if i have no other options.

I'm really set on having the tank drilled with an overflow as I recently built a stand for a tank of that size with a 30x12 1/2 inch footprint. I also want to see nothing, black background with a black overflow, little to no pipe work, nothing HOB, and a 10 gal sump in the stand for heater, skimmer, pump, refugium, ect.

The tank that is in the stand now is an AGA 20 but i could get a 29 and buy an acrylic overflow for either(if i decide to drill myself).

On an AGA tank of that size would it be safe to remove the top frame or is that designed as structure for the tank, i.e. would the pressure from the water pull the seems apart?

 

[Tommy Gun]

It would be great if you could get me a little info on the dremel bit used and how he did it, as i already have a dremel.

I sent some contact info to you via a private message so you can learn how he did it, ok?

I also want to see nothing, black background with a black overflow, little to no pipe work, nothing HOB, and a 10 gal sump in the stand for heater, skimmer, pump, refugium, ect.

Well, I guess that is one of the larger reasons for using adding a sump, but I don't think you can set it up so you see nothing at all, especially if you went with the built-in overflow since they are hard to miss even if it is the same color as your background - trust me, I had the exact same thing and one of the first questions I would hear when someone looked at my tank for the first time was 'What is that thing?' In fact, my current HOB overflow is probably harder to spot because it is only about 3 inches of it are actually in the tank and it is clear; although the advantage of it being clear is defeated by algae and whatnot, probably because it is so close to the light.

On an AGA tank of that size would it be safe to remove the top frame or is that designed as structure for the tank, i.e. would the pressure from the water pull the seems apart?

Because I usually tend t err on the safe side and because it makes a lot of sense to me right now, I would say that you should keep the top frame on the tank since I would think it is helping to relieve the stress on the corner's seals which I assume might push apart from the weight. Although I have never seen one in person yet, I have noticed that throughout a series of planted tank articles in an magazine, the tanks seem to have no trim or visible support; however, I suppose they could be editing them out for visual effect.

Even though I know you already have a stand, one really cool idea I found was to literally use the stand to make it appear as there is no tank there. For example, on the tank stand I built earlier this year...

...you might be able to see that I extended the corner molding of the stand up so that it also covers the corners of the tank, as well as using some molding to hide the bottom frame of the tank. While I am still working on it (been very busy this year), the canopy I am building will eventually hide the top frame and lights in the hopes that it appears as though the tank is actually built in to a wall, or at least places more focus on what it in the tank and not the tank itself. It is kind of a shame that you don't live closer to me because a few months ago I started a small business which provides completely customized tank stands and have what I feel are some pretty unique designs which hide about 95% of the equipment being used, including any HOB type items. In fact, I am really starting to think that I could almost make this my main income even though I have been selling them for little more than material and time costs because it is basically a way to combine two of my hobbies.

 

[SkiFletch]

I'd reccomend the 20L, the 29 is a BEAR to aquascape. Drilling yourself with a dremmel is easy. You need the diamond tipped bit and the routing attachment. You basically sink the bit into the glass first at an angle until the tip gets through, then you slowly bring it vertical. Then, fit the routing head on it and slowly grind away on the line you've pre-drilled. Make sure you keep some water in and around the cutting area to keep the bit cool.

TBH though, getting a diamond holesaw off ebay and doing it that way is MUCH easier. Things are like $10-15 deilvered to your door and get the job done much better. They all come with good instructions too

 

[showjyr]

Thanks Skifletch i forgot about the routing heads for dremels. If not that i might try the hole saw....I'm always buying stuff off Ebay.


Now i just need to figure out pump size/brand, line size, bulkhead size, and overflow height/size. Oh yeah and convert my ten in to a sump/refugium.

I've also gotta figure out what skimmer I'm gonna get.....lost on that one.

Think I'm going to go with the Coralife Aqualight Avanced 150w for a light

Already using 1 Koralia nano on my ten, might get another or go to a #1 or #2.

Man am I gonna be asking some questions.

 

[SkiFletch]

Lower flowrate, smaller bulkheads . Probably only 100gph through the sump, somethin like 1/2" or 3/4" pipes, and a smaller pump, but that would depend on how high the tank is over the sump

 

[Adrinal]

Totally voting on the diamond bit hole saw. I've done the dremel thing and the hole saw is a million times easier. Just need one person to keep water on the bit while the other drills with little to no pressure.

can you fit a 40 breeder or a 30g tank? both those sizes are way better than your other choices thus far.

1" drain and a mag 7 should do you, but I do everything with 1.5" pipe. The cost difference is nominal for a whole lot more security. I mostly work with acrylic so I have used larger bulk heads, but in glass tanks I just stock everything 1.5" ... even had to use two 1.5" holes when it was necessary for the flow. (cheaper than me getting a slew of 2" tools).

 

[showjyr]

I could always build another stand for a 30 gal or 40 breeder but I'm only going to use a 150watt MH. Aren't both of those tanks 17 inches tall? I don't know if only 150w will do.


Skifletch - From top of sump to top of tank will be a little over 2 feet. Any suggestion on the pump?


Got an e-mail from glasscages.com and they said they could ship a 29 gal acrylic with back black for $120 and a 20 long would be $100. That seems a little pricey but they would be much easier to drill. I would also have to make or buy an acrylic overflow.(going to go with a black acrylic overflow either way i go anyway)

PS. After the $500 or so I'm gonna spend on the tank, light, overflow, sump, pump, plumbing, and powerhead(s) my budget for this little project might start to get a little strained. Any suggestions on a descent skimmer that won't cost me a small fortune?

 

[Tommy Gun]

Lower flowrate, smaller bulkheads

It might also help to know that the total flowrate of the overflow system does not neccessarily mean that will be the rate the water is going to flow (that made no sense, huh?)

For example, my HOB overlfow is rated at 800 gallons per hour, but because the pump I am using to return the water back to the tank right now can only push about 400 gph to the 4'6" height that it must, the whole system is limited to that amount of water movement. If the overflow was to move water faster than the return pump, then the water level would lower too far and the overflow siphon is stopped....until the water pump gets enough water back into the tank. This is a pretty important point becuase, if that siphon is broken, for example, during a power outage, there is not an absolute guarantee that it will restart even if the pump restarts. Although, I do agree that most systems are reliable in that manner, but it is definitely something to check on before that sort of situation occurs when you are not ready.

Any suggestions on a descent skimmer that won't cost me a small fortune?

I will probably get my chops busted for saying this....I think that you can 'get away' without a skimmer for a little while until your bank account has some time to rebound. After all, you will need time for cycling and getting the system established before you will really find the larger amount of need for a skimmer. I have often read/heard that skimming is not all that big of a deal in a fish-only tank - which, based upon your lighting choice, I realize your goal is probably a reef tank, but of course, you will most likely start off as a FOWLR tank for at least a couple months, right? In short, my advice is based upon the simple economic logic that says "sure, you can buy a cheap skimmer now, but that only means you will be spending that much more when you upgrade"....like I have too many times!

 

[showjyr]

I see what you mean. I also(this being my first real marine setup) thought about problems that could arise during/after a power outage and I'm pretty sure i have a solution to the problem of breaking siphon. I also want to cut down on the noise of water rushing over the edge of the overflow.

I figured if Iused a durso style standpipe in my internal overflow placed to reach about two thirds the height of my overflow I would get a descent amount of pull from the surface and by replacing the U tube style, siphon dependent top with one of the nifty things i will link to it would take care of the problem. Water would only flow into the overflow until reaching the bottom of the teeth, thus breaking the siphon. When the pump dose kick back on it would pump enough water back into the tank to rise over the teeth and then flow down the modified durso pipe. Problem solved.....I think. Can you tell this is my first time?

The durso pipe mod thingy.


Maybe I can just wait a while and buy a good quality skimmer.

 

[SkiFletch]

Well, that's a Stockman standpipe, not a durso. Both stockman and durso standpipes auto-restart on powercuts/restarts and involve drilling the bottom of the tank. Their internal boxes with teeth (aka weirs) tend to be a little large and cumbersome. And while they're very reliable there is one mode of double-failure that can destroy your system. If both the weir wall seal faults on power-outage, and the bulkhead fitting fails simultaneously, the entire tank can be drained of water. Not good.

IMO the safest and most reliable overflow system is the "Calfo" overflow. You drill the back of the tank a few inches below the water level, install a "floating" weir box (does not need to go all the way to the tank floor), put a 90 degree elbow pointing down inside the tank. Outside you put a tee fitting with the top capped and an 1/8-1/4" hole drilled in it, and the bottom half of the tee going down to the sump. Water flows over the weir teeth into the internal box and fills up the box. The hole in the cap allows the elbow to fill up until the water reaches the level of the bulkhead, flow through the tee, and then down into the sump. If power cuts, water stops flowing over the weir and therefore stops flowing into the tank. If the weir AND bulkhead fails, water only drains to the level of the bulkhead fitting, possibly saving your livestock.

Yeah, it's not cheap, but tbh, you can save a bunch if you just buy a standard $30 AGA 20 long. Perhaps wait for a petsmart $1/gallon tank sale and go pick one up. Drill that, add an overflow box, paint the back, and you're done...

As for skimmers, how good are you at DIY mods? You could buy a cheap skimmer, meshmod it and drill out a thicker air-inlet for it's venturi and have one that's pretty decent

 

[Bauchingera]

I've been searching high and low on the net for over a week and can't find a tank. I'm not looking for anything special.

All I want is a 20 to 29 gallon tank(same footprint 30x12 1/2 inches) It needs to be drilled with atleast one hole for a bulkhead and have an overflow. Acrylic euro braced or rimless glass would be best but at this point anything will do.

I cannot find anyone local to drill a tank and I don't dare to myself. Glasscages.com won't ship glass UPS and says the acrylic that size is too small for an overflow and 2 holes which i don't completely understand. Then they told me a 10 gallon that i wanted was too small for them to convert to a sump.


I'm really scratching my head on this and if i can't find something soon I give up.

Have you checked the classifieds on the internet or the newspapers? They always have great deals.....I saw an add for a 400 litre tank, with heater, filter, gravel, accessories, light and plants for $400!!!!!....i wanted to buy it..., but i just got a new tank....sigh*

 

[showjyr]

Sounds simple enough and with a smaller "floating weir" it would just give me that much more room.

DIY is no problem for me I've been building stuff since I was a little kid. However you pretty much lost right about here....."meshmod it and drill out a thicker air-inlet for it's venturi". I'll do some searching around until you post back but please, do elaborate. What skimmer would you suggest?


One more thing I'm looking for diamond hole saws on ebay....what size?

 

[SkiFletch]

Meshmod means you take the impeller out of the pump, and cleverly fit it with sturdy plastic mesh. This helps chop up bubbles much finerer . If you can't find it, try pm'ing matthew5564, he's done it.


And for the venturi, typically a skimmer has an airline thats just a little section of flex tube which fits on a small nipple or barbed fitting at the inlet of the pump and the other end is out of the water. The negative pressure the pump generates sucks air into the hose and into the pump, where it's chopped up into tiny bubbles (chopped finerer with a meshmod), and then injected into the skimmer. A larger inlet fitting will yield more air, and more air = more skimmate. Do you have access to threaded taps?

As for the hole saw, you first choose your bulkhead then buy a holesaw that is designed for that bulkhead

Btw, good pvc parts delivered to your door at a cheap price