Zebra Plecs L046

[nicolaisam]

Some excellent info there TwoTankAmin....


I still disagree with the potential amounts for tanks but as i said... certain things work for some where other things work for others.... i personally think you have to many for the tanks you have... however if it works then i see no reason why change is needed.... ive had different experiences and so have many of other zeb breeders i know.... ive kept many over the time, breeders and just groups. Ive had groups in 2 foot (20g) tanks and worked where as a different group just fought like mad in the same size tank.... ive also had a largish group in a 400 litre and again a couple males needed splitting due to fighting.

Although i agree mostly of what you have posted, i think it should be clear that just because your setups have worked, it doesn't mean an exact setup with the same amount of zebs would always work for the next person especially somebody new to zebs like the poster obviously is.

To the flow and filter size..... i agree with you on that one.... however the sponge filters usually added (well in my case) have a bigger area for bacteria growth than your typical internal filter.. but on the other hand sponge filters take up space.. this in smaller tanks to me is quite important, to you it may not be?... that really is personal preference.. neither is wrong. The reason i advised external was you get the best of both worlds.... decent flow and excellent surface area for bacteria growth... no it isn't essential and many people i know also have bare bottom tanks with both air driven and powerhead driven sponges but again it is personal preference.

Ive never been in the mind set of thinking whats bare minimum for the fish kept, why would you go bare minimum if you can give them larger... not exactly restricted in the wild are they?... i also dont really understand the comment about small zebs want small spaces.... this again wouldn't be the case in the wild, they have a vast area they can explore... weather they do or not isn't the point. We cant replicate there habitat we can only try to the best of out ability and giving the species 'bare' minimum size tanks isn't really trying.

Anyways as i said, some excellent info and very helpful but i would never take just one persons setup and say for definite 'that will work' for me or the next person.

Thanks for your thoughts,thats the good thing about forums,different people, different thoughts/experiences.
The internal filter i use has a course foam,a fine foam and Eheim substrat pro,so its the same technology that is used in eheim external filters,i use these as Shrimp like clean water,If this is not enough i will buy a small external.
If in a year or so i feel that the tank is to small,i will upgrade.

I am only having 2 3cm juveniles,once i have these happy and established i will look for a few more,maybe and a larger tank,if the missus will alow.

 

[castiel]

Wow, pretty fish.

 

[JenCliBee]

Thanks for your thoughts,thats the good thing about forums,different people, different thoughts/experiences.
The internal filter i use has a course foam,a fine foam and Eheim substrat pro,so its the same technology that is used in eheim external filters,i use these as Shrimp like clean water,If this is not enough i will buy a small external.
If in a year or so i feel that the tank is to small,i will upgrade.

I am only having 2 3cm juveniles,once i have these happy and established i will look for a few more,maybe and a larger tank,if the missus will alow.

Completely agree... forums are a very useful way of gaining knowledge and personal experiences... no one is ever completely correct because many have so many differing experiences.... good and bad and trying things out for yourself is the only real method/way of gaining a true knowledge of what works for you and what doesn't.

TwoTankAmin is a very experienced keeper, he has been around a fair while and if i remeber correctly.. kept zebs for a number of years and shared knowledge on many forums, his experience and knowledge is invaluable and a credit to any forum.

My posts are only my experiences and of 'some' experiences from other keepers.... it's never intended to be... 'DO IT MY WAY' no other way will work... that's not how fishkeeping goes.... having differing experiences though is always a good starting point.

Good luck, you have certainly chose one of the most beautiful fish that can be obtained and will look forward to how it all goes for you .

 

[TwoTankAmin]

i also dont really understand the comment about small zebs want small spaces

What this was intended to mean is that when zebras are fry they need smaller spaces to hide in. They feel safest and will look to hide in spaces into which other fish can not fit. Small/young zebras will also tend to huddle together. The picture below is an early 15 gal. growout tank I used by stealing it from other fish. There were about 30 fry in the tank- virtually all of them could be found under the two slate slabs you see in the photo.

As they grow and age they will begin to break into smaller groups and then eventually begin to look for their own personal spaces. Males will begin to claim caves. Females will tend to be more social- until its time to spawn.

You are correct about the potential for fighting. This is not limited to males. Females will also establish a pecking order among themselves with the "alpha" fm getting to spawn first when she is ready. The girls will fight for this right just as hard as the males will over territory. However, the women tend not to kill each other the way males can. The best one can do it to monitor what is going on in a tank and when signs of serious fighting manifests itself, move some fish.

I would note that in my tanks I supply an inordinate amount of cover. This helps me manage stocking levels that do tend to push the upper limits. However, I find by doing so I am more easily able to monitor things in the tanks. It also helps with feeding fry as the food is easier to locate so the less the fish have to hunt for it. However, smaller tanks mean one must be diligent with maintenanace and alert to the potential for having to separate fish. I would note that you can find as many stories about a male killing a female in a tank with just the pair as you can about two males fighting to the death or having one male trap the other and beating it death in the back of a cave.

I agree that I tend to push the limits when it comes to stocking and that as a general rule more space is better than less. However, for some folks the amount of available space to put tanks can be a factor in having to push those limits. For most folks putting 3 or 4 zebras into a 15 gal tank should normally not be a problem, especially if they are only 1.5 in.

 

[JenCliBee]

i also dont really understand the comment about small zebs want small spaces

What this was intended to mean is that when zebras are fry they need smaller spaces to hide in. They feel safest and will look to hide in spaces into which other fish can not fit. Small/young zebras will also tend to huddle together. The picture below is an early 15 gal. growout tank I used by stealing it from other fish. There were about 30 fry in the tank- virtually all of them could be found under the two slate slabs you see in the photo.

As they grow and age they will begin to break into smaller groups and then eventually begin to look for their own personal spaces. Males will begin to claim caves. Females will tend to be more social- until its time to spawn.

You are correct about the potential for fighting. This is not limited to males. Females will also establish a pecking order among themselves with the "alpha" fm getting to spawn first when she is ready. The girls will fight for this right just as hard as the males will over territory. However, the women tend not to kill each other the way males can. The best one can do it to monitor what is going on in a tank and when signs of serious fighting manifests itself, move some fish.

I would note that in my tanks I supply an inordinate amount of cover. This helps me manage stocking levels that do tend to push the upper limits. However, I find by doing so I am more easily able to monitor things in the tanks. It also helps with feeding fry as the food is easier to locate so the less the fish have to hunt for it. However, smaller tanks mean one must be diligent with maintenanace and alert to the potential for having to separate fish. I would note that you can find as many stories about a male killing a female in a tank with just the pair as you can about two males fighting to the death or having one male trap the other and beating it death in the back of a cave.

I agree that I tend to push the limits when it comes to stocking and that as a general rule more space is better than less. However, for some folks the amount of available space to put tanks can be a factor in having to push those limits. For most folks putting 3 or 4 zebras into a 15 gal tank should normally not be a problem, especially if they are only 1.5 in.

Ahhh right i get what you mean about the comment now and yes i completely agree.

I also totally agree about females been just as harsh to each other.. luckily enough ive only ever had this problem once.... would never rule it out but this is why i tend to stock lighter in 'smaller' tanks and slightly heavier in larger tanks where i can have more males together for the females... trying to minimalise female fighting.... this may or may not be why i have never had serious female fighting... i guess unless i moved them into smaller quarters and monitored i would never find out.

I totally agree on available space, some just cant have larger tanks and that often is why the do use smaller ones... this leads to been very diligent as you say with maintenance and water params etc and also to me stocking levels but as ive mentioned.... no 2 peoples experiences usually are the same and what obviously works for you may not for the next... ive never really tried it out due to not having to but as they say...'if it's not broken, dont fix it'.

BTW TTA, some really cute fry you have there, sooo sooo cute .

 

[nicolaisam]

Thanks for the good information,The more the better.
2 juveniles ordered,will be here friday.

 

[kevinjames]

To the breeders we have here, do you guys find you have a high demand and can always sell what you have bred?

 

[TwoTankAmin]

I have never been able to meet demand and always have a waiting list. For a while there were a lot of wc zebras being smuggled out of Brazil, this flow has now stopped. The authorities there are again cracking down. The start of the Belo Monte dam will begin soon and these fish will become extinct which boosted demand and prices and the smugglers got busy.

The people I know who were able to bring in illegally collected zebras have said that is it now very difficult to find any. I have also heard that any that are being caught and smuggled out are going to Germany and Japan as they can pay more- another side effect of a weak dollar. However, I am not sure if all that many fish are getting there either now.

I suspended sales at the end of last year because my breeders went on hiatus. I have been working a dry season on them for a couple of months now and have just begun the rainy. Hopefully this will end the hiatus.

 

[kevinjames]

i think its so sad that these fish will soon be extinct in the wild. in a way you must feel quite proud that you are playing a part in conservation of the species. i hope you continue to breed and supply these lovely fish and help them stay around, although only in captivity.

 

[nicolaisam]

Getting excited.Tommorow is the day of arrival.

Found another seller very close to me.

Thinking of selling all my shrimp to free up another tank.

 

[JenCliBee]

Getting excited.Tommorow is the day of arrival.

Found another seller very close to me.

Thinking of selling all my shrimp to free up another tank.

haha.... hope the delivery all goes well for you and looking forward to the pics .... as to the selling of shrimp lol.... i would see how you get on with the first lot of zebs first.... you may not like alot of tanks which look empty .... well you may see a tail every so often lol .

 

[nicolaisam]

Getting excited.Tommorow is the day of arrival.

Found another seller very close to me.

Thinking of selling all my shrimp to free up another tank.

haha.... hope the delivery all goes well for you and looking forward to the pics .... as to the selling of shrimp lol.... i would see how you get on with the first lot of zebs first.... you may not like alot of tanks which look empty .... well you may see a tail every so often lol .

They have just arrived,They are stunning,and very cute.
Going to gently introduce them to my tank.
Have had a lot of interest locally about selling my shrimp,Somebody wants the lot.
I have been looking at photos on the net,There are a lot of pictures of tails.LOL
Not sure on the shrimp,Might sell some of them,I have about a hundred cherry babies,50 adult cherries,and 15ea od Crystal red and blacks and one of the femail Blacks is carrying again.
Thanks

 

[JenCliBee]

Getting excited.Tommorow is the day of arrival.

Found another seller very close to me.

Thinking of selling all my shrimp to free up another tank.

haha.... hope the delivery all goes well for you and looking forward to the pics .... as to the selling of shrimp lol.... i would see how you get on with the first lot of zebs first.... you may not like alot of tanks which look empty .... well you may see a tail every so often lol .

They have just arrived,They are stunning,and very cute.
Going to gently introduce them to my tank.
Have had a lot of interest locally about selling my shrimp,Somebody wants the lot.
I have been looking at photos on the net,There are a lot of pictures of tails.LOL
Not sure on the shrimp,Might sell some of them,I have about a hundred cherry babies,50 adult cherries,and 15ea od Crystal red and blacks and one of the femail Blacks is carrying again.
Thanks

Congrats on been a zeb keeper .... you wont regret it lol... well.... wanting more may regret you starting .


Look forward to seeing them once settled

 

[nicolaisam]

Getting excited.Tommorow is the day of arrival.

Found another seller very close to me.

Thinking of selling all my shrimp to free up another tank.

haha.... hope the delivery all goes well for you and looking forward to the pics .... as to the selling of shrimp lol.... i would see how you get on with the first lot of zebs first.... you may not like alot of tanks which look empty .... well you may see a tail every so often lol .

They have just arrived,They are stunning,and very cute.
Going to gently introduce them to my tank.
Have had a lot of interest locally about selling my shrimp,Somebody wants the lot.
I have been looking at photos on the net,There are a lot of pictures of tails.LOL
Not sure on the shrimp,Might sell some of them,I have about a hundred cherry babies,50 adult cherries,and 15ea od Crystal red and blacks and one of the femail Blacks is carrying again.
Thanks

Congrats on been a zeb keeper .... you wont regret it lol... well.... wanting more may regret you starting .


Look forward to seeing them once settled

Thanks
Going to look at more at the weekend
They have both disapeared into some caves.LOL

Any chance of a photo of your Zeb Tank please,Not sure what i want decor wise.

 

[JenCliBee]

Thanks
Going to look at more at the weekend
They have both disapeared into some caves.LOL

Any chance of a photo of your Zeb Tank please,Not sure what i want decor wise.

This is an old pic, the tank changed from time to time to acommodate more and to give more places to hide... i haven't actually got anymore on this laptop or photobucket.... will have a dig around and find some old pics that should be on disc somewhere lol

Decor wise..... caves, slate, wood and you cant go wrong.... substrate is optional... bare bottom is much easier to clean but can be a little unsightly.