Urgent Need Of Help After Bad Advice

[leanne2389]

Hi all I recently bought a solid oak aquarium from MA not got a tape measure to hand but if i remember correctly its 42inchesx24x21 when i bought it (A week ago) I was told to set it up and leave it for a week before buying fish. It wasnt delivered until Wednesday (4 days ago) we filled it and put in all the bottled bacteria and tap conditioner as advised. Went back to shop today with water sample as this is my very first aquarium and have no idea what im doing to see if they could advise mee as o if it was ok. Bloke wandered off and returned said all good to put fish in now and made some reccomendaions. I wanted a semi planted tank so told him this and he showed me what he believed I needed (£60+ worth) hence a lot! I bought them, as like I said im a newbie so going on advice. He also said plants live off fish waste so the plants would die soon if I had no fish so I agreed to buy what he thought was necessary to maintain the tank. I ended up with (what i think are) 1 x common pleco, 2 x sail fin molly, 1 x balloon molly, 10 x neon tetra, 4 x danios, 1 x apple snail. My problems are:
1) Snail attached itself to the plant as soon as I put it in and has been there ever since. Is it going to eat all my plants (if they survive)?
2) Danios are very fast moving and seem to be frightening the very small tetra
3) 1 sail fin molly has hid behind a rock and refuses to come out
4) I am really worried after reading forum that this is way to much to soon and this was seriously bad advice
5) I have a JBL e900 filter and using an aquatics estimator website which tells me my filter is incomptible with my tank and the species am I overstocking?
6) I am completely at your mercy I followed the advice I was given and now i am petrified everything will die. I have no idea please help!

 

[Randi]

OK, your tank is not cycled and yes it is too much too soon. You will need to do a fish-in cycle, which can take a while. First, get a water test kit (API master kit) and start checking your water parameters daily. You CAN keep these fishies alive.

Here is a link to fish-in cycling: http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?showtopic=224306

 

[MBOU]

Hi

I am pretty worried about the advise you have been given, I cant pm you as you are a new member, any chance you can let me know which store it was and if possible which member of staff? I can at least find out whats going on and make sure they are made aware of the problems...

A week is really very quick to put fish in but it is regularly done with no problems, you will get a lot of people slating for MA for this one persons decision to sell you fish but without knowing what the exact test results were, its kinda hard to tell!

Applesnails do eat plants sometimes but tbh not too much, poor blighter is probably terrified after his move, they generally take a few days to even start moving so i wouldnt panic!

As for your other fish, try not to panic too much, they all just sound very jittery due to being in a new environment, leave the lights off for a day or two, dont even worry about feeding until they seem settled...

Hopefully all will be ok and I will definately make sure the staff will be particularly helpful next time! It might be worth taking a water sample down the be checked, they have little water test sheets that they can fill in for you with the test results (and you can ask what make of test kit they are using) and put the results up here on the forum.

Im sorry you seem to have had problems

 

[BigbruiserAl]

ok no point having a pop at you like some people would, so welcome to the forum

You are now in fish in cycle it is possible to come out of this ok but will need to get reading and some big water changes.
please read the fish in cycle in the beginers centre and feel free to post back with questions, Things generaly start dying 7 days in when the ammonia starts build up along hence those big changes.
Regarding apple snails they will more then likely have a good munch, i have 250 of them(yes thats right lol) i keep them well feed and they have only eaten 2 plants in 8 weeks

 

[Gelt]

You have probably found the best Tropical fish forum around, these guys are not biased and no matter what your fish related problem is it can be sorted,there is no such thing as a 'stupid question here'.

90% of LFS only have one agenda, that is to get cash through the tills , unfortunatly this comes at a cost to the buyer, bad advice and poor knowledge.

Being a newbie myself i was lucky to find this forum before i even walked in a few LFS .

Armed with this knowledge when you go to you next LFS ask a few questions to which you already know the answer with information from these forums, if its not the same answers then walk away...


keep your head up and stick with it..

Gelt

 

[Miles_hot]

Gelt

I would tend to take a slightly different tack with your local IFS.

Yesterday I went to a local MA and was impressed by the fish and the fact that there was a bunch which were marked as not for sales as they were in quarantine (obviously no dead ones - I'm kind of shocked that this is a good sign as I'd never expect to see any dead ones anyway!) Got what seemed to be some well reasoned advice regarding discus (specialist, pH required can be incompatible with other fish) and angels (can be very aggressive towards other fish, especially when breeding, not really suitable to my tank - 50 G - if I want lots of small fish as well). This seemed to be well based advise as it sort of correlated with what I remembered from this forum AND it was advising me against spending some serious money on fish which looked lovely (the discus were somewhere between 10 and 30 from memory and looks utterly lovely.

When I asked "when can I put the fish in?" I got an answer of 2 weeks as you have to wait for the bacteria in your filter to come up to speed. Sadly at this point my son announced he needed the toilet so I had to exit sharpish however my wife reports that he didn't try to push any specific products (which surprised me with 2 weeks as the target time - maybe that would be visit two) however in answer to my question "do you sell mature media" apparently the surprising answer was that if the tank conditions of the donor tank (pH etc) were not the same as the receiving tank the bacteria wouldn't survive. This feels like codswallop to me.

All this means is that I will be trusting them on fish selection however I will not be taking cycling advise from them. Hence I will not be "walking away from them" as I suspect that all IFS will tend towards shorter than idea cycle times (what's in it for them, in fish cycle has been done for donkey's years and customers will also expect and demand to be able to put fish in sooner - after all they want to buy fish not look at an empty tank for 8 weeks).

Just my thoughts

Miles

 

[Wend]

Hi, I made exactly the same mistake. I was advised to have my new tank set up for 3 days prior to adding creatures! (Tropical crabs, not fish) My crabs died slowly 24 hours after they came home. And some people get cross with us for making this mistake, but if you are following advice then its a very easy mistake to make!

After mine died I started a 'fishless cycle' which is now almost complete after 25 days. I think I will get crabs mk 2 this weekend. You will be doing a 'fish in' cycle. Good luck, you will get all the advice you need here.

 

[leanne2389]

Thank you all so much I will definitely be reading the fish in cycling topic you gave me the link to and getting the test kit advised unfortunately I cant do that until tomorrow as I have no car today TBH im not slating MA because the store itself was fantastic very clean and all the fish looked very healthy. I am just angry at the one person who seems to not know what their doing. Unfortunately I dont know that persons name but when I go back to get the test kit I will be asking to speak to the manager now that I am sure this was incorrect advise. BTW everything seems a bit more lively today except the plec which has gone into hiding somewhere.

 

[weezawoo]

Just to stand up for the guy a bit, he might not necessarily be completely wrong. You can read here: http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?/topic/299827-why-we-should-not-fishless-cycle-planted-tanks/ an article on why not to fishless cycle planted tanks. Now depending on how many plants he sold you, and saying £60 worth seems a lot, he might be following roughly what is outline in the link above.

It doesn't make it right selling that many fish perhaps but he may not have given totally wrong advice just maybe not explained properly.

I love my local MA and when I had problems at the start of my fish journey they wrote a log of what w/c etc I needed to do and then come back for another water test.

 

[leanne2389]

Just to stand up for the guy a bit, he might not necessarily be completely wrong. You can read here: http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?/topic/299827-why-we-should-not-fishless-cycle-planted-tanks/ an article on why not to fishless cycle planted tanks. Now depending on how many plants he sold you, and saying £60 worth seems a lot, he might be following roughly what is outline in the link above.

It doesn't make it right selling that many fish perhaps but he may not have given totally wrong advice just maybe not explained properly.

I love my local MA and when I had problems at the start of my fish journey they wrote a log of what w/c etc I needed to do and then come back for another water test.

Hi ive just read the link you provided and thank you so much!! Maybe this isnt a complete disastor after all. If I list what plants I have maybe someone can tell me if this is maybe ok and how best to proceed. In the tank I currently have (what I think are):
2 pieces of bogwood approx 9 inches wide 12 each with jave fern attached - got these from a friend so they have been established for a while
2 x Ophiopogon Kyoto approx 2 inches tall 2 inches wide
2x Rotala rotundifolia approx 6 inches tall approx 10 stems on each
2 x Rotala indica approx 8 inches tall approx 5 stalks on each
2 x Ceratopteris silaquosa approx 10 inches tall approx 4 stalks on each
1 x Echinodorus bleheri approx 6 inches tall approx 8 stalks
1 x Hygrophila difformis approx 6 inches tall approx 10 stalks
3 x Cabomba caroliniana approx 18 inches tall approx 10-15 stalks on each plant
2 x Anubias afzelii approx 20inches tall approx 12 stalks
I think this is it but there maybe one or two others ive missed out.
Really appreciate all the help thanks everyone

 

[This Old Spouse]

Is there anyone you know who has an established tank who could give you some established filter media? That would pretty much solve your immediate problems. There's a list on the forum somewhere of people who are willing to donate filter media.

 

[brian2708]

If this helps, I bought an API Master test kit from a well known auction site, just plonk the words in the search engine, brand new, delivered for £20. They were £35 in my LFS!!

It also came next day!!

Hope this helps.

 

[leanne2389]

If this helps, I bought an API Master test kit from a well known auction site, just plonk the words in the search engine, brand new, delivered for £20. They were £35 in my LFS!!

It also came next day!!

Hope this helps.

Thanks brian will take a look now.

Is there anyone you know who has an established tank who could give you some established filter media? That would pretty much solve your immediate problems. There's a list on the forum somewhere of people who are willing to donate filter media.

No nobody I know but I will browse the forum see if I can find anything now though

 

[Miles_hot]

Just to stand up for the guy a bit, he might not necessarily be completely wrong. You can read here: http/www.fishforum...-planted-tanks/ an article on why not to fishless cycle planted tanks. Now depending on how many plants he sold you, and saying £60 worth seems a lot, he might be following roughly what is outline in the link above.

It doesn't make it right selling that many fish perhaps but he may not have given totally wrong advice just maybe not explained properly.

I love my local MA and when I had problems at the start of my fish journey they wrote a log of what w/c etc I needed to do and then come back for another water test.

Hi ive just read the link you provided and thank you so much!! Maybe this isnt a complete disastor after all. If I list what plants I have maybe someone can tell me if this is maybe ok and how best to proceed. In the tank I currently have (what I think are):
2 pieces of bogwood approx 9 inches wide 12 each with jave fern attached - got these from a friend so they have been established for a while
2 x Ophiopogon Kyoto approx 2 inches tall 2 inches wide
2x Rotala rotundifolia approx 6 inches tall approx 10 stems on each
2 x Rotala indica approx 8 inches tall approx 5 stalks on each
2 x Ceratopteris silaquosa approx 10 inches tall approx 4 stalks on each
1 x Echinodorus bleheri approx 6 inches tall approx 8 stalks
1 x Hygrophila difformis approx 6 inches tall approx 10 stalks
3 x Cabomba caroliniana approx 18 inches tall approx 10-15 stalks on each plant
2 x Anubias afzelii approx 20inches tall approx 12 stalks
I think this is it but there maybe one or two others ive missed out.
Really appreciate all the help thanks everyone

The guideline I read in the planted section (a good place to ask questions about your plants) was that the "silent cycle" threshold was plants covering 75% of your substrate. It should be noted of course that such silent cycles are considered to be for the experienced however I guess you maybe about to become experienced through necessity Certainly plants can't hurt your situation as they do a similar job to bacteria.

Miles

 

[leanne2389]

Thanks Miles i did read that however my plants do only cover about 25-35% of substrate but they are tallish I'm going to go to LFS today so see if they suggest getting some more plants and what else they advise. Will let you all know what im told a bit later.