Urgent Help Needed! Tank Is Waiting For Help!

[paradiddle]

the second post down looks fine. buy that

do you have a test kit for ammonia? or just Nitrite (NO2)

first thing, get rid of the ammonia remover from the filter, how can the bacteria grow if they dont have a food source. you can keep the carbon, because you want to remove the tannins, although after most of them have gone you can replace this with other media. id recommend more bio balls, to provide a bigger surface area for the bacteria

you can add flake to start, add a pinch and take a reading the next day. once your ammonia is at a level (im not sure what ppm you should cycle a tank at, i'll check in a min) but once you have that reading on your test kit, stop adding fake and wait.

keep taking reading every day or every other day, once that reading starts to drop your starting to get more bacteria in your filter, then you will want to feed it, so wait untill the level of ammonia reaches a set point (id say about half the original amount) you can add some more, to bring it back up to the starting level, eventually your ammonia level which you started with should drop from your starting level to 0 in one day, then your filter is cycled on the ammonia side of thing's

your ammonia levels will not sky rocket if you dont add anymore ammonia, they will only decrease because the bacteria is using it for food.

your filter wont be fully cycled untill you get the nitrite levels down to 0, so after your ammonia reaches 0 or just before it does, start testing for nitrites, or you can test from the start with both if you want,

what should happen with your nitrites is: it will rise to a peek and fall over time, but it do so after your ammonia does. does that help?

read though this link and it should explain what todo a little better http/www.fishforum...shless-cycling/

Ok, if your sure about that one from ebay, i will take out the ammonia remover tomorrow, and just add flake until it comes.

i dont have a test for ammonia, only some King British test strips, but in my understanding i should...

1)remove the ammonia remover
2)dose the tank with ammonia (how much? concentrated/diluted?)
3)repeat dose daily? until the ammonia levels reach a certain point
4)stop dosing and wait for it to drop to half this amount
5) redose to full level
6)allow it to go to 0, and then monitor nitrites until they go to 0
7)do a BIG water change....and add fish?

 

[mike455555]

right dont add anything to your tank yet, get ammonia and an ammonia test kit. forget about flake.

take out the remover as well

add a drop of ammonia to a 10L of water in a bucket take a test for ammonia, you want to aim for 4-5ppm, so if your under that value add another drop to the bucket count how many drop's you have added until you reach 5ppm in the bucket, then do some math's to see how many drops you should add to your tank
e.g. if it takes 3 drops to reach 4-5ppm in the bucket, 250/10=25. 25*3=75 so you need to add 75 drops to the main tank of 250L (i think thats right)

once your added ammonia to your main tank measure the amount of it each day until it starts to drop, keep topping up the ammonia to 5ppm each day, so you can tell how much has been used. record this,

when the ammonia levels start to drop (should take about a week), start testing for nitrites, you should see your amount of nitrites rise (as the ammonia is being turned into nitrite) then you should see it fall again (this is where the bacteria is converting it into nitrate). you need to keep adding the ammonia, when the nitrites start to drop.

then big water change and add fish

id recommend API liquid test kits, to cycle the tank you only really need to know ammonia and nitrites

 

[David J]

Hi Paradiddle

I too am a complete beginner. Got my first tank at Christmas and was VERY nervous about everything I did with the tank. I read lots and lots and chatted a lot on here. I am currently doing a fishless cycle on my tank and using household ammonia from home base. It sounds crazy to us noobs but it works. I've been posting daily about my cycle and wondered if it might help you to read about my experiences. Here is the link:

http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?/topic/412111-my-fish-less-cycle/

The folks on here really know what they're taking about. Hope you find this helpful or at least build your confidence in what you are about to start. Don't rush into anything. Consider you're options if you're unsure about anything and keep asking lots of questions as you have been doing.

Good luck,

David

 

[paradiddle]

My test kid doesn't read ammonia I will buy one, but it also reads in mg/l so I'm confused as to what this is in ppm.
Also I do have another tank (64liter) that's running, could I take the big ornament out and the big natural rock and put them in the new tank, and also squeeze my filter pads into a cup and put them all straight into the water? Leave it a few weeks and be done with it?

 

[the_lock_man]

My test kid doesn't read ammonia

I will buy one, but it also reads in mg/l so I'm confused as to what this is in ppm.

Mg/l is the same thing as ppm

Also i went to the pets at home and the guy said hes been keeping fish for over 20 years, and he said to avoid at all costs using ammonia, and stick to adding flake food each day instead, as the ammonia can be really unpredictable.

Oh for the love of God, if he can't predict ammonia by adding pure ammonia, how the smeg does he think he can predict ammonia by adding fish food? There speaks the man who has never actually fishless cycled using ammonia.

Also I do have another tank (64liter) that's running, could I take the big ornament out and the big natural rock and put them in the new tank, and also squeeze my filter pads into a cup and put them all straight into the water? Leave it a few weeks and be done with it?

That will do diddly-squat, the bacteria don't live on your ornaments, or at least not in worthwile quantity.
What you can do is to take up to a third of the filter media (sponges, ceramcis) from the 64l filter, and replace it with new media. Then put this third into the new tank's filter, and then feed it with ammonia, as per the above advice.

 

[paradiddle]

My 64l is due a water change, can I vacuum the waste from the sand and pour this in? Is this not bacterial enough?

 

[the_lock_man]

Well, you can try, there are some bacteria living in the substrate, but the vast majority live in the filter sponges and ceramics. They like living there, they get on well with the neighbours, good school for the baby bacteria, shops are local, that kind of thing, so they don't particularly want to move. They cling on tight to the sponges, so just giving the sponges a squeeze doesn't dislodge significant quantities.

THe only way to get a sensible number of bacteria into a new filter is by physically moving the filter media.

If you move up to a third of the media, and replace it with new, the remaining bacteria will recolonise very quickly, so much so that you won't notice a difference.

 

[paradiddle]

So I've got 2 sponges and one lot of ceramic rings, I should swap one sponge and a few rings and put them in the new filter, feed them flake every day for 2 weeks, then water change and good to go?

 

[the_lock_man]

Swapping that quantity should be fine, but as I said before, adding fish food to break down into ammonia is less precise than buying bottled. The stuff you get at Homebase is what I use.

 

[paradiddle]

So adding the media from my other tank (which is now overdue a change anyway) and feeding flake for 2 weeks is not enough?
My gf is nagging me to not put ammonia in lol

What area do you live in btw?

 

[Shelster]

Paradiddle I took lock mans advice re filter media when setting up a smaller tank from my larger one. Ok it was easier as the media was to cycle a smaller tank, but it all worked out fine.

Trust them, and no I have never used ammonia to cycle a tank, and I appreciate yes it does sound odd adding a chemical to water which you will eventually be adding fish to, but it does work, and in time when I get a larger tank I shall also be using ammonia to cycle it.

I know it may sound easier to add fish but you will be making more work for yourself in the long run with constant water changes, plus it's very stressful for the fish used you may well lose some too.

Patience is key, and you have received some great advice on this thread so far, so place part of your mature media in the larger tanks filter and also add the water from your partial water change from your set up tank, and sort out the ammonia dosing.

Good luck!

 

[the_lock_man]

So adding the media from my other tank (which is now overdue a change anyway) and feeding flake for 2 weeks is not enough?
My gf is nagging me to not put ammonia in lol

What area do you live in btw?

Portsmouth.

THere is no way of being certain how much bacteria will grow in that time with flakes. It might be enough, it might not. If it's not, then you get to do big water changes until the bacteria catch up anyway.

By doing it a bit more scientifically, you can be sure that there is enough bacteria in the filter at the end of the process to accommodate the full stocking of fish in one go.

 

[paradiddle]

Ok will do
How often do I dose ammonia?
Do I stop when it reaches 5ppm and wait for it to go to 0

As you can tell I'm very nervous lol
My plants will be ok right?

 

[the_lock_man]

By using some mature media, it's hard to tell whereabouts in the cycling process you will start.

Dose to 5ppm, and then test 24hrs later. WHat will probably happen is that you will see a drop in ammonia, and a level of nitrite somewhere above 0ppm, and may well be off the scale. At that point, dose to 3ppm, and keep doing so daily until your tests register 0ppm ammonia and 0ppm nitrite after 24 hrs.

When you reach that stage, you need to be dosing ammonia to 5ppm daily, but testing 12hrs later. The important part is to always dose at the same time every day, there's something about the pulsed nature of the ammonia input that seems to help bacterial development. Once you have seen 0ppm for both ammo and nitrite after 12 hours, you are cycled. We normally recommend you keep doing this for a further week, to make sure it wasn't a freak set of results (known as the qualifying week).

Once your qualifying week is done without issue, change all the water for fresh, and go buy your fish!

If, in the unlikely event that on that first test, you still see 5ppm ammonia, and 0ppm nitrite, then wait until the ammonia drops to 0ppm, it means that you hadn't transferred any bacteria at all, which I think will be highly unlikely.

 

[paradiddle]

What is the exact product you use for your ammonia? I've searched ammonia on home base and got some weird stuff