URGENT - Asian Stone Catfish Temp Question - Arriving Today!

[scteel24]

Byron - any thoughts then on the asian stone catfish situation?

10 gallon:
high end of temp range
pristine water
more space
easier to feed

6 gallon:
perfect temp range
not pristine water but parameters w/in range
less space
more difficult to feed

 

[Byron]

Byron - any thoughts then on the asian stone catfish situation?

10 gallon:
high end of temp range
pristine water
more space
easier to feed

6 gallon:
perfect temp range
not pristine water but parameters w/in range
less space
more difficult to feed

I can only address the ichthyological issues which are absolutes for the best care which I am sure is your aim as it is for all of us. The issues of easy to feed and water quality are yours to control.

Temperature is critical for fish, and only a degree or two can make a big difference to the long-term health of a fish. Fish are ectotherms so their physiology relies totally on the external water temperature. Temperature drives metabolism, and each species of freshwater fish has evolved over thousands of years to function best within a very specific set of parameters and environment. As soon as the fish is forced to compromise, it is weakened. This causes stress which further weakens it. In time it will be much more susceptible to disease, have more difficulty eating, spend more energy just maintaining the necessary biological processes that keep it alive. Eventually, if it manages to make it through whatever life throws at it, the lifespan will be shorter, guaranteed. Temperature affects the metabolic rate as I mentioned, and also respiration, the blood pH balance, growth and development, and osmoregulation.

This fish needs more current in the tank as it has an high oxygen requirement which is obviously impacted by warmer temperatures which contain less oxygen, part of the afore-mentioned effects.

 

[scteel24]

So with a range of 64 - 75, 74 degrees would be acceptable/healthy. Since the 10 gallon has 2 air stones for extra oxygen and more current, that would be the better habitat for them. You should have a website for fish care per species for newbies like me since none of the sites I researched before I purchased these guys mentioned current or high oxygen levels. thanks!

 

[Byron]

So with a range of 64 - 75, 74 degrees would be acceptable/healthy. Since the 10 gallon has 2 air stones for extra oxygen and more current, that would be the better habitat for them. You should have a website for fish care per species for newbies like me since none of the sites I researched before I purchased these guys mentioned current or high oxygen levels. thanks!

I'm taking the time not to argue but to hopefully explain, just so you know.

Temperature range needs some explanation. In most cases, and on SF, the range indicates the high and low extremes at which the fish species should manage at least temporarily but not always permanently. Mid-range is where the fish should normally "live," with the daytime increase during a heat wave being an example of temporary. In the tropics, temperature variation during a 24-hour period is no more than 3-4 degrees C (Andrews, Excell, & Carrington, 2010). That is the daytime/night-time difference. Seasonal differences are almost non-existent. So a temperature around 70F would be best.

Air stones do not improve oxygen levels as well as surface disturbance and current. The fish also have the physical need for flowing water because they have evolved to function best in such an environment. They "expect" these things...check the blue and green citations in my signature, they are something we must never forget.

The plethora of misinformation in this hobby is truly astounding. Fish are so unique in our world, because they have such a close relationship with their aquatic environment that is far more significant to their life than that of any terrestrial animal (amphibians the exception). I always find it impossible to really get across what this means. I have spent months, probably a couple of years if tallied up, over the past two decades researching fish habitat and still I am learning. I only use sites for which I know (personally or by reputation in the scientific community) the owner/author. Not surprisingly, these rarely if ever vary, aside from new scientific advancement. Seriously Fish is one site owned and used by biologists and ichthyologists; the data there is about as reliable as it can be. Ian Fuller's Corydoras World is another, Planet Catfish another, Loaches Online another. Once you know where to look for this or that, the hobby becomes much easier and more successful. And that really does mean happy fish!

 

[scteel24]

Well I appreciate it. But basically, I have fish waiting for me at home that do not have a suitable environment because of the misinformation I researched. I still have no idea what to do with them.

 

[Byron]

Well I appreciate it. But basically, I have fish waiting for me at home that do not have a suitable environment because of the misinformation I researched. I still have no idea what to do with them.

Temporary quarters is fine, giving you time to set up a suitable tank. Maybe a new tank...a 5 gallon would suit the Asian fish which seem to be the problematical fish here.

 

[scteel24]

New question Byron since you seem to be the resident expert. About 8 weeks ago I was cleaning my 10 gallon and noticed a little creature zipping across the bottom. I scooped it up in a glass cup and with the help of the internet learned it was a baby Panda Cory. It looked like a little tadpole. I panicked thinking he (or she) needs to be in a tank, but not wanting him to get eaten, I put him in the 6 gallon shrimp tank. I know I made so many mistakes. I didn’t acclimate him, just poured him in the tank. I realized afterwards I should have made a quarantine type tank and floated him in the 10 gallon. Within a few days, it got pretty cold outside and I had a few days of a very low temp in the tank – down to 67 – the shrimp can handle that temp, but I got a small heater just in case he was still alive, but it arrived late and the 3rd day was down to 66. For weeks I looked for him to no avail. The tank is heavily planted and has a lot of guppy grass and water lettuce so I hoped he was just hard to see. I watch the shrimps eat dinner every night (they are so fun) and never saw the little guy again. Then, after 6 weeks, on Christmas day (I swear), here was this mini Panda Cory looking at me!! Now I see him every day swimming around and scrounging for food (I think). I add crushed algae and shrimps wafers as well as shrimp pellets to make sure he’s getting enough hot eat now, as the baby shrimp powder probably won’t suffice. Long story long, without listing everything I did wrong, should I eventually transfer him to the 10 gallon so he has other Pandas, or just keep him in the shrimp tank? If I should transfer him, what’s the best method? Thank you so much!!

 

[seangee]

New question Byron since you seem to be the resident expert. About 8 weeks ago I was cleaning my 10 gallon and noticed a little creature zipping across the bottom. I scooped it up in a glass cup and with the help of the internet learned it was a baby Panda Cory. It looked like a little tadpole. I panicked thinking he (or she) needs to be in a tank, but not wanting him to get eaten, I put him in the 6 gallon shrimp tank. I know I made so many mistakes. I didn’t acclimate him, just poured him in the tank. I realized afterwards I should have made a quarantine type tank and floated him in the 10 gallon. Within a few days, it got pretty cold outside and I had a few days of a very low temp in the tank – down to 67 – the shrimp can handle that temp, but I got a small heater just in case he was still alive, but it arrived late and the 3rd day was down to 66. For weeks I looked for him to no avail. The tank is heavily planted and has a lot of guppy grass and water lettuce so I hoped he was just hard to see. I watch the shrimps eat dinner every night (they are so fun) and never saw the little guy again. Then, after 6 weeks, on Christmas day (I swear), here was this mini Panda Cory looking at me!! Now I see him every day swimming around and scrounging for food (I think). I add crushed algae and shrimps wafers as well as shrimp pellets to make sure he’s getting enough hot eat now, as the baby shrimp powder probably won’t suffice. Long story long, without listing everything I did wrong, should I eventually transfer him to the 10 gallon so he has other Pandas, or just keep him in the shrimp tank? If I should transfer him, what’s the best method? Thank you so much!!

He would be better off with a group of his own kind. As long as the temperature in the two tanks is the same scoop him out of one and plop him into the other. Temp doesn't need to be identical, within a degree or so is fine.

 

[Byron]

I used to find one, two, three, and once five cory fry in the bottom of the canister filter when I had the 70g tank running with 50 cories of some 12 species. I would dip[ them out and just pour them into my 10g which at the time had a group of pygmy cories that spawned regularly, as I knew the fry could manage and not get eaten in there. When they were larger, maybe 5 or 6/8 (2 cm) I would net them out and into the main tank. My water is basically identical in all the tanks aside from pH which is below 5 in some and in the 6's in another, so I had no worry.

A sudden significant temperature difference with small fry can be fatal. Panda cories like it cooler, so the high 60's should not cause difficulty, though it is lower than I would have it.

If the egg survives predation (and any fish including the mature cories will readily eat any fish eggs they come across) and there are natural things like wood and plants, infusoria will inevitably provide food for the fry, and protection among the wood and plants. More than once I have seen a fry appear in the main tank. I don't aim at spawning fish, but when they do and one or two survive, it is rewarding to know you must be doing something right.

If you can get some dried leaves (oak or beech are ideal, maple will work, most hardwood tree leaves are safe) putting one or two in the tank will provide a good supply of infusoria, and fry always grow faster with dried leaves.

Just for fun, here's a photo of one panda cory fry after I put it in the "grow-out" tank; to give an idea of size, the substrate is play sand. Second photo is a group of 3 pygmy cories, the largest is one of the the original fish (a female), with a fry from 2 spawnings.

 

[scteel24]

Great pics! I always thought you had to do something special to breed fish, so I never expected this little guy. It's actually very fun and exciting to know he was born and raised in my tank! I wonder if I have accidentally cleaned eggs off of the plants or glass in the past not knowing what they were : (
The parameters of the waters are the same, but the temps are quite different. His current tank is 72 and the 10 gallon is 75.
Also, when is it a good time to move him? Is there a certain size he should be first? He's still kind of small, about half an inch tail to nose.

 

[Byron]

A difference of 72 to 75 is OK. You can return him to the tank with the mature panda cories once he is large enough not to be seen as food, and that depends upon the other fish. I would leave him to grow out a bit more.

 

[scteel24]

Sounds good - thanks!!!!