Tropical Tank To Marine ?

[tat2life]

oooh ok so i dont need to buy a big mechanical filter or skimmer ? just the normal filter used on tropical tanks ?

 

[STD]

oooh ok so i dont need to buy a big mechanical filter or skimmer ? just the normal filter used on tropical tanks ?

I would go for a skimmer

for your filteration use live rock

You also need a fair bit of flow in a Marine tank

 

[tat2life]

ok thanks... i think i will use live rock and the filter i have now in the tropical tank just to be certian. and a skimmer is not really needed but advised to have ? what else would i need to buy then to make it into a fish only tank... what type of heater, lighting etc.. thanks for all the reply guys. oh and im still unsure of wich type of fish i can actually keep in a fish only tank

 

[tat2life]

i just seen this post...

Volume: 30 gallons

Lighting: - 1 x 30W T8 Flourecent

Refugium/Sump - No refugium, No sump.

Filtration: - Filtration is via 40Kgs of mature LR, plus an Eheim 2028 external cannister filter filled with carbon, sponge, fine filter floss, and noodles.

Substrate: - 20 kgs of white Aragonite sand.


Skimmers: - I run skimmerless!

Water Parameters:

Average temp: 27c
pH: 8.2
Average nitrate level: 20
Calcium: Not measured
kH: Not measured
specific gravity: 1.028

Corals: Corals include Zoanthids, Mushrom's, Elegance Coral, Torch Coral and a Leather.

Fish:: 1 Pair of Barrier Reef Clownfish, A. Akindynos and 4 Blue Green Chromis, Chromis viridis


now he has no skimmer, no sump and no refugium ( what are they )
... doesnt that make it a fish only tank ? but he has living coral in there... how is that possible with a basic setup like that ?

 

[STD]

i just seen this post...

Volume: 30 gallons

Lighting: - 1 x 30W T8 Flourecent

Refugium/Sump - No refugium, No sump.

Filtration: - Filtration is via 40Kgs of mature LR, plus an Eheim 2028 external cannister filter filled with carbon, sponge, fine filter floss, and noodles.

Substrate: - 20 kgs of white Aragonite sand.


Skimmers: - I run skimmerless!

Water Parameters:

Average temp: 27c
pH: 8.2
Average nitrate level: 20
Calcium: Not measured
kH: Not measured
specific gravity: 1.028

Corals: Corals include Zoanthids, Mushrom's, Elegance Coral, Torch Coral and a Leather.

Fish:: 1 Pair of Barrier Reef Clownfish, A. Akindynos and 4 Blue Green Chromis, Chromis viridis


now he has no skimmer, no sump and no refugium ( what are they )
... doesnt that make it a fish only tank ? but he has living coral in there... how is that possible with a basic setup like that ?

As it has corals it classes as a reef

You can keep some corals , mainly soft ones without high levels of lighting

 

[tat2life]

ooh kewl. so what is the diffrence in tanks and fish from his set up and a tank full of corals, starfish etc etc. if i used my tank now... with normal lighting from tropical tank, standard filter from tropical tank, some live rock, a heater, and a pump.. and salt. what could i put it into the tank ? ideally i would like really bright fish and soft coral wich you can see moving about. the hard coral and rocks dont really do anything for me

 

[AK77]

oooh ok so i dont need to buy a big mechanical filter or skimmer ? just the normal filter used on tropical tanks ?

No. You don't require an external mechanical filter like those that are commonly used with freshwater setups, provided you have sufficient live rock in the tank. As mentioned before, Live rock provides the filtration for the tank. Its very porous and as such, provides ideal breeding grounds for the denitrifying bacteria. It is expenisve, but it looks great.

Basically a run down of things you will need for a marine setup.

Powerheads. (Water pumps that circulate the water. These are needed to keep the water flowing around the live rock)
Heaters. (Always have a backup incase one dies)
Protein Skimmer. (These aren't absolutely essential, as pollutants can be removed with frequent water changes, however they are highly recommended)
Live Rock
Sump (not essential but highly recommended again)
Calcium Carbonate substrate (aragonite sand. A nice deep sandbed will also provide a home for aerobic and anerobic bacteria too)
Marine Salt
UV Sterilizer (not essential but worthwhile investing in at some point to kill bacteria and parasites)
T5 lighting or Metal Halides if possible. Good lighting is a prerequiste of keeping corals.
Water testing kits for - Calcium, PH, Alkalinity, Ammonia, Nitrites, Nitrates, Phosphates and a million other things.
Refractometer for measuring the SG (salt content in the water)
Marine salt
Reverse Osmosis water (purchase from LFS, although in the long run its better to get an RO machine and produce it yourself)
To answer your other question, the specs you posted before are a FOWLR tank.. not Fish Only. FO literally contains just fish and is usually powered by an external filter or sometimes a deep sand bed. FOWLR is a tank with fish and live rock, but no corals etc as that would be classed as a reef setup.

Before you rush out and buy anything, take the time to research all the different setups that can be utilized to keep marine fish. For example, A fish only tank with just base rock can use regular tap water, that has been dechlorinated and has Marine Salt added to it. Although this often has high nitrates and phosphates, marine fish aren't as affected on the whole by these "contaminents". However, if you was to go this route, you wouldnt be able to keep invertebrates or corals. It does work out cheaper, but greatly limits your stocking options.

As mentioned before there are other filtration methods, from mechanical (external filters) to live rock, to deep sand beds or hybrids of the latter two. Personally I'd recommend going with a FOWLR setup first. Get to know about the water chemistry and getting it right. A sump is a worthwhile addition to have too, as it increases the overall volume of water, thereby reducing pollutants and making the chemistry more stable, but it also means that heaters and protein skimmers can be housed out of sight in the cabinet below. The sump can also contain a refugium, a chamber in the sump which has calm water in which macro algaes (seaweeds) can be grown. These absorb nitrates and phosphates and improve the water quality. When keeping corals, water chemistry is paramount and there are a lot of parameters to check and maintain in order to keep a healthy reef.

Try reading through some of the setup threads to see the different types people have used and equipment involved. The decide what you want to go for, then think about what equipment you will need and how to set it all up.

 

[tat2life]

thanks mate i think i will go for a FOWLR tank then once i get used to checking water etc i can always upgrade to a reef setup easily enough. the only thing im not 100% on is the diffrence between FO and FOWLR... i think the only diffrence is you can have live rock in the FOWLR tank. does it mean i can choose more types of fish aswell though ? etherwise i might go for the FO setup because the hard rock doesnt really appeal to my eyes and i can always buy some atifical rock for the FO setup. thanks for the very usefull reply im understaning better and better now

 

[STD]

thanks mate i think i will go for a FOWLR tank then once i get used to checking water etc i can always upgrade to a reef setup easily enough. the only thing im not 100% on is the diffrence between FO and FOWLR... i think the only diffrence is you can have live rock in the FOWLR tank. does it mean i can choose more types of fish aswell though ? etherwise i might go for the FO setup because the hard rock doesnt really appeal to my eyes and i can always buy some atifical rock for the FO setup. thanks for the very usefull reply im understaning better and better now

IMO live rock is the most essential item in a Marine setup

I have kept marine tanks without it but wouldn't again

I would do a lot more research before you jump into Marines

 

[tat2life]

yup i agree because it acts as a filter... as far as i know the faster the current the more it filters through the holes in the rock and also can have snails, hermets etc on them. but i thought it was possible to have some types of coral in the same tank as a FOWLR tank. once i have the basics learned i will ask the man at the aquariam shop everything else and i will keep the tank empty for a month or 2 so i get used to checking the water etc

 

[AK77]

thanks mate i think i will go for a FOWLR tank then once i get used to checking water etc i can always upgrade to a reef setup easily enough. the only thing im not 100% on is the diffrence between FO and FOWLR... i think the only diffrence is you can have live rock in the FOWLR tank. does it mean i can choose more types of fish aswell though ? etherwise i might go for the FO setup because the hard rock doesnt really appeal to my eyes and i can always buy some atifical rock for the FO setup. thanks for the very usefull reply im understaning better and better now

Live rock can be absolutely stunning. It develops an algae on it called Coralline. This is pink/purple (usually although there are others) and looks awesome. It also, as STD righly says, is probably the most vital thing in a marine setup. The rock also acts as a foundation for positioning corals etc. (btw the stats of the tank you showed is a reef setup not FOWLR as I first thought.. I missed the corals listed)

A tank with LR with coralline algae growth

Stocking a tank will depend on many factors. The size of the tank and the size the fish attain when fully grown. Some fish cannot be kept with certain other species or conspecifics (same species) due to being eaten or fighting with one another. Clownfish for example, look incredibly cute and are peaceful. Try putting more clowns in the tank and see what happens.

Some fish are also not reef compatible as they eat corals etc. LR will not affect what fish you can keep, corals will dictate what fish you can keep and the fish themselves. Also some fish will feed on invertebrates... so before you come back from your LFS with a nice pretty fish.. make sure it won't devour your equally pretty ornamental shrimp in one mouthful.

I would definitely recommend splashing out and getting LR. 5-10KG can cost as much as a half decent external filter, and it wont clog or need rinsing out every other week.

Keeping FO or FOWLR is not really that difficult, so I hope all the advice here doesn't sound to off putting or involved. Fish on the whole are quite tough, especially to high nitrate levels. Its when you start adding invertebrates like starfish and shrimp, that water quality/purity becomes more of an issue, but with some basic reading and addition of equipment/plants its relatively simple to achieve. The real headaches can begin when going with a full reef setup, as a good many parameters need to be achieved and maintained in order for corals to survive and thrive.

To give you some idea... I'd suggest going to http/www.reefcentral.com and go to their "Tank of the month" section. Look through various months and look at the setups and in particular, the huge amount of equipment they employ to run these things. This may give you some idea to the magnitude that can be involved.

At the moment I have a FOWLR setup, which I've had for a few months now. The tank was established for a few years prior to me getting it, so I avoided the cycling part. Since then modified the cabinet and I've added a sump/refugium and metal halide lighting, as well as macro algaes. I'm nearing the stage now where my water parameters are stabilizing enough to begin to think about adding corals.

Its not a cheap hobby, but its made more expensive through impatience and ignorance. I've learnt that first had at a cost of about £120 and a few dead fish!! That's why I'd strongly recommend you take your time, read and read, research and plan. Then ask for others opinions.. then proceed. In the long run it will be much more rewarding and less stressful.

It has been a nightmare for me, as I bought an established tank which had no sump. As I wanted to add one, I had to remove the central support column of the cabinet and fit an internal framework, while the tank contained all the LR and about 1/3 full with water!! I'd have much preferred to have done any modifications while the tank was empty, but unfortunately I didn't have this luxury.

 

[tat2life]

i have been looking up living rocks and some of them actually do look really nice. but i also read about a FOWLR setup and he also had a starfish in it... wich i think came from the living rock because he didnt buy it he just found it in the tank lol. he also had some soft coral in it. is it possible to keep a starfish in a FOWLR tank ? i will go to the local fish shop in the next days and see what i need to buy to cycle my tank.. without fish of course.

 

[AK77]

Live Rock often comes with "hitchikers". These can be crabs, shrimp, starfish or worms. Some are bad news. Some are just a bonus.

FOWLR just basically means a tank with fish and live rock... no corals etc. If you had corals then its would be classed as a reef setup.

My FOWLR has hermit crabs, a starfish, bristleworms, snails and shrimp.

 

[tat2life]

thanks mate i will start with a FOWLR tank then and get 3 or 4 fish, a few cleaners and starfish. from what a friend told me the only diffrence between a FOWLR and a reef tank is you deffinatly need a protein skimmer, the water temp etc all stays the same and you feed it diffrent food. is that accurate ? he said it worked him no probs at all so just curious if all i need to upgrade it to a reef tank is a skimmer... if i dont get one for the FOWLR setup. also he said you might need diffrent fish for the reef set up.

 

[AK77]

thanks mate i will start with a FOWLR tank then and get 3 or 4 fish, a few cleaners and starfish. from what a friend told me the only diffrence between a FOWLR and a reef tank is you deffinatly need a protein skimmer, the water temp etc all stays the same and you feed it diffrent food. is that accurate ? he said it worked him no probs at all so just curious if all i need to upgrade it to a reef tank is a skimmer... if i dont get one for the FOWLR setup. also he said you might need diffrent fish for the reef set up.

Even in a FOWLR its well worth having a protein skimmer, especially if you have invertebrates, because it removes a lot of dissolved organic waste that would otherwise just breakdown and pollute the water. I just cleaned my skimmer last night and was literally scooping big dollops of crap out with my finger. On a nanoreef tank (really small) you dont really need one as frequent water changes will suffice, but on larger tanks they are recommended, as frequent water changes means a lot of RO water and a lot of salt.. neither of which are particularly cheap lol.

Reefs contain corals and corals have to be fed phytoplankton, a marine algae that probably is largely responsible for all life on earth. Different things in a reef tank require to fed different things. Anenomes will feed on bits of fish or muscles for example.