Trigon 190 - My First Planted Tank

[spacewolf]

Hi to all.
 
This seems a good place to start, a journal of a newbie planning a low maintainance semi planted tropical community tank - hopefully.
 
I've recently come into possesion of a Juwel Trigo 190 tank my wife got from a friend of hres for two bottles of red wine. Along with the tank came gravel, filter / heater, a few rocks, loads of snails and not much else of any value. The filter housing was cracked and the head didn't fit properly. The filters were infested with a dozen or more large white / pale conical shaped snails and hundreds more tiny white ones, as was the gravel. The heater wasn't the original and had started to melt the housing, there was no light tubes but the light unit was still working. And there was a fair amount of thin but hard algae / limescale in various parts of the tank.
 
I figured the best thing was to chuck the gravel as I didn't know how long it had been there, and replace the whole filter assembly. In my innitial rush I hadn't given any thought to which way I was going to go with the tank so I managed to get a new newer version of the original Juwel 600l and replaced the light tubes with what should have been there. The tank has been scrubbed with a razorblade and Bicarbonate of Soda solution and rinsed and allowed to dry for a few weeks. In my mind that puts me back to effectively having a new but empty tank.
 
So, I am planning a tropical community with a fair amount of plants. Originally i was going to go with a 3D background and some rocks with a few plants but after looking at this forum and others I have decided that planted is good. I don't know if I will ever get to the point of having no filter and everything being oh so balanced but I do want a pleasant and healthy.
 
The tank needs to be fairly low maintainance due to work commitments and family life but I am a patient man and am willing to put the work upfront to reduce the problems later.
 
So here come the questions:
 
I know the tank needs to be cycled, this will be fishless (I do have that multi-testing API set), and the main thinking goes along with a soil type substrate with fine gravel or sand over the top. I have read that the carbon filter should be taken out if planting more than a few plants and then there is the light / CO2 ? fertiliser factors. I am looking to get two reflectors for the light unit to help with the lower parts of the tank. Are these factors going to work against themselves?
Plant varieties haven't been decided on yet but some wood / rocks for a natural(ish) feel and some carpet plant for most of the bottom, not all.
 
All comments are welcome and pics will come as and when I get anything done.
 
Blessings
 
 

 

[Alm0stAwesome]

HI! Congrats on the new tank and the decision to fishless cycle. This is a really fun period of planning while you're waiting on the tank to cycle. 
 
Juwel lights tend to be really good (sometimes too good for low tech tanks) and I don't think you'll need the reflectors. A lot of people actually remove the filtration unit from these tanks and just run an external filter but since you've already bought a new unit I'm sure that will be fine. 
 
I don't actually think that going for a soil substrate is the best route. Personally, it's not needed especially for a low tech tank. If you want to try something different down the line it's something you can experiment with but is honestly not necessary for good plant growth. My preference would be for sand, it's easy to clean (but some people have a different opinion on that as well lol) and is good for rooting plants. There is no need to take the carbon out of your filter, it is a good biological filtration and good to have in newly set up tanks. Yes it does eventually lose it's ability to adsorb but even then it's a good media for bacteria to live on/remove particles from the water. So just leave it in until it needs replaced. 
 
I'm sure there are other opinions out there but I kind of believe in going slow and seeing what's needed as issues arise. 
 
Don't think about Co2 just now. If you want low maintenance then it's not the route for you. Plus it's expensive to set up. Going for Co2 is a natural progression for many planted tank folks but you've got plenty of time for that down the road. There are a lot of options for ferts but you may find that you don't need any. I've used liquid ferts and liquid carbon (kind of a c02 substitute) in the past but am actually not adding anything at the moment - so far so good! 
 
I would get your tank set up and planted, see how you're plants are getting on and if they seem to need help look into what the problem is and maybe start adding ferts/carbon. Every tank is different IME. 

 

[spacewolf]

Thanks for the reply, that seems to have thrown out some of my initial concerns and looks for a simpler start.
 
As for the bulbs and reflectors, this tank is a few years old and has the thicker tubes - T8s I believe - they are about 26mm. This is why I was thinking on reflectors.

 

[Alm0stAwesome]

If they are the older type then I suppose there's no harm in going for reflectors

 

[spacewolf]

Hi to all.
 
Still researching and trying to decide on a style, what to use and where to get it.
 
I ordered some API test strips to check my water quality from the tap, the results are below. Can anyone tell me what these results mean in real terms?
 
GH = 180 ppm
KH = 240 ppm
PH = 7 - 7.5
NO2 = 3 ppm
NO3 = 160 - 200 ppm
 
I checked twice and the readings were the same and the strip have a expiry date of 03/2015
 
Thanks in advance for your help

 

[spacewolf]

Hi again.
 
Nothing really happening until I get some more stuff together but I had a reply regarding my water test above that showed the results maybe flawed. So I did the test agin this morning and got my wife to read off the results as I'm doubting my ability to interpretate them - dam being colour blind. 
 
The results are quite different and I believe much more acceptable.
 
GH = 180 ppm
KH = 180 ppm
PH = 7
NO2 = 0 ppm
NO3 = 40 ppm

 

[daizeUK]

That sounds better!  200ppm nitrate in your tap supply would be a great cause for concern!
 
Your water is medium hard with a fairly neutral pH which is absolutely ideal for keeping most types of fish.  You'll have a lot of options for stocking once your tank is cycled!
 
 

So, I am planning a tropical community with a fair amount of plants. Originally i was going to go with a 3D background and some rocks with a few plants but after looking at this forum and others I have decided that planted is good. I don't know if I will ever get to the point of having no filter and everything being oh so balanced but I do want a pleasant and healthy.
 
The tank needs to be fairly low maintainance due to work commitments and family life but I am a patient man and am willing to put the work upfront to reduce the problems later.
 
So here come the questions:
 
I know the tank needs to be cycled, this will be fishless (I do have that multi-testing API set), and the main thinking goes along with a soil type substrate with fine gravel or sand over the top. I have read that the carbon filter should be taken out if planting more than a few plants and then there is the light / CO2 ? fertiliser factors. I am looking to get two reflectors for the light unit to help with the lower parts of the tank. Are these factors going to work against themselves?
Plant varieties haven't been decided on yet but some wood / rocks for a natural(ish) feel and some carpet plant for most of the bottom, not all.

 
Firstly, having a planted tank doesn't mean you don't need a filter!
The carbon filter is usually only useful when you want to remove medications or tannins from the water or to help clean contaminants from a new system, otherwise you never normally need it in your filter.
I recommend that you do not rush out and buy reflectors.  They can markedly improve your light output which can encourage algae - not a good thing when you're setting up a new tank!  Start your tank off with low lighting, let it settle in and see how it goes.  Only consider upgrading your lighting after everything is stable and algae is under control and then only if you think you have a good reason to need more light.  Keeping your light low will give you a much smoother start.
 
Like AlmostAwesome I would recommend you start without CO2 and try a few easy plants first to get a feel for things.  Later if you feel your plants are not growing fast enough or looking healthy enough you can consider going high-tech with either liquid carbon or CO2.
 
Good low-tech plants include Java fern, Anubias and Cryptocorynes.  You can also try stems such as water wisteria, egeria densa, vallisneria and hygrophila polysperma.  With stems it's often trial and error to find which ones like your tank conditions as they will grow easily in some people's tanks but not others!  You can also try attaching some moss to wood but be aware that it can become leggy and overgrown if you don't trim it every few weeks.
Forget carpet plants until you have considerable experience; a good-looking carpet is very hard to achieve with a low-tech tank.

 

[spacewolf]

Hi to all.
 
Not much happening to the tank right now, been busy researching and reading up on all things tank related - ooh so much information.
 
daizeUK - thank you for your input. I have bought the reflectors but will hold of using them as you suggest.
 
I had forgotton how much I needed to just to start out, net, syphon, bucket, ammonia etc (all on order or bought) so I am still getting myself ready for an easiest set up as possible.
 
I have also found a new LFS about a half hours drive from me, found it by accident using a Google search. It took me just over an hour to get to it after been given numerous misleading directions but the guys there were really helpful and their tanks are in immaculate condition. They have offered to order in any plants or fish I may want, providing they can get them with no minimum order value, 10% of all fish purchaces for ever (just sign up for their news letter) and also said whenever possible they will price match anything within reason. Their reasoning - even a small profit in their till is better than it going in someone elses - bargain.
 
Putting this to the test, we were talking about soil type substrates for a planted tank and they only stocked two varieties. One was Tetra Complete, the other was four times more exspensive for the same amount - the guy in the store compared it to a Ford and a Ferrari. Well I drive a Ford so no contest and the reviews for Tetra seem quite good, so when I mentioned I could get Tetra on-line for £13 for 5.8kg he was shocked. He even said they couldn't buy it for that price but would I settle for £15? No problem (and no postage) so I bought two, also bought 20kg of silver sand - so that should be the substrates sorted.
 
I also have 3 pieces of bogwood on order and 10kg of Baltic Rock (Manten Stone), both of which should arrive early to midweek. I will have some dry runs at setting things up until I am happy but won't plant it until I have finally decided how much of anything I will need.
 
I have the black backgound stuck on now and the new filter is siliconed to the inside of the tank.
 
Thats's it for now.
 
Comments or advice always appreciated
 
Blessings
 
 
 
 
 
(edited for spelling and grammer)

 

[spacewolf]

It seems like an age since I posted anything, but with shift work, Mother's day, two birthdays and a concert in London I have had virtually no time for my tank and even less available cash.
Most things have arrived now and with a little devious use of time allocation I have now started to set the tank up.
 
The starting point!

 
 
Polystyrene sheet to help prevent broken glass and the rocks

 
Trying out some combinations

 
Finale with Tetra complete, rocks and roots

 

 
 
It may not be too apparent, but the Tetra complete goes right up to the base of the filter body, giving a fall from the back to the front of about three inches (75mm) down to approxamately 3/8 inch (7-10mm). I have still to add the sand over the top but wanted some feedback so I can start thinking about plants - types and quantities.
There is still a fair amount of space all round as I wasn't sure if I was going to impead circulation. The filter output is at the top of the filter on the left hand side of the pictures facing the front, the water is drawn in at the bottom, same side, again facing the front.
The gaps between the roots has been left deliberately big because my children wanted somewhere for the fish to swim through so will also remain sort of plant free to allow for this. I would like some tall plants on the left against the 'back' and some hanging moss on some of the front roots to give a slight curtain effect (if I understand some of my children's comments properly), but for the rest I am open to suggestions.
I should have a couple of weeks before I can actually get any plants, even then it will depend on what finance I have at the time, or will be the last week of May so I can plant every thing at once.
 
For now, that is it.
 
Blessings and thanks in advance
 
 
 
 
 
(edited for spelling, grammer and bad luck with inserting pictures)

 

[Wills]

It looks fantastic! I love the placement with the wood.
 
Whats the plans with the cycle? Do you have a plan for a fishless cycle yet?
 
It could be a good time to do it now before you can add plants? Especially if you need to leave it a month before you buy plants etc
 
Wills

 

[spacewolf]

Thanks Wills for the comments.
 
Yes, I am planning on doing a fishless cycle. As time is one thing I have, I was planning on leaving the tank dry until I can get it planted in one day. Then I was going to cycle using ammonia and probably let the plants settle for a month, then add fish. Most of my plans are payday related and that also depends on overtime and what my children need buying.
 
After looking at the pics above, I think I might scrape the Tetra complete forward a bit more. This should give me a bit more depth at the front, nearly three inches at the back is now seeming a bit much when I still have the sand to add. I can use that to make the height up again and still have a good depth for any plant type.
 
daizeUK has a really nice 120l tank called 'Eternal Cycle', that style seems to fit this tank quite well and I will be reading that thread again for some plant ideas.
 
As always, any advise is appreciated.
 
Blessings

 

[LilyRose Tank]

Looks great so far, you must be itching to get on with it inbetween life's hold ups, good luck

 

[spacewolf]

Hi all. Always seems like ages in between posts but life is hectic and money is in short supply.
 
 I am having a few issues posting pictures at the moment, don't know why, but as soon as I find the problem I will get some more posted.
 
The tank is ready for some plants and a mixed lot should be on it's way this Monday, so hopefully Tuesday will see some progress. I have changed one bulb (on the advise of the guy selling the plants) to a Hagen power Glow. This is slightly stronger at 20w and is a straight swap for  the Juwel bulb. He also recommended using the reflectors from day 1 so we will see how things go.
 
These are the plants on their way: 5 Giant Vallis, 3 bunched Rotala Indica, 1 bunched Hygrophila Polysperma, 1 bunched Hygrophila Difformis, 4 bunched Hygrophila Corymbosa Compata, 6 clusters of mixed Crytocoryne and some Christmas Moss. This appears to be a nice selection for £35 with some quick growing plants to get things going. The plan is to get these planted and then keep an eye on things for a week or so. By that time, if all is good, I should be able to start getting some fish in.
 
LilyRose Tank - Oh yeah, I'm itching. Thankfully I am quite patient, having little money actually helps, but things are coming together now and the excitement levels are rising.
 
As always, any help, comments or suggestions will be gratefully received.
 
Blessings

 

[508]

Looks great so far Spacewolf!
 
I would get some more foreground plants imo, since most of the ones you bought are more suited to the background. Think it'd look great if you planted them all behind the wood, leaving the crypts for the front and Christmas moss on the wood.

 

[spacewolf]

Thanks 508. Any suggestions on foreground plants?