Thinking you have lost me... I know, My loss...

[Magnum Man]

Well... I've decided to keep hanging... I will not be posting & asking questions much anymore, though I have gotten some really good answers to some of my questions, in the past... some questions I never did get answered... as many years as I've been in the hobby total... I'll just figure out stuff on my own... I'll continue to post on my Food growing Tilapia thread, as the fish mature, & any issues or mistakes I make, just so in case any are following in my footsteps, they will have a path to follow if they choose... but I highly recommend people go out & see what works for themselves... I might post a few pictures of my tanks now & then, when I feel like I can handle getting chastised for going off on my own path, & sometimes thinking outside the box...
carry on...

 

[WhistlingBadger]

Yep, a lot of opinions on here. Some members insist on stating their opinions as indisputable fact, which can cause problems and hurt feelings. As a mod, that always makes me uncomfortable, sometimes enough so that we step in and put a stop to it. But usually we let things go as long as the resulting discussions are civil. The culture that has developed on this forum seems to be biased toward low-ish tech, naturally planted, freshwater biotope (or at least regional) tanks, emphasizing big schools of small fish. These days, one rarely sees treads about monster fish, oddballs, predators, ultra-high-tech, saltwater, surrealist decor, or even artificial plants. But it hasn't always been that way and I suspect it will drift back in one or more of those other directions over time.

I would agree with Wills that tone of voice can be hard to gauge in an online forum. But sometimes people just disagree. Sometimes strongly. That's always the downside of any community, I guess. Like any hobby, there is more than one right way to do things, and if nothing else your post serves as a valuable reminder for some of us who tend to get stuck in one way of thinking.

Hope you'll decide to stick around, @Magnum Man , but if you need to move on, we understand. May your life be at peace and may your fishies be healthy!

 

[WhistlingBadger]

...when I feel like I can handle getting chastised for going off on my own path, & sometimes thinking outside the box...
carry on...

Sometimes, after doing your research, you just have to give something a try and see if it works. I once kept a big school of turquoise rainbows with a few huge comet goldfish, after researching and realizing that their preferred water conditions were actually quite similar. I caught a huge amount of grief for that on another forum ( @Slaphppy7 , is this bringing back any memories?) but they got along very well for many years.

The point is, once you've educated yourself and decided something makes sense, it is often ok to depart from the beaten path. After all, there was a time in history when the whole idea of keeping fish in a glass box was quite revolutionary. Somebody had to try it to find out if it could work.

 

[Magnum Man]

I posted some pictures of Coolie Loaches & got chastised both for only having 3 of them ( BTW... I think treating them as shoaling or schooling fish is completely wrong ) mine are never next to each other, they are very independent... that tank also has a couple inches of polished pebbles in the bottom... I was immediately told that I had to have sand in the bottom, for them to burry into... but in reality , they are swimming in the gaps of the pebbles, just like they would in sand... they stay below the rocks, as much as they would if I had used fine sand... my loaches came in really small, & went down there right away... I didn't see them for a long time, as food trickles down between the pebbles... they have grown exceptionally fast & look completely healthy & happy right now... coming out more often, assuming they are eating more being bigger

sometimes recommendations of the minimum fish you should have, drives me crazy... I will say on my Tin Foil barbs ( which a person shouldn't have... they are too big ) they need a group to keep from going crazy... but I have only 3 ( gasp ) Denison Barbs in that tank, & for some reason, that sets people off... mine are happy & healthy, and are pretty independent, but they also occasionally school with the Tin Foils, or with the Flying Fox ( maybe the Flying Fox tries to school with the Denison's??? ) but that tank is doing really well with 5 Tin Foils, & 3 Denison's... some times fish will school with other fish of similar size & shape... some people seem to get it, with rainbow fish... 4-5 varieties will all school together... some tetras will do that, some barbs will do that... I don't think they even need to be in the same family, as long as they are similar size, shape, & demeanor, & can take at least similar water conditions... I think that telling people they need to keep groups of large numbers of the same fish, is mostly false, as long as there are other fish they can school with in the tank...

enough said

 

[Lcc86]

I posted some pictures of Coolie Loaches & got chastised both for only having 3 of them ( BTW... I think treating them as shoaling or schooling fish is completely wrong ) mine are never next to each other, they are very independent... that tank also has a couple inches of polished pebbles in the bottom... I was immediately told that I had to have sand in the bottom, for them to burry into... but in reality , they are swimming in the gaps of the pebbles, just like they would in sand... they stay below the rocks, as much as they would if I had used fine sand... my loaches came in really small, & went down there right away... I didn't see them for a long time, as food trickles down between the pebbles... they have grown exceptionally fast & look completely healthy & happy right now... coming out more often, assuming they are eating more being bigger

sometimes recommendations of the minimum fish you should have, drives me crazy... I will say on my Tin Foil barbs ( which a person shouldn't have... they are too big ) they need a group to keep from going crazy... but I have only 3 ( gasp ) Denison Barbs in that tank, & for some reason, that sets people off... mine are happy & healthy, and are pretty independent, but they also occasionally school with the Tin Foils, or with the Flying Fox ( maybe the Flying Fox tries to school with the Denison's??? ) but that tank is doing really well with 5 Tin Foils, & 3 Denison's... some times fish will school with other fish of similar size & shape... some people seem to get it, with rainbow fish... 4-5 varieties will all school together... some tetras will do that, some barbs will do that... I don't think they even need to be in the same family, as long as they are similar size, shape, & demeanor, & can take at least similar water conditions... I think that telling people they need to keep groups of large numbers of the same fish, is mostly false, as long as there are others they will school with...

enough said

I think as others have said you sometimes have to do your own research, hope to find reputable sources (which in itself can be a nightmare!) And sometimes try new things. Sometimes you'll be right, sometimes you'll be wrong.

I myself have departed from the norm by keeping African dwarf frogs in with my corys. I know some people on here won't agree with it, and that's okay. I've made the decision to keep them with what I consider to be peaceful fish and feel I can give them a good quality of life in the community tank. However I'm aware that if it all goes wrong I'll have to move them and hold my hands up. I guess what I'm trying to say is we always have to be prepared to admit when we're wrong or we've learned something new or different or better. But ultimately we will all do things differently because we're human and we all aim to give our fish as good a life as possible. I'm sure if you felt your loaches weren't "happy" or thriving you would make changes too.

Edit - I think in the main this forum is friendly and really helpful. I used to be on a horse forum and my goodness I've never seen so many self-professed experts who insisted everything must be done their way in my life! I had to quit that one as it was relentless, whereas here I feel there is a bit more capacity to "agree to disagree".

 

[WhistlingBadger]

The whole kuhlis burying themselves in sand thing is interesting. Mine were always hiding out in the leaf litter and plants, but I never saw them actually burrow into the sand. I think the key is for them to have lots of hiding places, not sand. My only red light with pebbles or coarse gravel, from experience, is that it requires a ton of maintenance and/or a UG filter to keep it clean, and I prefer not to work that hard.

That said, I don't make it a habit to argue with success. My definition of success is fish that are active, healthy-looking, and long-lived. Some species are very picky in the conditions that will achieve this, but most have a degree of adaptability. That means that there is usually more than one way to get there. Often I have done everything "by the book" and still had fish get sick and die young. It's important to do one's research and do the best you can.

I myself am gearing up to try a firebelly toad in a paludarium with fish, which many people say is akin to certain death for the fish, as FBTs can release toxins from their skins when frightened. They might be right, but it's interesting that I've come across very few people who have actually tried it, and those few say it can work fine as long as there is plenty of space, the frogs aren't stressed or frightened, and the water is kept very clean. It's a risk, sure, but given my setup and water change regimen, an acceptable one; having done a great deal of reading, it makes sense to me that it could work well. The greatest challenge is proving to be actually finding one of the critters, as apparently they are no longer being imported, so only captive bred frogs are available.

 

[OnlyGenusCaps]

I myself am gearing up to try a firebelly toad in a paludarium with fish, which many people say is akin to certain death for the fish

Not to take from this thread... But, you can do it. I did it for years.

the frogs aren't stressed or frightened

Yup, that's when they release their toxin. Toxin is costly, they aren't just slopping it around. And if you are concerned, you can easily run carbon. I do it to reduce the impact of soft corals on my stony ones. Works great, and the water is so clear!

The greatest challenge is proving to be actually finding one of the critters, as apparently they are no longer being imported, so only captive bred frogs are available.

Yup, they are becoming as rare as hen's teeth! For disease control issues, amphibian imports are getting fewer and fewer. Good luck!

 

[Magnum Man]

I used to have a surinam toad... 15 - 20 tears ago... he was super cool... have never seen one listed since I got back into fish...

my biggest problem was keeping him in the tank... ( he never got out, on his own accord ) but I was younger then, & any time I had a group of friends over someone would always pull him out & parade him around the house... ( they looked like they had a tatoo "T" on his underside... top of the "T" went across his neck, then the long part of the "T" went from his neck to his butt, & he was so flat ( only a 1/4" thick ) for some reason everyone had to pick him up & show him around, when ever I had a group- of friends over...

well not from fish dealers anyway...

Surinam Giant Toad for Sale | Reptiles for Sale

BackwaterReptiles.com has awesome Surinam Giant Toads for sale (Pipa pipa) at unbeatable prices. Live arrival guaranteed when you buy a toad from us!

www.backwaterreptiles.com

 

[Magnum Man]

Look Fire Bellied Toads on sale...

https://www.backwaterreptiles.com/toads/fire-bellied-toad-for-sale.html

 

[OnlyGenusCaps]

I used to have a surinam toad...

They are so cool!!! I've thought about acquiring and breeding the dwarf species, P. parva. Too many projects, too little time! I suspect you may well understand this.

Look Fire Bellied Toads on sale...

Yeah, but they are albino. Plus, I'm not a fan of Backwater (or UG for that matter). For me, I just don't like their business practices (am I allowed to say that on this forum?). In my experience both are pretty shady and will gladly send you critters in pretty dreadful condition - sometimes with infections that threaten to wipe out whole collections. It's not certain they will send sick animals or anything. Like, I don't think they are nefariously infecting their animals in a backroom somewhere. But, they sure do seem willing to ship sick stuff on with little concern.

 

[WhistlingBadger]

BW is a little careless, huh? Thanks for the tip. Be that as it may, I don't want albinos. And I'd have a hard time spending $100+ for a frog, even a really cool one.

 

[Magnum Man]

I just punched the Surinam into the www. & that's the 1st thing that popped up...

I'm not in position to do non fish right now... clicked on turtles in their link, & they must have 50 varieties... we have a reptile / amphibian zoo semi local... I'm sure keeping than many amphibians would be challenging, let alone turning them over for sale

 

[Magnum Man]

sorry, just looked at the picture, didn't notice they were albino... maybe that's why they were so much money

 

[OnlyGenusCaps]

And I'd have a hard time spending $100+ for a frog, even a really cool one.

Yeah, the price of amphibians has skyrocketed. The hobby is smaller anyhow, and then there are even fewer breeders. You really want some sticker shock, check out the price of fire-belly newts these days! Remember those little things that cost like $3 back in the day? No longer, my friend! The same sort of Lacey Act amendments that have been proposed out of Florida, yet again!, were enforced on salamanders and newts for a few years (until a successful lawsuit ended the government preventing interstate trade in them). It did end imports. And almost eliminated the species in the hobby because people were afraid they would be arrested for owning them, and couldn't move with them across state lines. The hobby still hasn't bounced back. Probably never will.

I just punched the Surinam into the www. & that's the 1st thing that popped up...

Oh, my apologies. Please don't misunderstand, I wasn't critiquing you at all. I figured you plugged in a search just to see, and that came up. Those two companies pay Google et al. a lot of money to be the top outcomes of those sort of searches.

we have a reptile / amphibian zoo semi local...

Really?! I had no idea there was one down there. Is there a website? I live like 5 miles from Snake Discovery here.

sorry

You've got nothing to apologize for! Of course I have very little room to talk in this regard as I have similar tendencies. I've previously been accused of being a Canadian for doing that. By a Canadian!

 

[Magnum Man]

Reptile and amphibian Zoo… in Medford, MN

I’ll add a link soon