T8 Or T5 Electronic Or Magnetic Ballast/starter

I think with the advances in LED technology we will all be using them within 10 years or so. A mate of mine at work has an LED set up that mimics the sun rise, sun set & moonlight all at the correct time of day & all automaticly.
 
Right would this be an ok setup then

2x Korallen Zucht - T5 Coral Light 54w 10000k
Hagen Glo Twin T5 electronic controller or Arcadia Twin t5 controller.

I know the kz's are coral lights but i assume, maybe incorrectly that a 10000k coral light and a 10000k tropical light are the same thing ? If anyone could help me out do i can get on and order that would be great :)
 
sorry guys, out of time at the moment but will say a couple of quick things: I wouldn't go with the blue-white 10,000K spectrum color on a typical freshwater tank because that is meant to mimic the super-bright sparkly mid-day light over coral reefs in the ocean with absolutely no shade. Our tanks are meant to mimic freshwater that is back within the rivers, streams, bogs, forests underneath green shade very often. There is nothing terribly wrong technically (there is an aspect that light is light is light) but we'll get into it more later. WD
 
Bit of a shameless Bump but fishless cycling is using up all my patience quota at the moment :hyper:

Thought i would add my partial stock list as it stands just incase that effects lighting.

red phantom tetra 5.5-7 pH 22-28 Temp 1-12 Hardness
lemon tetra 5.5-7.5 pH 22-28 Temp 2-20 Hardness
Cardinal tetra 4-7 pH 24-29 Temp 0-10 Hardness
panda corydoras 6-7.4 pH 22-25 Temp 1-12 Hardness
Peppered corydoras 6-7 pH 22-26 Temp 0-12 Hardness

Ideal Water conditions 6.5pH 24 Temp 2-10 Hardness
Tap water 7.4ph

I was going to add a piece of oak which may lower the pH slightly and i also heard cory's and tetra enjoy the slightly darkened water but aside from that i don't really want to mess around with pH/GH ect as i believe it is beyond my current level off fish keeping. Plus i'm pretty sure my water is soft anyhow which is ideal.
 
sorry guys, out of time at the moment but will say a couple of quick things: I wouldn't go with the blue-white 10,000K spectrum color on a typical freshwater tank because that is meant to mimic the super-bright sparkly mid-day light over coral reefs in the ocean with absolutely no shade. Our tanks are meant to mimic freshwater that is back within the rivers, streams, bogs, forests underneath green shade very often. There is nothing terribly wrong technically (there is an aspect that light is light is light) but we'll get into it more later. WD


aha, that explains a lot WD. The tank came with coral sand in it & blue/white lights in the bar. So i am guessing it was a reef setup before I got it. I removed the sand & washed out the tank before use so at least I got that bit right.
I will stick with my pink lamps now.

Thanks for the info.
 
OK, let's stick to lighting on this thread Uriel.. let me try to paint the picture: (I'm making this up to try and explain what I'm thinking) as a beginner lets say you have 10 topics to master that play into this stage of the hobby for you. Each of those 10 topics might have 10 to 100 bits of info or skill processes that some of us know of. Transferring between 100 and 1000 topics to you in a meaningful way in a short period of time is pretty much impossible, lol.

Lighting is important to the fish in the sense that most higher level organisms have evolved to operate their biological machinery with the clock of the earth's rotation involved. Lighting can also be very important to the visual image of our tank, one of the main points to having the whole hobby. But really, the lighting/fish relationship is not one we worry about nearly as much as the lighting/plant relationship. Lighting is a major controlling factor for us when we work with live plants and deal with the algae.

As mentioned, we can break our thinking down into 3 aspects: light quantity, light duration and light spectrum (which is really just light quantity broken down into all the frequencies/colors.) Light duration is the easiest topic but one of your most powerful tools. We've already hit on this I believe: you need at least 4 hours of continuous light to get the photosynthetic machinery going in the majority of our aquarium plants so that they are actually making some useful sugars (food) for the plant tissues. The total hours will fall into the same ranges as the hours of days in various parts of the globe where the plants come from and for the various seasons - so you can picture a big range from 4 to 12 or so hours and this things -do- make a difference once you really get in to planted tanks, but for beginners the main lesson is that duration is the big tool in dealing with algae usually.

Light quantity and light spectrum are trickier topics with more information needed for understanding I believe. Let's mention quantity first. You can read in wiki about how photosynthesis works of course but we all know the photons go in there and provide the light energy to the plants. The history of talking about "amount" of light in our aquarium hobby world is basically a mess. Its all bound up in the fixed efficiencies of the old T12 and T8 mechanisms that were around for years and falls apart when other mechanisms are used. The "guidelines" were created just for these T8 type systems: somewhere around 2 watts per US gallon and below was said to be the "low-light" methodology range and above that was said to be the "high-tech" methodology range (each of these methodologies constitutes an entire set of techniques for success with a heavily planted tank.) This all falls apart if you use T5 or incandescent or metal halide or LED of course because the electrical systems driving these may have very different efficiencies and remember that our original "guideline" is based on power instead of a light measurement, quite unfortunately. (the lastest stuff being talked about among the plant experts at the AGA conference I just attended involved electronic sensor you hold down under the light.)

Hopefully we'll discuss light quantity more but one of the bottom lines is to realize that a T5 of a given wattage will give off a lot more light than a T8 of the same wattage - they have different efficiencies. All these different light types also have different "directionalies" in practice. Light emits off a fluorescent tube in a perpendicular circle, radiating out and so a lot depends on the reflector. LEDs are highly directional and dependent on their reflectors as are the big hot lamps used in marine setups. Why is directionality important? Well, one reason is that a lot of light can pour out of the *sides* of the tank and the taller the tank the more of that that happens!

Let's mention spectrum. On a practical plant growth level, the importance of spectrum gets exaggerated a lot in our hobby. In many ways light is light is light as long as plants get enough of it for a correct period of time. But in the end there are things to know. Plants mostly use red and blue spectrum areas to grow and there's lots of blue out there in bright sunlight in the ocean where lots of algae and bacteria grow at high rates. That's all I'll say about that at the moment. Spectrum -does- matter a great deal to how our tanks look, how our plants and fish look. In the freshwater planted tank world, 6700K is a good starting point but often combinations of different colored tubes will end up creating the most pleasing look in a given tank for a given aquarist. (Hey, I'm aware this is crazy long for a beginner post but I just wanted to give you a glimpse into the complications of where us "explainers" are coming from, lol, and why its so hard to talk about it at least for me in a given post.)

So where is the most middle-of-the-road place for beginners before they really figure it out? Perhaps T8 tubes of 6700K at 1.5w/g running for 8 to 10 hours inside a highly reflective reflector with the plants being dosed with liquid carbon and the macro and micronutrients figured out to be either the fish waste or small supplements that are kept under control by weekly water changes (a thing I'd call "reduced EI low-light technique".)

~~waterdrop~~ :D
 
Did u run the T8's with reflectors?

Interesting point here, do reflectors make a significant difference at all?

I only have 2 x 18w T8 Arcadia Original lamps and two reflectors and I can maybe gauge a 25% difference in brightness at best. Is it anywhere near that, it clearly isn't the 100% bonus they boast about.
 
Thanks Waterdrop. I know in some ways i'm trying to run before i walk but having followed a lot of bad fishkeeping advice in the past i'm trying to get it as right as i possibly can this time around to ensure the future happiness of my fish's.
 
Interesting point here, do reflectors make a significant difference at all?

I only have 2 x 18w T8 Arcadia Original lamps and two reflectors and I can maybe gauge a 25% difference in brightness at best. Is it anywhere near that, it clearly isn't the 100% bonus they boast about.

Reflectors make a huge difference in the output of light from your lamps, also keeping them clean (reflectors and lamps) makes a huge difference too.

SD.
 
Interesting point here, do reflectors make a significant difference at all?

I only have 2 x 18w T8 Arcadia Original lamps and two reflectors and I can maybe gauge a 25% difference in brightness at best. Is it anywhere near that, it clearly isn't the 100% bonus they boast about.

Reflectors make a huge difference in the output of light from your lamps, also keeping them clean (reflectors and lamps) makes a huge difference too.

SD.

Interesting, how much of the light do you think is reflected back in the tank? I do notice I can actually open the lid without being blinded of course which is a bonus!

What's the best method of cleaning a tube, just a dry dusting cloth?
 
Interesting point here, do reflectors make a significant difference at all?

I only have 2 x 18w T8 Arcadia Original lamps and two reflectors and I can maybe gauge a 25% difference in brightness at best. Is it anywhere near that, it clearly isn't the 100% bonus they boast about.

Reflectors make a huge difference in the output of light from your lamps, also keeping them clean (reflectors and lamps) makes a huge difference too.

SD.

Interesting, how much of the light do you think is reflected back in the tank? I do notice I can actually open the lid without being blinded of course which is a bonus!

What's the best method of cleaning a tube, just a dry dusting cloth?



I will try to keep this simple, if i go all technotalk you have permission to slap me.

Well a glass mirrored reflector should reflect nearly 100% of the light energy, just think of your bedroom mirror, the reflection is not darker than the real thing is it? Unfortunatly we cant very well use a curved glass mirror as a reflector because it would be too expensive. So we use curved "mirrored" plastic or metal.
This is a very good reflector as well & will bounce back about 50% to 60% of the light that hits it
The thing about your aquarium lamp is that half of its light output goes up toward the hood rather than down into the tank (I am oversimplifeing here). So if we can make use of this "lost light" we can effectivly nearly add half again the light output of the lamp.

Lets say that we pick a spot inside the aquarium & measure the brightness with a lux meter. Without a reflector it is 100 lux but with one it would be more like 150+lux that is a big improvement.

I hope this helps.
 
Alot of forums seem to think that the only differeence between aquarium tubes and standard T5 tubes is the word aquarium written down the tube and the 200% markup is this correct ?
 
yeah that is somewhat correct. Any T5 lamp of the same wattage/output will work weather you buy if from a LFS or home depot. However you still need to make sure the lamp has proper specs if you intend to grow plants. Thing is with normal household lamps most people like lower color temps like 2,700K, which is pretty crappy for aquarium used. Same with the super high 10,000K. With T5s you are not going to find a ton of selection at the home improvement stores. Home depot carries some, IDK exactly what though. Its much more true with T8's since they are more widely used. Home depot also carries ceiling mount fixtures in lengths of 2 and 3 feet that come in both double and single T5 lamps(NO). Just so those DIY people out there can go crazy. Come with single ballast, end fittings, and lamps. BTW do realize T5 bulbs are pricey compared to your normal T8, 54 watt ones are also expensive to ship if you buy them online since they are fragile and very long.

Reflectors are tricky things. They defiantly help, but how much depends entirely how they are made and setup. White plastic for example compared to a really fancy MIRO 4 reflector is a big difference. Also how the reflector is shaped makes a difference as well. This deals with restrike and a shiny reflector can be only somewhat helpful if it doesn't minimize restrike. Once you get into stuff like this, what it really comes down to is efficiency.
 
Yeah the lamps i was looking for where 6500k 54w t5's from GE. They are like £3 here. I was going to get the D-D Gullwing reflector and probably the arcadia Ultra Seal T5 Ballast as having researched non aquarium ballasts the cost seems pretty similar, where as the Arcadia comes with waterproof ends and ballast. All done it comes to about £80.
 

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