Stealth 300's Fishless Cycle

[stealth300]

Equipment

Juwel 800 Fish Tank.
Capacity: 110 Liters.
Capacity with subtrate and deco: 98 Liters.
Test Kit: Api Freshwater Master Test Kit.
Boots ammonia 9.5% (Aprrox 40-50 drops = 4ppm)
Baking Soda

Additional Notes

Raised Ph to 8.2 using baking soda.
Turned lights off on tank and covered.
Replaced Carbon filter with standard filter.
Raised tank temperature to 29-30 degrees.
Tap water readings: Ammonia 0ppm,Nitrite 0ppm,Nitrate 0ppm,Ph 7.6
Water quality: GH 50-100ppm,KH 50-100ppm
Added airpump and stone for increased aeriation
Added very small pinch of fish food

Test Results

(1st ammonia dose - 50 drops)

Day 1 -- 30/06/11 -- Readings: Ammonia 4ppm,Nitrite 0ppm,Nitrate 0ppm,Ph 8.2,Dose 0 drops,Temp 30c,Time 18:00
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Day 2 -- 1/07/11 -- Readings: Ammonia 4ppm,Nitrite 0ppm,Nitrate 0ppm,Ph 8.2,Dose 0 drops,Temp 30c,Time 18:00
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Day 3 -- 2/07/11 -- Readings: Ammonia 4ppm,Nitrite 0ppm,Nitrate 0ppm,Ph 8.2,Dose 0 drops,Temp 30c,Time 18:00
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Day 4 -- 3/07/11 -- Readings: Ammonia 4ppm,Nitrite 0ppm,Nitrate 0ppm,Ph 8.2,Dose 0 drops,Temp 30c,Time 18:00
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Day 5 -- 4/07/11 -- Readings: Ammonia 4ppm,Nitrite 0ppm,Nitrate 0ppm,Ph 8.2,Dose 0 drops,Temp 30c,Time 18:00
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Day 6 -- 5/07/11 -- Readings: Ammonia 4ppm,Nitrite 0ppm,Nitrate 0ppm,Ph 8.2,Dose 0 drops,Temp 30c,Time 18:00
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Day 7 -- 6/07/11 -- Readings: Ammonia 4ppm,Nitrite 0ppm,Nitrate 0ppm,Ph 8.2,Dose 0 drops,Temp 30c,Time 18:00
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Day 8 -- 7/07/11 -- Readings: Ammonia 4ppm,Nitrite 0ppm,Nitrate 0ppm,Ph 8.2,Dose 0 drops,Temp 30c,Time 18:00
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Day 9 -- 8/07/11 -- Readings: Ammonia 4ppm,Nitrite 0ppm,Nitrate 0ppm,Ph 8.2,Dose 0 drops,Temp 30c,Time 18:00
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Day 10 -- 9/07/11 -- Readings: Ammonia 4ppm,Nitrite 0ppm,Nitrate 0ppm,Ph 8.2,Dose 0 drops,Temp 30c,Time 18:00
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Day 11 -- 10/07/11 -- Readings: Ammonia 4ppm,Nitrite 0ppm,Nitrate 0ppm,Ph 8.2,Dose 0 drops,Temp 30c,Time 18:00
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Day 12 -- 11/07/11 -- Readings: Ammonia 4ppm,Nitrite 0ppm,Nitrate 0ppm,Ph 8.2,Dose 0 drops,Temp 30c,Time 18:00
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Day 13 -- 12/07/11 -- Readings: Ammonia 4ppm,Nitrite 0ppm,Nitrate 0ppm,Ph 8.2,Dose 0 drops,Temp 30c,Time 18:00
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Day 14 -- 13/07/11 -- Readings: Ammonia 4ppm,Nitrite 0ppm,Nitrate 0ppm,Ph 8.2,Dose 0 drops,Temp 30c,Time 18:00
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Day 15 -- 14/07/11 -- Readings: Ammonia 4ppm,Nitrite 0ppm,Nitrate 0ppm,Ph 8.2,Dose 0 drops,Temp 30c,Time 18:00
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Day 16 -- 15/07/11 -- Readings: Ammonia 4ppm,Nitrite 0ppm,Nitrate 0ppm,Ph 8.2,Dose 0 drops,Temp 30c,Time 18:00
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Day 18 -- 16/07/11 -- Readings: Ammonia 4ppm,Nitrite 0ppm,Nitrate 0ppm,Ph 8.2,Dose 0 drops,Temp 30c,Time 18:00
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Day 19 -- 17/07/11 -- Readings: Ammonia 4ppm,Nitrite 0ppm,Nitrate 0ppm,Ph 8.2,Dose 0 drops,Temp 30c,Time 18:00
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Day 20 -- 18/07/11 -- Readings: Ammonia 4ppm,Nitrite 0ppm,Nitrate 0ppm,Ph 8.2,Dose 0 drops,Temp 30c,Time 18:00
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Day 21 -- 19/07/11 -- Readings: Ammonia 4ppm,Nitrite 0ppm,Nitrate 0ppm,Ph 8.2,Dose 0 drops,Temp 30c,Time 18:00
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Day 22 -- 20/07/11 -- Readings: Ammonia 4ppm,Nitrite 0ppm,Nitrate 0ppm,Ph 8.2,Dose 0 drops,Temp 30c,Time 18:00
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Day 23 -- 21/07/11 -- Readings: Ammonia 4ppm,Nitrite 0ppm,Nitrate 0ppm,Ph 8.2,Dose 0 drops,Temp 30c,Time 18:00
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Day 24 -- 22/07/11 -- Readings: Ammonia 4ppm,Nitrite 0ppm,Nitrate 0ppm,Ph 8.2,Dose 0 drops,Temp 30c,Time 18:00
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Day 25 -- 23/07/11 -- Readings: Ammonia 4ppm,Nitrite 0ppm,Nitrate 0ppm,Ph 8.2,Dose 0 drops,Temp 30c,Time 18:00
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[Miles_hot]

You will probably be showing 5ppm for some time unless the bottled bacteria products defy the forum's expectations and actually work.
I would cover the tank to cut the.light getting in to limit / eliminate unwanted growths

 

[waterdrop]

Agree - you only need light in there when you're working in it. It often takes only a week of being stuck at 4-5ppm before you begin seeing some different readings but be aware that in a few cases it can take as long as two or even 3 weeks before anything gets going. In these more rare cases there is not really anything wrong (the cycle is eventually just as effective) but it often makes the beginning cycler think something is wrong with their tank or process, when actually there's not.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[stealth300]

You will probably be showing 5ppm for some time unless the bottled bacteria products defy the forum's expectations and actually work.
I would cover the tank to cut the.light getting in to limit / eliminate unwanted growths

Agree - you only need light in there when you're working in it. It often takes only a week of being stuck at 4-5ppm before you begin seeing some different readings but be aware that in a few cases it can take as long as two or even 3 weeks before anything gets going. In these more rare cases there is not really anything wrong (the cycle is eventually just as effective) but it often makes the beginning cycler think something is wrong with their tank or process, when actually there's not.

~~waterdrop~~

Tank now undercover,thanks for the advice

 

[stealth300]

Having still not being convinced im dosing ammonia to the correct amount i decided to do a 100% water change and measure how much water the tank would actually take with subtrate and deco aswell as how many drops of ammonia it would take to reach 4ppm.

Tank volume - 110 liters
Tank volume with subtrate and deco - 98 liters

Now im also struggling to tell the difference between the colours on the test kit so ive uploaded some pics for you guys to have a look at and see what you think.

Test 1 (dechlorinated water,no ammonia)

By stealth300 at 2011-07-08

Test 2 (10 drops of ammonia total)

By stealth300 at 2011-07-08

Test 3 (20 drops of ammonia total)

By stealth300 at 2011-07-08

Test 4 (30 drops of ammonia total)

By stealth300 at 2011-07-08

Test 5 (40 drops of ammonia total)

By stealth300 at 2011-07-08

Test 6 (50 drops of ammonia total)

By stealth300 at 2011-07-08

Test 6 different angle

By stealth300 at 2011-07-08


To me test 6 looks like 4ppm but the more i look at it the more i doubt it

 

[waterdrop]

You don't need to sweat it so much. It is indeed sometimes hard to tell the difference between the 4ppm green and the 8ppm green, we all have trouble with that to some extent. But as long as an amount that the calculator says should be 4ppm produces something reasonably close to looking like 4 then you are going to be fine. I think you would know it if you were regularly going overboard and getting 8ppm, it's really dark green you'd be putting in a lot more than the calculator suggested.

Not much of this is about being super accurate, it's more about being extremely patient and regular and waiting for the -dramatic- changes in color when these substances drop to zero ppm and looking at the overall timing of when those things happen. If you feel really worried the green is too dark then just go with it lighter, 2 or 3ppm will not be a terrible thing if it happens, just like a fishless cycler bumping up against 8ppm a couple times is not a terrible thing either as it takes quite a bit of that to have the wrong bacterial species develop.

Sounds like you're already doing the really good things: 29C temp, baking soda to get your pH up in the 8's, reasonable surface disturbance for a little extra oxygen, no lights if no plants, no wrong stuff in the filter, keeping a really good log (although it's going to get really long if you use multiple lines per entry lol.)

Eventually that first ammonia dose will drop to zero and shortly after that you should be re-dosing quite regularly. When that happens it's good to try to dose about the same hour each time (most choose evening or morning such that later when they start doing 12-hour testing it will fall on an hour when they can be home to do it.)

~~waterdrop~~

 

[stealth300]

You don't need to sweat it so much. It is indeed sometimes hard to tell the difference between the 4ppm green and the 8ppm green, we all have trouble with that to some extent. But as long as an amount that the calculator says should be 4ppm produces something reasonably close to looking like 4 then you are going to be fine. I think you would know it if you were regularly going overboard and getting 8ppm, it's really dark green you'd be putting in a lot more than the calculator suggested.

Not much of this is about being super accurate, it's more about being extremely patient and regular and waiting for the -dramatic- changes in color when these substances drop to zero ppm and looking at the overall timing of when those things happen. If you feel really worried the green is too dark then just go with it lighter, 2 or 3ppm will not be a terrible thing if it happens, just like a fishless cycler bumping up against 8ppm a couple times is not a terrible thing either as it takes quite a bit of that to have the wrong bacterial species develop.

Sounds like you're already doing the really good things: 29C temp, baking soda to get your pH up in the 8's, reasonable surface disturbance for a little extra oxygen, no lights if no plants, no wrong stuff in the filter, keeping a really good log (although it's going to get really long if you use multiple lines per entry lol.)

Eventually that first ammonia dose will drop to zero and shortly after that you should be re-dosing quite regularly. When that happens it's good to try to dose about the same hour each time (most choose evening or morning such that later when they start doing 12-hour testing it will fall on an hour when they can be home to do it.)

~~waterdrop~~

Thanks WD,mind is now at rest,and your right about the test result log so ive now edited the original post and cleaned it up abit.

 

[waterdrop]

Hopefully you are getting good surface water movement? You want to encourage a bit higher oxygen exchange during fishless cycling. Usually people figure out how to adjust their filter output to get this surface disturbance but sometimes we run across beginners who have just not heard this advice. WD

 

[stealth300]

Heres a picture ,i think i have good surface disturbance?

 

[waterdrop]

yes, obviously that looks quite good.

Looked back at your log. It must be some trick of fate that people who create nice easy to understand logs have to suffer through two weeks with no ammonia drop! Hang in there.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[stealth300]

yes, obviously that looks quite good.

Looked back at your log. It must be some trick of fate that people who create nice easy to understand logs have to suffer through two weeks with no ammonia drop! Hang in there.

~~waterdrop~~

It has become frustrating,coming home everynight to see green and blue on the test kit ,although im wondering if i put the cycle a week behind on initial setup from dosing too much ammonia.

Ive changed the white filter pad about 5 days ago because it was clogged with dirt from the tank (didnt wash the gravel for long enough by the looks of it),would it make a difference? and is it ok to change the white pad once a week ?(ive have a 2 meter roll of the stuff)

Thanks for the encouragement WD

 

[XeroTolerance]

It mush be frustrating not seeing a change in anything. I'm going to start my cycle process on Monday . To answer your question NO. Please do not change your filter media (I think that was what you were talking about) because that is what hold all of the "good" bacteria . If needed get some tank water and clean it of in a bucket.

Good luck!

 

[stealth300]

It mush be frustrating not seeing a change in anything. I'm going to start my cycle process on Monday . To answer your question NO. Please do not change your filter media (I think that was what you were talking about) because that is what hold all of the "good" bacteria . If needed get some tank water and clean it of in a bucket.

Good luck!

Goodluck with your cycle