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Stalled Cycle?
- Thread starter tomdaven
- Start date
TwoTankAmin
Fish Connoisseur
Do nothing yet. The bicarb is working as the pH shows us. Let's give the bacteria another day to get to work. If there is no movement at all in ammonia or nitrite, I am thinking you either convert to a traditional fisless cycle which will take a bit of time or else you will have to get new bacteria.
Mt guess is there is likely some amount of the bacteria still viable but how much is the question. Even a bit would still speed up a cycle. Again how much is uncertain still.
Did you retest your tap pH after outgassing?
Mt guess is there is likely some amount of the bacteria still viable but how much is the question. Even a bit would still speed up a cycle. Again how much is uncertain still.
Did you retest your tap pH after outgassing?
Before adding Bicarb the results were PH 6.6 Ammonia 3ppm and Nitrite 0.5ppm
24hrs later PH 7.6 High Range PH 8.0 Ammonia 3ppm and Nitrite 0.5ppm.
48hrs later PH 8.0, Ammonia 3ppm, Nitirte 0.5ppm. No change unfortunately.
I've got some new bacteria arriving today.
My tap water came back at PH of 6.6 after leaving it out for roughly 24hrs.
I await your expertise. thanks again
24hrs later PH 7.6 High Range PH 8.0 Ammonia 3ppm and Nitrite 0.5ppm.
48hrs later PH 8.0, Ammonia 3ppm, Nitirte 0.5ppm. No change unfortunately.
I've got some new bacteria arriving today.
My tap water came back at PH of 6.6 after leaving it out for roughly 24hrs.
I await your expertise. thanks again
TwoTankAmin
Fish Connoisseur
OK- the Bicarb pushes the pH to an equilibrium of about 8.3.
Your tap water is on the acid side at 6.6. Unless you are .ooking to keep fish that prefer aciid pH, I would like to see yours at about neutral aka 7.0. I also want this to be an easy target to hit and maintain. Baking soda is not the way to go for this because of the sodium content. I would prefer using crushed coral. It is easy to put into a bag in ones filter. The acid water will cause it to dissolve releasing the carbonates
So here is what I am going to suggest you do now. You are going to do a basic reset and start over since new bacteria is arriving. I would like to see the tank as close to "normmal" as possible before the new bacreria does in.
1. Get crushed coral or similar and put it into a bag in your filter.
2. Do a big water change. As big as you can. Refill the tank adding dechlor. Do not over dose and one which does not toxify ammonia would be great if possible. You will have to use some baking soda because the water needs to be at pH 7.0 or a tad higher. Add less than you did before as 8.0 is higher than needed.
3. Test for ammonia and nitrite. Ideally these should be as close to 0 as possible. Based on the ammonia test result, calculate how much ammonium chloride to add to get the level to between 2.6 and 3 ppm on the API test.
4. When you can be sure the pH is at least 7.0 and noy over 7.5 and that the ammonia is in the target range, then add the bacteria. Of course turn off tank lights
At this point you should be right at the beginning of Dr. Tim's instructions and should be able to follow them from there.
Because we know there is an issue with low KH, check this at least daily. If it drops, add a tiny bit of baking soda. The crushed coral takes a bit of time to start working. You may need to adjust the amount in the bag. As it gets used up if disappears from the bag which will need to be refilled over time. If the KH gets too high, this will act to raise the pH and the hardness (GH). Ideally, the crushed coral will take over the job of keeping the KH up and there will be no need for baking soda. (I had a 50 gal tank which held about 30 gals due to aquascaping. I needed to raise the HK and added a bag of coral. I used about 1/2 of an 8 oz, measuring cup for that.)
Keep posting your test results here and i will keep checking in. Ideally, what will happen is you get the ammonia up and the bacteria in and then you wait a to see the ammonia drop and nitrite appear. If all is well this will happen in two days give or take.
What will be happening in the tank is the nitrifying bacteria will be vreating the biofilm they will live in and which sticks them to hard surfaces. Over time other bacteria will also co,onize the biofilm and a symbiotic relationship will form between all the microorganisms that will end up living there. This biofilm protects the inhabitants from a lot of bad things.
Your tap water is on the acid side at 6.6. Unless you are .ooking to keep fish that prefer aciid pH, I would like to see yours at about neutral aka 7.0. I also want this to be an easy target to hit and maintain. Baking soda is not the way to go for this because of the sodium content. I would prefer using crushed coral. It is easy to put into a bag in ones filter. The acid water will cause it to dissolve releasing the carbonates
So here is what I am going to suggest you do now. You are going to do a basic reset and start over since new bacteria is arriving. I would like to see the tank as close to "normmal" as possible before the new bacreria does in.
1. Get crushed coral or similar and put it into a bag in your filter.
2. Do a big water change. As big as you can. Refill the tank adding dechlor. Do not over dose and one which does not toxify ammonia would be great if possible. You will have to use some baking soda because the water needs to be at pH 7.0 or a tad higher. Add less than you did before as 8.0 is higher than needed.
3. Test for ammonia and nitrite. Ideally these should be as close to 0 as possible. Based on the ammonia test result, calculate how much ammonium chloride to add to get the level to between 2.6 and 3 ppm on the API test.
4. When you can be sure the pH is at least 7.0 and noy over 7.5 and that the ammonia is in the target range, then add the bacteria. Of course turn off tank lights
At this point you should be right at the beginning of Dr. Tim's instructions and should be able to follow them from there.
Because we know there is an issue with low KH, check this at least daily. If it drops, add a tiny bit of baking soda. The crushed coral takes a bit of time to start working. You may need to adjust the amount in the bag. As it gets used up if disappears from the bag which will need to be refilled over time. If the KH gets too high, this will act to raise the pH and the hardness (GH). Ideally, the crushed coral will take over the job of keeping the KH up and there will be no need for baking soda. (I had a 50 gal tank which held about 30 gals due to aquascaping. I needed to raise the HK and added a bag of coral. I used about 1/2 of an 8 oz, measuring cup for that.)
Keep posting your test results here and i will keep checking in. Ideally, what will happen is you get the ammonia up and the bacteria in and then you wait a to see the ammonia drop and nitrite appear. If all is well this will happen in two days give or take.
What will be happening in the tank is the nitrifying bacteria will be vreating the biofilm they will live in and which sticks them to hard surfaces. Over time other bacteria will also co,onize the biofilm and a symbiotic relationship will form between all the microorganisms that will end up living there. This biofilm protects the inhabitants from a lot of bad things.
Hi, just an update, its day 6 of the new cycle today.
Removed 98% of the water from tank and added new water (with Prime).
Tank PH was 6.8, Ammonia and Nitrite were 0.
Added bicarb, which raised PH to 7.4
Added new bacteria and then Ammonia (roughly 2.6ppm reading).
Day 1 PH 7.4, Ammonia 2.6, Nitirite 0.
Day 2-4 had same results as Day 1.
Day 5 PH 7.4, Ammonia 2, Nitrite 0.25
Day 6 PH 7.4, Ammonia 2, Nitrite 0.25
KH/GH kit arrived today (day 6) tested tank water KH is 5dKH / 89.5ppm.
Checked my tap water: PH was 6.8, KH is 35.8ppm, GH is 17.9ppm.
Let me know what you think. Thanks
Removed 98% of the water from tank and added new water (with Prime).
Tank PH was 6.8, Ammonia and Nitrite were 0.
Added bicarb, which raised PH to 7.4
Added new bacteria and then Ammonia (roughly 2.6ppm reading).
Day 1 PH 7.4, Ammonia 2.6, Nitirite 0.
Day 2-4 had same results as Day 1.
Day 5 PH 7.4, Ammonia 2, Nitrite 0.25
Day 6 PH 7.4, Ammonia 2, Nitrite 0.25
KH/GH kit arrived today (day 6) tested tank water KH is 5dKH / 89.5ppm.
Checked my tap water: PH was 6.8, KH is 35.8ppm, GH is 17.9ppm.
Let me know what you think. Thanks
As TwoTankAmin says in his fishless cycling method, KH should be kept above 55 ppm. Your tap water is below this level, but with adding bicarb the tank water is now above it. Keep an eye on it to make sure it stays above 55 ppm.
Hi again,
Onto day 14 of the cycle and just after some advice.
At day 10 my Ammonia dropped and the Nitrite shot up (just like in the graph on the forum).
But then the Nitrite stayed very high for the next few days. I was concerned it would stall the cycle as it was too high (bright fuchsia colour).
On another recent thread (https://www.fishforums.net/threads/simplified-fishless-cycling-instructions.477425/) the suggestion was to do a water change to drop the ammonia/Nitrite to zero and then add Ammonia and continue the cycle.
I did this (day 13) but today the Ammonia has dropped but the Nitrite has gone high again.
Just unsure what to do next? Thanks Data below and photo is of Nitrite test today (bright fuchsia colour again).
| | PH | Ammonia | Nitrite |
1 | 2.5ml | 7.4 | 2.5 | 0 |
2 | | 7.4 | 2.5 | 0 |
3 | | 7.4 | 2.5 | 0 |
4 | | 7.4 | 2.5 | 0 |
5 | | 7.4 | 2 | 0.2 |
6 | | 7.4 | 2 | 0.2 |
7 | | 7.4 | 2 | 0.25 |
8 | | 7.4 | 1.5 | 0.4 |
9 | | 7.4 | 1 | 2 |
10 | | 7.4 | 1 | Over 3 |
11 | | 7.4 | 1 | Over 3 |
12 | | 7.4 | 1 | Over 3 |
13 | 2.5ml | 7.4 | 3 | 0.25 |
14 | | 7.4 | 0.5 | Over 3 |
Attachments
The instructions in the link say to do a water change only once the cycle has finished.
Stall point is around 16 ppm, too high for our test kits to read. But if you follow the instructions faithfully nitrite should never each that high.
However, if too much ammonia (either more than 3 ppm doses, or adding it more often than the instructions say) has been added nitrite may well be over stall point, and then a water change is needed to drop nitrite.
Your table shows the cycle proceeding normally
Stall point is around 16 ppm, too high for our test kits to read. But if you follow the instructions faithfully nitrite should never each that high.
However, if too much ammonia (either more than 3 ppm doses, or adding it more often than the instructions say) has been added nitrite may well be over stall point, and then a water change is needed to drop nitrite.
Your table shows the cycle proceeding normally
Thanks that's very reassuring. So you believe i am at Stage 2?The instructions in the link say to do a water change only once the cycle has finished.
Stall point is around 16 ppm, too high for our test kits to read. But if you follow the instructions faithfully nitrite should never each that high.
However, if too much ammonia (either more than 3 ppm doses, or adding it more often than the instructions say) has been added nitrite may well be over stall point, and then a water change is needed to drop nitrite.
Your table shows the cycle proceeding normally
Also I put the wrong link in
High nitrites, low ammonia, what to do next?
Okay so i’ve been cycling my ten gallon tank for about a week. I started with an initial dose of about 3ppm ammonia (looking back probably too high) and waited a couple days. I added a full cap of seachem stability on the first day and have been adding a half cap every day since. By day four...
www.fishforums.net
where you suggested to another member to do the water change to drop the Nitrite.
It wasn't clear in that thread just how much ammonia had been added, and after a water change nitrite was still off the top of the scale. There was the possibility that too much ammonia had been added too quickly. As 10 gallons is small enough to do a total water change without too much trouble I thought in this case, where I wasn't sure how much ammonia had been added, that resetting back to tap water levels, then adding ammonia and following TwoTankAmin's instructions to the letter was probably the best course of action.
This is probably the best advice I have seen here. I get how impatient we can get, I used to be that way when I started decades ago (yes I'm old). The cycling process is so simple when you just let it happen all on it's own.to both.
Be patient, you'll get there....nothing good happens fast in this hobby
Be sure to read up on cycling here, if you haven't already: https://www.fishforums.net/threads/cycle-your-tank-a-complete-guide-for-beginners.475055/
I've learnt so much since buying my tank and joining this forum, but one thing I've learnt is that being patient is definitely key.
After 26 days my tank has tested zero for Ammonia and Nitrite (within 24hrs of a full dose of Ammonia).
Due to get my fish tomorrow (after the big water change!) can't wait.
Thanks for all the help and advice.
After 26 days my tank has tested zero for Ammonia and Nitrite (within 24hrs of a full dose of Ammonia).
Due to get my fish tomorrow (after the big water change!) can't wait.
Thanks for all the help and advice.
Cycling is enjoyable. Motorists make it painfulCycling is easy....PEOPLE make it hard
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