rinsing bio in tap?

[gilpi]

Hmm, this is almost like a political discussion, tap water vs tank water

Me, I vote for tank water, been doing it for years without issues.

 

[davros]

I'd have to run a bucket of tap water to wash my filter media as I'm not allowed to use the sink for things like that (I should never have used the word bacteria in front of my husband). So since I have buckets of nice warm tank water I use those.

I suppose it is not funny for you but this ,makes me laugh every time

 

[Essjay]

I've had 20 something years to get used to it

 

[Ichthys]

Especially once established, there is far more beneficial bacteria in the tank, especially the SUBSTRATE, than in any filter. So you can clean filter sponges in tap water and never see a problem.

Only in a low-bioload tank.

 

[AbbeysDad]

Only in a low-bioload tank.

Nay nay... any tank. Hobbyists have been brain washed for years (that's right I said it!) by manufacturers that beneficial biology only lives in special bio-media in filters. It's marketing hype that's just not true. We've also been 'informed' that sponge material is only for mechanical filtration when in fact it's an excellent home for bacteria (not unlike the kitchen sponge - oh no!).
Now that's not to say there is little/no BB in the filter because there is - especially in the filter that's allowed to mature into a healthy colony - HOWEVER, the filter is not the only game in town....Have you heard that manufacturers rate bio-media on surface area? Consider the surface area on and in the substrate.
Believe it or not!

 

[reptilenotfish]

Nay nay... any tank. Hobbyists have been brain washed for years (that's right I said it!) by manufacturers that beneficial biology only lives in special bio-media in filters. It's marketing hype that's just not true. We've also been 'informed' that sponge material is only for mechanical filtration when in fact it's an excellent home for bacteria (not unlike the kitchen sponge - oh no!).
Now that's not to say there is little/no BB in the filter because there is - especially in the filter that's allowed to mature into a healthy colony - HOWEVER, the filter is not the only game in town....Have you heard that manufacturers rate bio-media on surface area? Consider the surface area on and in the substrate.
Believe it or not!

I agree, that's why sponge filters and undergravel filters are so excellent at bio-filtration.

 

[TwoTankAmin]

I have great well water and never treat it. However, I rinse media in a bucket of tank water for the most part. The reason is simple. My tanks are spread out in two buildings and 4 rooms. It would be more work to carry the media to where there is a sink I can use. and then to return it. Plus I am using tank water I would be removing anyway for the weekly water change. Plus, some tanks only need the prefilter rinsed. When almost nothing comes out, I know I do not need to rinse the media yet.

In addition, when I turn on the hot water, it doesn't come out hot immediately, it has to be run for a whole for the hot to emerge. As I move from tank to tank I would have to repeat this waste of water.

 

[Ichthys]

Nay nay... any tank.

Sorry but this is simply not true.

Bacteria colonise most surfaces in a tank, so in a low bioload tank (ie small fish) there’s a significant amount of bacteria in the tank. But with large fish it’s very different. A 12” fish is the equivalent of approximately 512 x 1.5” fish (of the same shape). If you keep big fish, you have thousands of times more bacteria, and most of them are in the filter. The amount in the tank is negligible.

 

[AbbeysDad]

If you keep big fish, you have thousands of times more bacteria, and most of them are in the filter. The amount in the tank is negligible.

Agree to disagree .... Again there is far more surface area for BB in the substrate than in any filter.
I would agree that in a tank with limited or no substrate, then with only slight exception, the filter is the only place for a BB colony.
Footnote: Then again, even with my 50+ years in the hobby, I've never had really large fish...although I do have tanks that from a bio-load perspective, would be considered to be overcrowded.

 

[BrianK]

I would think it would depend on what kind of substrate you are using. Sand or soil would have very little flow through and would think very little bacteria processing ammonia. No idea though really.

 

[Ichthys]

I would agree that in a tank with limited or no substrate, then with only slight exception, the filter is the only place for a BB colony.

This after you’ve said twice that it isn’t true “in any tank”.

It’s only common sense. If your substrate is full of bacteria (with sand they’re only at and very near the surface of the substrate), and then they multiply 2 or 3 thousand-fold, where are they?
Suggestion…. Keep big fish with any substrate you like, and then remove the filter and watch them all die, then have a rethink.

 

[AbbeysDad]

I would think it would depend on what kind of substrate you are using. Sand or soil would have very little flow through and would think very little bacteria processing ammonia. No idea though really.

It likely varies with the grain size of the sand. I believe that my pool filter sand is permeable up to 2" deep where finer sands may only be 1" deep or so. And this may be enhanced by the activity of tunneling Malaysian Trumpet Snails. Other beneficial biology can exist in deeper levels hence the success of deep sand. Consider the combined surface areas of even one inch of substrate in the aquarium compared to the bio-media in any filter. It makes you stop and think.

Keep big fish with any substrate you like, and then remove the filter and watch them all die, then have a rethink.

I would think that larger fish could or should have larger tanks with even more substrate making the bio-load to substrate somewhat relative with smaller fish in smaller tanks. In any case, it seems to me that the amount of beneficial biology in the established aquarium becomes relative to the bio-load and only a portion lives in filter media.
Regardless, we may be beating a dead horse here since there's no way that I'm aware that we can measure the size and location of BB colonies.

 

[reptilenotfish]

this thread has reached that point, where the information and opinions are given, and now it's just argument The fish forum formula.
Thanks all for the good info

 

[TwoTankAmin]

There is science on this, as always. Unless one has a planted substrate the nitrifyers cannot survive as the depth of any substrate approachs an inch . Normally the bacteria will be even shallower.

There is no rule of thumb for bacteria location. They will live in the greatest number where the thing as they need are delivered in the most constant way. The one thing that is certain is that they area somewhat photosensitive and do not live in bright light. This is why if one uses one of the viable bottled starter bacyerial sol,ution that the directions instruct one to turn of the tank lights.

All of my tanks are cycled just fine. Some are bare bottom, some have sand and some have gravel. Some are planted and some are not. The thing about the bacteria is, if you provide ammonia, they will colonize and reproduce and do so the best way possible. of couse they need other things but without ammonia they do not come.

In planted tanks it is common for the plants whose roots are in anaerobic zones whill transport oxygen from their leaves done their stems in into the roots where it is released into the substrate. this turns what was anaerobic, aerobic. And, once there is oxygen there will be ntrifyers colonizing. And when they do and are making nitrate, in areas above and below the one the roots have oxygenated, there will be areas of denitrification established.

Like I said, the bacteria seem to find a way even if they need a bit of help.