Red Tail Black Shark Tankmates?

[jmkgreen]

I'm sure we could all say "I'll just have this fry as he grows then I'll get him a bigger tank" but unless words are followed by action at the appropriate time it's meaningless.

I guess in that respect someone's credability can be judged on their history alone.

 

[Whitester]

I think the problem here is boboboy comes off alittle strong. Maybe he has had to answer the same question time after time. It can get alittle frustrating. boboboy needs some lessons in manners. Maybe others wouldn't think he is the "king" if boboby used alittle more class when expressing his concerns.

 

[MewMew42]

I'm sure we could all say "I'll just have this fry as he grows then I'll get him a bigger tank" but unless words are followed by action at the appropriate time it's meaningless.

I guess in that respect someone's credability can be judged on their history alone.

okay, fair enough

I was just under the impression that since the op asked us first that they cared about their fish

 

[raptorrex]

NO you can not keep am RTBS, in a 10 gallon tank! even as a adolescent, it needs 2-3 times that volume. not only will the RTBS suffer, but it would kill any fish you have with it. (not that there are many fish, except bettas, that can live in such a small tank)! the RTBS, alone, will need 40+ gallons.

personally, i think the tank is too small for the dinos. perhaps if you do some research on the fish you wish to keep, you may have better luck.

ok so my answer to the op. concise, polite and, backed by all members ((posting on this thread, who know about RTBS). but true, i make a "personal" comment on dinos being too big for such a small tank, (also backed up by members with knowledge of these fish).

I wasn't trying to be misleading and I meant on it's own!

Scientific Name : Epalzeorhynchus bicolor

Common Names : Red Tailed Shark, Red Tail Black Shark, Red Tailed Labeo, Fire Tail, Labeo bicolor

Care Level : Easy, good for freshwater beginners

Size : Up to 6 inches (15 cm)

pH : 6.5 - 7.5

Temperature : 73°F - 79°F (23°C - 26°C)

Water Hardness : 10° to 16° dH,

Lifespan : 5 - 8 years

Origin / Habitat : Thailand

Temperament / Behavior : These fish can be hostile and are not recommended for community fish tanks with smaller tropical fish. They seem to behave when kept with larger fish.

Breeding / Mating / Reproduction : Very difficult to breed in the home fish tank.

Tank Size : 10 gallon or larger.

Compatible Tank Mates : Larger tropical fish given their aggressive nature but none large enough to eat them. It is not recommended to keep them with the Rainbow Shark unless your tank is sufficiently larger.

now this post!
the profile is, faulty at best. and the tanks size, potentially dangerous for the fish. even a little research (on behalf of the poster) would have shown up this "low quality" profile. now we higher posters have a responsibility to, less experienced members. ignoring if it is true, for the moment, or not. high post counts lead people to believe that the information given is of "high quality". now a nub could be forgiven for taking this (rubbish) profile as being "totally true". therfore, armed with the knowledge that they got info from a reliable source, why should the nub look any further? in truth the RTBS is a very good community fish, that likes a bit of "catch and tig". but given enough space, will worry no fish (with the exception of other RTBs or Rainbow). it is a beautiful and energetic fish, and makes a fine addition to any community.
the above is why i chose to point out "glolite" had made such a basic error.

as for upsetting people? people often take offence to being "told" they are wrong. it happens to me, and will, now doubt, happen to most of us at some stage. you take it and learn, not try and defend an indefensible stance.

10 gallons is too small even for a juvi RTBS, it simply does not have the area needed to developed. as pointed out by all those who posted on the topic (ok one thinks 20x30cm is ok, few if anybody else would) 40 ukg is a minimum tank size for these fish. indeed as adults 60+ ukg should be your target (minimum).

and another "trueisum", "I'll be getting a bigger tank next year". it very rarely happens. i mean on offence, but few "bigger tanks" ever turn up. those who do get the "bigger" tank, often had a "proper sized tank in the first place. buy fish, only, for the size of tank you have now. when and if you get a bigger tank, buy the fish for it then. i know its hard to ignore the fish you want, i suffered too, but in the end its something you must do.
if the above sentence seems, stupid or bossy, you may be in the wrong hobby. you may not like my advice, but none of it is incorrect in any way.

 

[cookiemistress]

I think the problem here is boboboy comes off alittle strong. Maybe he has had to answer the same question time after time. It can get alittle frustrating. boboboy needs some lessons in manners. Maybe others wouldn't think he is the "king" if boboby used alittle more class when expressing his concerns.

I completely agree, there i no need to come off that strong. I my self have seen alot of different sites that say a 10g tank for one adult rtbs wouldnt personally have one but the bigger the tank the better.

 

[Geoff1991]

Why argue when people are giving perfectly legitimate advice. The RTBS needs a big tank as it is territorial and needs a large area to call its own other wise it will be aggressive and unhappy, it also needs swimming room.

Also, i dont agree with getting a fish that needs a bigger tank with plans of upgrading. Say if you aren't in the financial position to upgrade when you need to. Then what? The fish suffer.

 

[raptorrex]

I completely agree, there i no need to come off that strong. I my self have seen alot of different sites that say a 10g tank for one adult rtbs wouldnt personally have one but the bigger the tank the better.

indeed advice is patchy. whilst i have failed to find a forum that states 10ukg for an RTBS. i did find one that states, 20ukg. virtually all other links lead to 40, 55 or more gallons per fish. and the advice is posted here, time and time again.

Why argue when people are giving perfectly legitimate advice. The RTBS needs a big tank as it is territorial and needs a large area to call its own other wise it will be aggressive and unhappy, it also needs swimming room.

Also, i dont agree with getting a fish that needs a bigger tank with plans of upgrading. Say if you aren't in the financial position to upgrade when you need to. Then what? The fish suffer.

lol, "shoot the messenger".
its often easer to ignore, "unpleasant" advice, by claiming it was a "little strong". it would not be so bad, if the advice i was giving was from "left field", instead of being common knowledge to those who care to find out!

 

[arobinson1984]

Boboboy, the site in question giving that false information is www.fishlore.com

I'd advise everybody not to use this site in future when researching fish suitability

Andy

 

[raptorrex]

Boboboy, the site in question giving that false information is www.fishlore.com

I'd advise everybody not to use this site in future when researching fish suitability

Andy

thanks for the site. i have never visited this site, so cant say if all the advice is of the same quality. but its worth checking every site and forum you can. then make your own determination of the "true" facts. some sites may give advice lke this for RTBS, but give the best advice on the planet for, say, silver dollars. there seems to be no, single, repository you can "totally" trust. but if you advise against visiting this site for information, i will follow your advice, again thanks for the name.

we can, of course, keep fish any way we like, (even to the point of killing them for fun). but don't expect keepers who care for fish in general, to be quiet! we wont, if that upsets. "Ahh well never mind", "such is life". i have no wish to "upset" anyone. but i would rather upset a member/members, than let them to harm a fish, via "faulty" advice or inexperienced ignorance. its what these forums are hear to do, pool and pass on experience.

 

[arobinson1984]

The site seems to have been suspended for some reason

I found that site myself last week when this thred was started by a simple google search and the info given matches word for word what was pasted on this site

Andy

 

[Tokis-Phoenix]

I have my RTBS in a 125gallon community tank- i would they are semi-aggressive/territorial fish, so while they are aggressive/territorial fish they can be kept with quite a few types of fish (depending on the RTBS's nature, as their aggressiveness/territorialness does vary a bit from fish to fish- mine is medium aggressive/territorial). Over the years i have had different fish with my RTBS and these are the fish i would say that work out well with my RTBS and the ones which don't;

Fish which work out well with RTBS in my experience;

Danio's of any type (haven't tried any long fin varieties though)
Harlequin tetra's
Cherry Barbs (as long as there is enough planting in the tank)
Yoyo loaches
Khuli loaches
Clown loaches
Pleco's of any type
White cloud mountain minnows

Fish which don't work out so well with RTBS in my experience;
Most livebearers, especially guppys
Corys (RTBS too boisterous for them IMO)
Neon tetra's (although it never went for them, i think the RTBS too boisterous for them IMO- when i moved them to a more peaceful tank they shoaled less and generally seemed happier)
Gourami's of any type

I would definitely advise against putting any red fish, black fish, shark type/shape fish or fish with similar markings markings as an RTBS (like having a bold tail tail color/patterning) etc. Also don't mix fish which have long fins, can't swim very fast/are not very agile, are territorial themselves or prefer a peaceful laid back community tank.

The habitat i have in my tank is one which has 3 main caves made out of bogwood stacks (which help to break up the viewpoint in the tank), some plants dotted here and there and a soft white sand substrate. Its important to breakup the viewpoint in the tank and to offer the shark at least one than one cave (as although it is a very active fish it will like to spend some of its time in a cave) as this will help reduce its territorialness/aggressiveness. RTBS have a mostly veg orientated diet (although they are omnivores at heart) and love algae wafers (i feed my RTBS an Xlarge algae wafer everyday at night, although i put an extra 2-3 other algae wafers in due to all the loaches/plecos in the tank), they also thoroughly enjoy frozen bloodworms, artemecia, krill etc in their diet too.

As to the gallons of the tank an RTBS must be kept in, i would say that its the measurements of the tank that matter most- personally i wouldn't keep an RTBS in anything smaller than a 3ft long by 1ft wide and 1ft high tank.

 

[raptorrex]

it seems RTBS differ quite a bit. mine has been with both cory and gurami neither has had problems with the shark, and my tank is only 50ukg. he does seem to like a good game of "tig". but that's where things end.

@Tokis-Phoenix. were the problems, you had, with the cory and gurami, harassment, or were they attacked, directly? also, do you think the decoration and planting, of a tank, has any effect on the behaviour of the shark? the one, disaster, i have had with this fish. was after 12-18 months. stupidly, i tried to keep, a rainbow shark, and an RTBS together. all was fine for the period mentioned above. however, i rearranged the tank, within minutes the RTBS set about the Rainbow. it was dead before i could do anything about it!

to me the above story, highlights the problems of keeping, some fish. up to the point of the death, i could say, "Rainbow shark and RTBS, seem to live happily together. as i had seen no problems, nor were there any. (the speed with which the Rainbow was despatched, precludes it from having attacked before the "rearrangement"). so after 18 months, it seemed the "general advice", did not follow what i saw. that did not mean, as i then though, that the advice was wrong. what it did mean was, that i did not, then, have enough experience to make such deductions, for myself. its hard to take advice that, seems, to contradict you own experience. but people, here, (most) don't post advice, just to make you look bad, they do it to help. unfortunately, some offer advice, with no experience of the critter they are "advising" on. often with the best intentions.

 

[Tokis-Phoenix]

it seems RTBS differ quite a bit. mine has been with both cory and gurami neither has had problems with the shark, and my tank is only 50ukg. he does seem to like a good game of "tig". but that's where things end.

@Tokis-Phoenix. were the problems, you had, with the cory and gurami, harassment, or were they attacked, directly? also, do you think the decoration and planting, of a tank, has any effect on the behaviour of the shark? the one, disaster, i have had with this fish. was after 12-18 months. stupidly, i tried to keep, a rainbow shark, and an RTBS together. all was fine for the period mentioned above. however, i rearranged the tank, within minutes the RTBS set about the Rainbow. it was dead before i could do anything about it!

My RTBS only become aggressive during feeding times when it will try and chase other fish away from its algae wafers, the problem with the corys is that they weren't very fast or agile swimmers and would get chased a lot by the RTBS when they tried to feed- the RTBS is ok with the loaches though as they are very fast and agile swimmers and so the RTBS poses no threat to them whatsoever (they also always go for the fish flakes first before eating the algae wafers while the RTBS always goes for the algae wafers first before eating the fish flakes, so both fish always get the chance to eat their own food uninterrupted for a least a little while first).

The problem with the gourami (it was a large pearl gourami) is that it wasn't fast enough when it came to food time and simply couldn't compete with the RTBS's competitive & quick eating and didn't seem to enjoy the RTBS much as company (i think the RTBS was too boisterous and active for it, although the RTBS never attacked the gourami the gourami always used to try and stay as well away from the RTBS as possible whenever it could). I became quite concerned that it wasn't getting enough to eat so i moved it to my guppy tank which was a lot more relaxed (only had neon tetra's, different varieties of corys, guppys and a peaceful common plec) and soon after settling in it already started to behave a lot better; it became a much more confident fish, exploring the whole tank and even coming down to the bottom to pick at algae wafers with the corys (which was something it never did when it was being kept with the RTBS) .

I change the layout of the decor in the RTBS's tank usually about once a month but this doesn't seem to have much of an effect on the RTBS's nature (its very stuck in its ways, but thankfully its not a particularly aggressive/territorial RTBS). It does seem that these fish vary a great deal in nature- my RTBS only becomes aggressive at feeding times (but is not that territorial overall- it happy shares its caves with the pleco's and doesn't go for any of the shoaling fish in the tank) and is a very active fish in general and is able to get along with quite a few types of fish, but on the other hand i have known some other people's RTBS's to be absolute nightmares and will not tolerate almost any fish they're kept with. My RTBS is about 5years old now so i don't think it is going to change much in its nature- weirdly though it never grew that large (despite always being kept in a large tank and fed a good diet) and has seemed to have maxed out at about 5inches long.

 

[raptorrex]

it seems RTBS differ quite a bit. mine has been with both cory and gurami neither has had problems with the shark, and my tank is only 50ukg. he does seem to like a good game of "tig". but that's where things end.

@Tokis-Phoenix. were the problems, you had, with the cory and gurami, harassment, or were they attacked, directly? also, do you think the decoration and planting, of a tank, has any effect on the behaviour of the shark? the one, disaster, i have had with this fish. was after 12-18 months. stupidly, i tried to keep, a rainbow shark, and an RTBS together. all was fine for the period mentioned above. however, i rearranged the tank, within minutes the RTBS set about the Rainbow. it was dead before i could do anything about it!

My RTBS only become aggressive during feeding times when it will try and chase other fish away from its algae wafers, the problem with the corys is that they weren't very fast or agile swimmers and would get chased a lot by the RTBS when they tried to feed- the RTBS is ok with the loaches though as they are very fast and agile swimmers and so the RTBS poses no threat to them whatsoever (they also always go for the fish flakes first before eating the algae wafers while the RTBS always goes for the algae wafers first before eating the fish flakes, so both fish always get the chance to eat their own food uninterrupted for a least a little while first).

The problem with the gourami (it was a large pearl gourami) is that it wasn't fast enough when it came to food time and simply couldn't compete with the RTBS's competitive & quick eating and didn't seem to enjoy the RTBS much as company (i think the RTBS was too boisterous and active for it, although the RTBS never attacked the gourami the gourami always used to try and stay as well away from the RTBS as possible whenever it could). I became quite concerned that it wasn't getting enough to eat so i moved it to my guppy tank which was a lot more relaxed (only had neon tetra's, different varieties of corys, guppys and a peaceful common plec) and soon after settling in it already started to behave a lot better; it became a much more confident fish, exploring the whole tank and even coming down to the bottom to pick at algae wafers with the corys (which was something it never did when it was being kept with the RTBS) .

I change the layout of the decor in the RTBS's tank usually about once a month but this doesn't seem to have much of an effect on the RTBS's nature (its very stuck in its ways, but thankfully its not a particularly aggressive/territorial RTBS). It does seem that these fish vary a great deal in nature- my RTBS only becomes aggressive at feeding times (but is not that territorial overall- it happy shares its caves with the pleco's and doesn't go for any of the shoaling fish in the tank) and is a very active fish in general and is able to get along with quite a few types of fish, but on the other hand i have known some other people's RTBS's to be absolute nightmares and will not tolerate almost any fish they're kept with. My RTBS is about 5years old now so i don't think it is going to change much in its nature- weirdly though it never grew that large (despite always being kept in a large tank and fed a good diet) and has seemed to have maxed out at about 5inches long.

mine, though just short of 4 years old, is just 5 inches. like you, i don't see it growing any more. but, is 5-6 inches not the biggest they get? i have had people say they reach 10-12 inches. but, when you find someone who actually has one, they never report more than 6 inches.
i must have a, "well chilled" RTBS. he chases the synos, and they return the compliment, (but never any contact). he totally ignores the gurami, and cory. feeding time is when he is most active, but he still waits his turn (lol, if there is a line).

i think i know my mistake, regarding the Rainbow RTBS problem. I removed some caves and hiding places (best intentions, the tank did look a lot better afterwards). pluse he has never reacted like that again. whilst i rearrange, less often than you, i still do it several times a year.

 

[Tokis-Phoenix]

Yes i agree, i don't know where are these large size estimates of RTBS come from (i've been hearing people saying stuff like this for years)- personally i have never seen an RTBS larger than 5inches and have never heard of anyone actually owning one larger than 6inches. I think there is a lot of misinformation on these fishes sizes, maybe people are getting RTBS confused with some other similar looking type of shark species like Black Sharks/Labeo chrysophekadion or something like that?