Plumbing A Cannister Into A Drilled Aquarium

[ainsy]

You stick to your case & I will stick to mine.

The OP doesn't have your expertise either so I was pointing out a possibility for those less experienced

 

[daz4321]

I agree there is a possibilty the bulkhead might leak so should we then fit a weir around the inlets too incase their bulkheads leak?
What about the pipes/lines what if they should split ?There is a possibilty the aquarium might leak however should we advise not to have an aquarium? there will always be a possibilty of a leak that i cannot argue with but anything could spring a leak we cannot cover all bases with weirs or such like or by saying because it might leak don't do it or its not a good idea.

As the OP said the only difference between a normal external set up and this is the bulkheads and fitted correctly the chance of a leak is minimal.

what i was originally saying was you were incorrect in the statement of the pump overfilling the tank which was the main point of why you didn't recommend doing this in the first place.

either way the OP can take the choice. I have done it, do not have a wet carpet and the tank looks alot better imo as there is little to no pipework to seen in the tank. Maintenence is easier as there is no need to prime the filter just open the taps and let it fill.

 

[ainsy]

ok

 

[Egmel]

Wow, sorry I was away for so long, work called, seems you've been having a productive discussion without me.

I actually agree with both of you in parts and value what you both have to say.

Ainsy, I'm afraid he's right about the closed system bit, water is non-compressible using the pressures we're talking about here, if the inlet blocks then the pump will fail to shift any water after a couple of seconds as the pressure will be greater than the torque it can provide.

I'm also aware of how important it is to do the bulkheads correctly - This was my main concern about the whole set up but given the number of marine tanks you see with bulkheads we decided it was worth a go. Especially as this is a fresh tank so there's no hurry to get livestock in it, we can fill it and empty it as often as we need to get the seals correct.

Daz, you seem to have some experience in these matters. Do you recommend threaded fittings or slip fittings? If you use slip fittings how do you connect things to them to ensure they're leak free? I'm quite a capable DIY'er but I've always found that it's better to be well prepared before approaching any job if you want it to work well.

Cheers
Helen

 

[TwoTankAmin]

I am about to do my first sump for a 6 ft. tank. I do not plan to drill the tank. Imo the biggest risk is in not drilling the tank properly and cracking the glass. I see two potential problems with your proposed system. The first is that hoses on canisters have a nasty habit of detaching over time. This can be avoided by adding hose clamps wherever hose attach via being slid over barbed nipples. The second is that you seem to have separated the mechanical filtration from the bio and any needed chemical filtration by splitting your filter intakes via the T. You need to be sure you do not restrict the flow potential- that is, having too little flow on the intake side of the things. Flow restriction should always be done on the output/return side of things. Also be careful you don't allow the bio-media in the Eheim to clog becuase you do not use adequate mech. filtration in it.

In the states I can find all the fittings from many hardware stores and for sure from plumbing supply places. Some Eheims have built in ball valves on the intakes which close automatically when you remove the filter. If not, over engineer these into your system. Be able to shut flow almost anywhere so you can isolate any part of your system for cleaning or repair. The Magnum's micron cartridge will need to be cleaned every 1-2 weeks. I suggest you have at least 2 spares. Since cleaning them is done in a strong bleach solution, a cleaned one needs to dry out 100% before being reused.

Despite the fact you will use filters instead of a sump, you can steal some good ideas and info from sump designs, so Google them and see if you come up with any good adaptations you can apply to your system.

Finally, sw is pretty corrosive, fw is not. So the concerns of a sw keeper in this respect vs a fw keeper are different.

 

[Craig89]

As long as the tank is drilled properly (by a glass merchant) and the fittings are secure and tight you will have no problems. It's like any plumbing weather it's a tank or around the home if done correctly you minimise the risk of leaks.

 

[daz4321]

Daz, you seem to have some experience in these matters. Do you recommend threaded fittings or slip fittings? If you use slip fittings how do you connect things to them to ensure they're leak free? I'm quite a capable DIY'er but I've always found that it's better to be well prepared before approaching any job if you want it to work well.

Cheers
Helen

I always use slip fittings but their major let down is once solvent weld is applied thats it if it is wrong its wrong at least with threaded you do have multiple attempts at correcting any issue.

tips and tricks to solvent weld/slip fittings
1 Always dry fit first to make sure it is right
2 dont be shy using the solvent weld/apply to pipe and socket/fitting
3 always give the pipes a quarter turn when seating them into the fittings

never had one leak yet ( now that is pushing my luck )

 

[Egmel]

Imo the biggest risk is in not drilling the tank properly and cracking the glass.

Agreed, we're getting the tank builders to drill it for us.

I see two potential problems with your proposed system. The first is that hoses on canisters have a nasty habit of detaching over time. This can be avoided by adding hose clamps wherever hose attach via being slid over barbed nipples.

That's a useful tip, I'd been wondering what was the best way to connect them and that seems to make sense.

The second is that you seem to have separated the mechanical filtration from the bio and any needed chemical filtration by splitting your filter intakes via the T. You need to be sure you do not restrict the flow potential- that is, having too little flow on the intake side of the things. Flow restriction should always be done on the output/return side of things. Also be careful you don't allow the bio-media in the Eheim to clog becuase you do not use adequate mech. filtration in it.

Ah, yes sorry, I borrowed the picture from elsewhere, the 2 ehiems will be running with their usual complement of mechanical and biological filtration. I've got the plus version running on my tank at the moment and am always impressed at how it never seems to loose flow. They come with shut-offs on the pipelines but I think you're right to suggest adding extras where possible.

Despite the fact you will use filters instead of a sump, you can steal some good ideas and info from sump designs, so Google them and see if you come up with any good adaptations you can apply to your system.

Also a useful thought, I'll have a look and see what we can find. The idea of a set of small weirs so that should the worst happen the fish still have water is beginning to look like a good idea. One hates to imagine it will ever happen but it's the main difference between the siphon effect and the drilled, a siphon stops when the water gets to the top of the filter inlet, a drilled tank will stop when it gets to the bottom.

Finally, sw is pretty corrosive, fw is not. So the concerns of a sw keeper in this respect vs a fw keeper are different.

Ok, but I suppose there's no harm in engineering for SW safety in a FW tank. We shall see where this will add extra complications/cost and make decisions on a call by call basis.

Many thanks for all your help.

I always use slip fittings but their major let down is once solvent weld is applied thats it if it is wrong its wrong at least with threaded you do have multiple attempts at correcting any issue.

tips and tricks to solvent weld/slip fittings
1 Always dry fit first to make sure it is right
2 dont be shy using the solvent weld/apply to pipe and socket/fitting
3 always give the pipes a quarter turn when seating them into the fittings

never had one leak yet ( now that is pushing my luck )

Fabulous, I might get some for a trial run before we get to the tank proper to make sure we've got the hang of it

Cheers
Helen

 

[halleluja]

There is no possibility of water on the floor because it is a closed loop. It quite simple.
 
The same volume of water that is drained out, is the same volume of water that is replaced. Even if there was extra water from a canister this is not enough to flood it.
 
If the pump stops, breaks or canister gets blocked then the cyle of water will just stop.
 
The maximum water level recommended is 2 inches from the top of the aquarium. This gives room for excess water.
 
The only problem i can forsee, if a canister used wasn't watertight/airtight. The incoming water could overflow the canister if the pump broke.
 
Regards.

 

[tricken]

thanks for all the great info about to do a sealed loop on my new tank that is drilled. 

 

[alvaro1983]

Ok, about to give this a try. We'll post updates on how it goes. Thanks to everyone for all the very valuable suggestions.

 

[dgwebster]

I feel I should also point out that in at least every canister I have seen, the impeller and pump is housed at the top of the canister. If it was somehow creating a vacuum in the intake or getting air into the canister, it will only pump until air reaches the impeller: it will not empty the canister once the water level drops below the impeller!

As for the fitting, if you are in the UK I recommend just hitting the BSP 3/4" standard and using BSP to 22/16/12 adapters. I use these to create a T junction hosepipe connection for doing water changes, work a treat. For your outflow/intake in the tank, feel free to use plumbing of your own design, meaning you can stick with your standard used at the bulkhead.