New Tank Syndrome

[pdclawncare]

Hello,

Im a beginner just starting out with my first tank. I read several books before I made my purchase, and ended up buying a 55 gallon tank. I have a Penguin 70 gallon filter, as well as a whisper 60 filter hooked up with a 250 watt heater. Unfortunatley, I did not read up on fishless cycling, and the book i read recommended some hardy fish to cycle my tank with. So I went to my local fish store and purchased 3 dwarf guramis, and one red tail shark. The tank has been running for about one month now, and the only reading i get is ammonia between 1 and four ppms. I have used bacterial supplements, as well as tetra safe start to jump start the cycling, but have had no luck. I never get a reading on nitrites or nitrates. I do a 10 percent water change every day, as well as using ammo lock on a consistant basis. The fish are very active, the water is clear, and I have no idea what to do to help the situation along. Any advice would be greatly appreciated. Thank you in advance.

 

[Mo1959]

Hi,
When I tried a fishless cycle it took just over a month before I saw any reduction in ammonia. Not sure if a fish in cycle would be around the same. The bottled bacteria is not generally considered to work very well and you will find most people on here advise a fishless cycle using bottled ammonia. Since you are already in a position of having fish in your tank you are what is called a fish in cycle so it is now up to you to ensure that the ammonia and nitrite levels in your tank are at safe levels for your fish whilst it is cycling. At the moment your ammonia is far too high and will be causing your fish discomfort. Ideally you want to ensure levels of ammonia or nitrite are never above .25ppm and ideally even a bit lower, ie virtually undetectable on your testing kit.

I would suggest a massive water change immediately, taking as much of your water out and only leaving an inch or so in the bottom to cover your fish then refilling with temperature matched, dechlorinated water. After this you may get away with changing around 10% per day but you will still need to keep an eye on the test readings and do a bigger change if required.

I am currently doing a fish in cycle myself and it is hard work but it is worth it knowing that all your water changes are keeping your fish safe.

Just as an aside, it may be worth checking your ph levels as the cycle can get slowed or stalled if it is too low.

 

[pdclawncare]

The advice is greatly appreciated, I will do a massive water change tomorrow morning, will post updated readings as well. Thank you

Any other advice out there would be greatly appreciated, as I want my fish to stay healthy and happy

 

[Miss Wiggle]

stop using ammo-lock and the bacterial supplements, the ammo lock converts ammonia to ammonium and this can mess up your test readings.

you should be doing bigger water changes than that as well, have a look at the link in my signature 'what's cycling' which will talk you through what you should be doing.

 

[waterdrop]

Yes, totally agree with Mo and MW. (Excellent write-up there Mo!) I'll just add to what they've said about the water changing. Hopefully this will all be old news. Water changing is done with a device called a gravel cleaning siphon (or sometimes just a plain siphon tube for sand) which has a clear plastic cylinder on one end that's larger. You can fill this tube with tank water and lift it above the tank and get the water to start moving through the siphon, then put it back under water to keep it going. Watching out for your fish etc. you plunge it deep in the gravel and hold it there so that the water movement churns up debris and carries it out with the outgoing water. Gravel cleaning is very important even in a new visually clean tank because the nitrates may be hanging down close to the gravel due to molecular charges, so always do gravel cleaning as the water removal part of water changes.

The return water needs to be treated with a good water conditioner. This is a product that removes chlorine/chloramines and in most cases also neutralizes ammonia and nitrite for about 24 hours but leaves it in a form that can be used by the bacteria. The best product we know for this is Seachem Prime, partly because it is so concentrated that it ends up being cheap to use. I recommend that beginners dose conditioner at 1.5x to 2x (but not more than 2x) the amount recommended on the bottle instructions. This is because you never know exactly when a water authority may "shock" their water with extra chlorine/chloramine to treat excess bacterial results from their pipe tests around town. The 1.5x to 2x is mostly extra insurance for people cycling because they have immature bacterial colonies in their filters and thus need more protection. This changes after the filter is mature.

The return water also needs to be roughly temperature matched. This is because, during fish-in cycling or any time you change larger amounts, the overall change effect will be larger, especially in smaller tanks where the change takes place even more quickly. Your hand is quite good enough for temperature matching if a little care is taken in the process.

Most beginners continue to stubbornly err to the side of water changes that are too small, thinking that somehow the shock of the water change is quite serious. In truth, its the stress of the poisons, ammonia and nitrite(NO2), that are much, much more serious and its much better to err on the side of massive water changes than ones that are too little. Some people also worry that their new bacteria they are trying to grow in the filter will not have enough ammonia to eat. This is also false as the respiration of the fish (yes, fish give off ammonia from the gills) and other fish waste, excess fishfood and plant debris will cause plenty of ammonia to be flowing, regardless of our water changes (well, unless they were extremely extreme, lol.) There can be enough ammonia to stimulate bacterial colony growth without our tests detecting it.

The goal is figuring out the percentage and frequency of water changes to keep you in that narrow band that MW and Mo described, between zero ppm and 0.25ppm (ammonia or nitrite, either one) during the weeks of Fish-In cycling. Later on, when you go for 2 days not needing to change water because the zero levels are holding, you will be ready for your qualifying week where you just watch it continue that for a week. Then you're cycled!

~~waterdrop~~

 

[pdclawncare]

Did a 90 percent water change, treated tap water with aqua safe by tetra. After 15 minutes added tetra safe start. Rechecked levels and no change whatsoever. Any more advice? Should I do another 90 percent change tomorrow? Help!!

 

[Miss Wiggle]

can you give us the latest numerical readings for pH, ammonia, nitrite and nitrate?

 

[pdclawncare]

3 ppm ammonia 0 nitrite and nitrate 7.8 ph

 

[Miss Wiggle]

what sort of test kit are you using? is it liquid based or paper test strips?

 

[Curiosity101]

Regardless of test kit the OP definitely needs to do another 90% change.

 

[JoshuaA]

Test some water straight from your tap. For it to be 3ppm after a 90% change is just pure odd.

 

[Miss Wiggle]

Test some water straight from your tap. For it to be 3ppm after a 90% change is just pure odd.

My thoughts exactly, wondering if it's perhaps a dodgy/inaccurate test kit.

if it's a true reading then yes definately another change but if it's at 3ppm after a 90% change then it must have been a lot higher before, i find it hard to believe anything would be alive at those levels so not sure if the reading is true or not.

 

[pdclawncare]

The test kit is an api liquid master test kit. Tap water reads no ammonia levels. Doing another large water change in 15 minutes. Fish are very active, have had no issues with fish dying

 

[pdclawncare]

The test kit is an api liquid master test kit. Tap water reads no ammonia levels. Doing another large water change in 15 minutes. Fish are very active, have had no issues with fish dying. Will post new results after water change

 

[pdclawncare]

The test kit is an api liquid master test kit. Tap water reads no ammonia levels. Doing another large water change in 15 minutes. Fish are very active, have had no issues with fish dying. Will post new results after water change