New Member with two dead Apistos and a confusing tank situation

[Speak No Evil]

Firstly, hello and thanks in advance to anybody who has some input for me.

I've not used fish forums before but don't have many people with knowledge to discuss with in person and Facebook groups only go so far.

So I have an established 5g with Phoenix Rasbora (Boraras Merah), I have dabbled with a couple of species but had some problems in my last property due to very high tropical temperatures here in Cambodia. I have since moved house and have a home office for which i purchased a nice industrial rack for more tanks. I just got a new 20g then came across a second hand one so obviously was looking to get them set up.

My water is Alkaline and hard, it's over ph 8., I've not tested TDS but it will leave a nice white crust when it evaporates. To make the water a bit more bearable for my 'Rasbora' I have been mixing a good portion of RO water to my tap water. The RO water is readily available here as drinking water in 20L jugs.

Fast forward a bit to now and I went through the following process which has backfired. My LFS got some nice Apistos in, I decided to set up one tank for them. I have two sponge filters in my 5g for this purpose, to take one and use it in a new tank and 'instant cycle' it. I simply used rinsed sand, boiled some wood and almond leaves and added water that i mixed and dechlorinated what tap water there was mixed with the RO.

So here I was thinking it's cycled and it's only two fish in 20 gallons, tested the usual parameters and it seems 'fine'. However I did noticed the PH looked like it dropped a bit more. Thinking this was fine I purchased the fish and 24 hours later both are dead. The female was dead in the morning. The male seemed OK today, shy but swimming close to the wood and using the one ceramic cave. Then over the course of the evening his swimming became unbalanced., bumping in to things, then stopped swimming and was clearly deteriorating very fast.

I tested PH again as there's nothing that could change the other parameters and it seems to be a bit higher. It looked to go from about 7 to 7.6.

Ammonia 0 ppm
Nitrite 0ppm
Nitrate 5ppm or less
pH 7.6
Temperature, I’m in the tropics so AC set to 27celcius (cooler than where I purchased)

So what are your thoughts?

What would kill them so quickly? Was it the PH swing, if so what would cause that?

Cheers!

 

[Colin_T]

For both fish to die within 24 hours of being added to a tank would suggest poisoning from something in the water. It's possible pH and GH were the cause but it could have bene the sand, wood or leaves, or some residue on the inside of the tank that leeched into the water when you set it up.

You need to ask the shop what the pH and GH are in their tank, then compare it to your water.

 

[Speak No Evil]

Thank you.

Discussing it with him, he said his PH is 6.5, presumably GH is much lower but need to confirm.

 

[Colin_T]

A sudden change in pH of 6.5 to 7.6 might have done it, but it could also be something else.

I would do a complete water change and refill the tank with dechlorinated water. Wait a couple of days and then add a couple of cheap fish. If they are ok for a couple of weeks, then try some more Apistogrammas.

Check with the shop and see how long the Apistogrammas had been in their tanks for. If the fish had only been in their tanks for a couple of days that would also have contributed to their death. Try not to buy fish unless they have been in the shop tanks for at least 1 week. And don't buy fish if the shop has done a water change in the last 2 days.

 

[dmpfishlover]

I am so sorry that this has happened to you. I don't have any insight or advice to offer that Colin has not already brought up. You are in good hands with Colin's advice. So, I just want to Welcome you to the Forum!

 

[Speak No Evil]

I am so sorry that this has happened to you. I don't have any insight or advice to offer that Colin has not already brought up. You are in good hands with Colin's advice. So, I just want to Welcome you to the Forum!

Cheers!

 

[Speak No Evil]

A sudden change in pH of 6.5 to 7.6 might have done it, but it could also be something else.

I would do a complete water change and refill the tank with dechlorinated water. Wait a couple of days and then add a couple of cheap fish. If they are ok for a couple of weeks, then try some more Apistogrammas.

Check with the shop and see how long the Apistogrammas had been in their tanks for. If the fish had only been in their tanks for a couple of days that would also have contributed to their death. Try not to buy fish unless they have been in the shop tanks for at least 1 week. And don't buy fish if the shop has done a water change in the last 2 days.

The Apistos were relatively new to his shop, maybe a little over a week but were shipped overseas to get him. I'll take you advice, thanks again.

Without wanting to drag the topic too far off, what do you think about my method for preparing the water?

I have RO water that I buy as drinking water, it's readily available here. Rather than using my hard alkaline water only I'm trying around half to two thirds of it as the RO and the rest dechlorinated tap water.

 

[Colin_T]

Is the drinking water actually reverse osmosis (R/O) water, or is it something else like filtered or spring water?
If the water is genuine R/O, then is it fine to use at 1/2 to 2/3 strength, depending on how hard your tap water is.

Any idea what the GH, KH and pH of your tap water is?

You want the GH below 150ppm for Apistogramma cichlids.

 

[Speak No Evil]

It is RO yes, it's standard practice here to sell it as drinking water.

No idea on GH / KH I need to get tests for this.

Thanks again for the information, much appreciated.

 

[JuiceBox52]

It is RO yes, it's standard practice here to sell it as drinking water.

No idea on GH / KH I need to get tests for this.

Thanks again for the information, much appreciated.

Look on your local water providers website before buying tests, you may be able to find what you need and not have to spend the money on something you only need to use once or twice