New Aquarium (Fish-In Cycling...), Couple Qs

[Doc7]

I like pygmy cories now that I just google image searched them. I will have to look into those.

I lowered my heater setting but still am hitting about 78-79 degrees, I will continue to lower this once a day until I get to the mid-70s instead of 80 where I was before. It's the Neptune 100W heater that came with the tank.

I just purchased the AquaClear 30 to replace the TopFin filter. This has the sponge, activated carbon, and "BioMax" (which is just more surface area material I supposed) all of which are replaced individually, which I presume means that I can keep my biological filter running at all times. The filter (a Hagen product) has very good reviews.

Is the size 30 (150 GPH) too large/fast for a 20 gallon tropical community tank or good to set it up? Other people throughout Google report using it on 20s but I guess I've kind of settled on FishForums.Net as my preferred "Experts"... thanks for your help so far!

 

[BigJim]

Thanks! She is actually acting fine today so maybe she was just not adapting well to the new environment. My ammonia is below 0.25 ppm and I realize that it should be 0 once the cycle is complete. I hope I can pull this off without losing any of the fish. I read in a couple places that the zebras and leopards would school together since they are so closely related and they appear to be doing so for now. I was hoping to have 5 danios, 5 tetras (not sure which variety yet) and either a swordtail or platy. With a 20 gallon tank that will put me at my fish limit.

Someone more experienced might correct me but as far as I remember, both swordtails and platys grow quite big so need fairly large tanks.
If you're looking for something to add, how about 5 pygmy corydoras? Or maybe a centre piece fish like a honey gourami or dwarf gourami?
Also, the danios and tetras might be happier in bigger groups (i.e. 8+)

Thanks Frida! I never realized there were pygmy corys but I think they would be a great addition. I actually looked at the dwarf gourami and they were on my short list too. Hopefully I can find someone who sells the pygmy corydora because I don't think I've seen them at any of the local stores I have visited.

 

[Doc7]

The AquaClear 30 does seem to be operating well (and QUIET!) and doesn't seem like excessive flow for the yank to me. Fish live in currents anyway, right?

Did a side-by-side ammonia test with tap water and tank water today and ammonia was actually higher than I've seen it yet at 0.25 (no nitrites), so I did a larger (25%) change-out than the every other day 10% I've been doing. In the process of the larger change I also was able to give a really thorough gravel cleaning. Installed the filter at the right time because now if ammonia is starting to accumulate I have the proper long-term filtration set in place so I won't be risking future re-cycling of the tank.



Post cycling: in a 20 gallon tank, accounting for space taken up by gravel, would my load pretty much complete with 6 zebra danio and 6 pygmy cories if I go that route? Or would I have room to do, say, 5 (or do i need 6?) zebra danio, another small schooling fish of 5-6 and 4-5 pygmy cories? I really would like some color in the tank beyond the stripes I have with the zebra. I could substitute the "other small schooling fish" for a small-sized loner fish as well...mid-posting, I googled "Dwarf gourami" and that's a great looking fish that I could see in this position.

edit: scarlet badis (Dario dario) are pretty cool looking too...so many choices! i found a ew non-PetSmart LFS that are within driving range from work/home so I will check them out over the next few weeks of cycling and see what I want to do.

 

[hillmar77]

You have room for another small group of fishes.

 

[waterdrop]

Yes, the AC30 with 150gph should put you up over 7x turnover and many planted tank enthusiasts go way up over 10x turnover, whereas many nice low-flow quiet tanks work just fine down at 4x turnover. So you are right within the kinds of ranges of flow we usually see and out of the worry zone (sometimes we see beginners hoping to filter their tank with less than 3 or 4x turnover and it could just be a filter that's simply not enough.) As far as too much flow, this is one of those areas that varies greatly by types of fish, by number of "rest areas" the fish have due to decorations or plants helping to create different spots in the tank, that sort of thing. Its endlessly debated and not an area where one would find it easy to just say you had too much. So I think you're fine. You just have to watch it and get experience with it. A good thing about a 20g long rectangular tank is that the higher flow filter output area would probably happen in one area and somewhere on down the tank the fish could find a quieter area if desired. OM47 and I used to discuss at times that fish need exercise, just like any other animal, so its nice for them to have some higher flow areas sometimes!

~~waterdrop~~

 

[OldMan47]

As I see it, you are doing fine Doc. If you have excessive flow you will know it. I had excessive flow on this tank when I first set it up and experienced a bare bottom in places in the tank while creating sand dunes in other parts of the tank as you can see in this picture.

Once I had a different, properly sized filter the tank became this in less than 24 hours.

Your light stocking is very appropriate for a fish in cycle. When you are doing a fish-in cycle, your focus needs to be the health of the fish in the system. the cycle will take care of itself. This is where WD's advice about maximum chemical contaminant levels becomes very important. If you can stay within those limits he has given, your fish should do fine and emerge from the cycle in good health, something many of us did not experience even a very short time back before we understood what was going on in a new tank.

 

[Doc7]

Thanks. I actually did water changes the last two days in a row to keep the ammonia down, today it is fine and tomorrow is a planned 10-20% change depending on the ammonia. 0 ppm nitrites still, today is Day 9 with fish in the water. Of course I switched filters 3 days ago to my "permanent" solution for this tank so I probably reset the majority of my cycle at that point.

I spent a good 30 minutes at PetSmart today (still haven't made the trip to the more localized places yet) looking at the fish and found some good ideas for a "Centerpiece" fish. Also, Ghost Catfish are either really awesome looking or creepy!

Definitely found some Oscars and Cichlids I'll be interested in if I ever move out of this apartment and get a chance to set up a very large tank but to focus on my tank again...

Are there benefits besides increasing activity in the hobby to live plants? If a fish requires "heavy plants" are plastic OK for this as well? Assuming I can give the fish a proper diet and water temp, will they notice that the plants are plastic? I just am wondering if I need to start researching live plants etc for my 20 gal tank or not.

There were plenty of cool platies and mollies that I saw, which I think are on the "bigger" end of what would be appropriate for a 20 gal. With a school of danios already started in the tank I don't see how I could really support the kind of idea I really liked which would be a mix of those species between colors that are crimson red, black, orange, etc but I might be able to fit one of those fish in, along with dwarf otos, if I can find a species that can be by itself or in a pair maybe and also be compatible. Again I haven't researched compatibility and requirements yet (I've got several weeks to go with the cycle before it becomes a pressing concern), but that would also be a nice mix of cats, schooling fish, and a slightly bigger type fish.

It's like I read somewhere, probably the hardest temptation will be to avoid trying to get everything in one tank. I'm glad that from the very get-go I know that I don't want to go beyond my tank capacity in order to keep the fish I do have happy, otherwise I probably would be getting myself into some dire straits!

 

[OldMan47]

I find that plants lend a nice look to a tank as long as you can keep them alive. Plants are a whole different dimension to the hobby that needs to be mastered much as fish care needs to be mastered. Often people will get plastic or silk plants at first until they get comfortable with fish care. Then they will start to branch out into plant care. Real plants have many minor benefits in a tank but are really not needed for a tank to prosper. My big community tank cannot have any real plants in it because I have fish in that tank that will literally consume a whole plant in a week or less. I placed a few java ferns in the tank at one point in time and rescued the plant stems and roots a week later. Once the plants went into another tank, they quickly recovered and are still growing completely out of control.

 

[UNV_Rasta]

So what a couple of you guys are saying is that there is no need to replace the carbon filter cartridge?? Ever?? I just turned off my Tetra filter in my 25g tank with 2 cichlids because the strip went all red signalling time for a change, and I'm noticing algae for the 1st time. I'm such a noob to this its not even funny

 

[Doc7]

I'm still measuring 0 nitrites and nitrates so my tank isn't really cycling yet : /

 

[Doc7]

I'm still measuring 0 nitrites and nitrates so my tank isn't really cycling yet : /

Still nothing nitrite-wise. Almost at 3 weeks now : / I am dechlorinating my water with nearly double the recommended amount of AquaSafe.

 

[Doc7]

What type of cories are appropriate for a gravelly bottom? I don't want this tank to be any fish I dang feel like without any regard for the well-being of the fish, but I already set it up with gravel. I don't want to be guilt-ridden that I am doing something to make my fish unhappy.

Any thoughts on the following combo, IF the subtrate is ok? I can add fake plants/scenery required for the species of you think I need it given the pic of my tank earlier in this thread. (Post #1) Just want happy fish.

7 zebra danios (14")
1 dwarf gourami (2")
6 pygmy cories (4")


I see a downfall of using fish to cycle as well, I am kind of locked in to the zebras now. Not that I don't love them but I have to keep in mind their behavior when considering any new fish obviously.

 

[Doc7]

if you think a gourami isn't going to get along perfect with the danios and the cories aren't good for the substrate PLEASE suggest something else; i can always make another tank with the fish i have specifically in mind in the future and don't need to get everything at once in my first 20 gallon tank!!

 

[waterdrop]

No cory will appreciate a gravel bottom if the gravel is sharp edged. That's what it depends on. You can go up creek beds and find gravel that has been smoothed over the decades and even though it is mixed sized grains, some larger, it will be smooth enough for cories. You can kind of judge smoothness with your fingers.

Your stocking choices seem very good to me though, otherwise. I'm quite familiar with danios and dwarves and very much like both. It is true that both will be trying to occupy the space at the surface of the tank a lot of the time and I would be interested to hear whether our 20g tall shape seems to have enough surface area for the dwarf to remain happy with the danios zipping about. (Gouramis like to have a little surface "territory" with ideally some floating plants with roots hanging down where they can play at building bubble nests. With only one male I don't know whether you'd see that activity but you might as they really like doing that when they're feeling good.

Keep trying to slowly tweak that temp down as your cycling danios will really like it cooler. And there should be no doubt that your first stocking when the cycle is over should be a next batch of 3 or 4 danios to join them. Your AC filter sounds really good. They are much more flexible to use over time.

~~waterdrop~~

 

[Doc7]

edit: after posting below now I am worried about fish poop/detritus showing up when people are peering into my little aquatic world....i dunno, i wish there was a dark sand that was good for cories, not sharp, and didn't make fish colors go dull etc....


The gravel isn't really sharp, but the more I read the more I keep thinking about sand, and I can't help but worry if I'm going to be constantly debating in my head "should i switch?"...but if I switch to sand successfully I don't see a reason I would be debating towards going the other direction.

In other words I think I'm going to switch to sand. Is it ok to do this now, mid-"cycle"? (i'm assuming that at SOME POINT i'm going to get evidence of a-bacs...) ... the sand will guarantee whatever cories I end up with are happier. Future tanks I will be able to think about all this stuff ahead of time (proper substrate for intended plants/fish etc). I work near a huge fish store in Clifton New Jersey (called "absolutely fish") which I imagine will have a big selection of sandy substrates. I am thinking darker color. I might pick up some different fake plants - at this point in my fishkeeping career I don't want to get too involved with lighting/plants/CO2/fertilizer so sand and fake plants will have to be good enough for the fish.

I am going to scoop out all of the rocks and replace with cleaned sand, filter will have to get turned off until the sand settles down, I might reset my cycle but that's another reason to do this now, not later...

Also I am going to swap out the carbon media bag in the AC30 for another bag of the bio-max inserts.


My pH is still pretty high, ~8.1ish ... I'm going to wait till cycle is complete but I might want to consider this when looking at stocking options, no?