New Aquarist Needing Advice!

[Mamashack]

I believe the Marina manufacturers - Hagen - advise changing 1-2 of the cartridges every 2-4 weeks which would work out quite expensive and not particularly good for any friendly bacteria that might have developed as you would be throwing some if not most of their habitat away. As fluttermoth suggested, replacing the cartridges with foam might be the best way forward even if it means starting again. Foam only needs to be thoroughly rinsed in the removed old tank water when doing a water change once the tank is established and doesn't need replacing until it is literally falling apart.
I know it is disheartening but as you are only in the early stages, it will be well worth it in the long run.

 

[JayP]

I'm honestly so upset about this. I've wasted three weeks cycling a tank and it'll be almost worthless plus I've now got a filter that'll cost me a small fortune to run.

What do I do now? Stick with this filter? Change a cartridge every couple of week? Introduce fish as the tank is 'safe'? Get a new filter? Start again?

I got an aquarium to get into fish keeping but if I'm honest, I'm totally fed up with it already. Really unhappy. Conned into using a filter that'll cost a fortune.

 

[fluttermoth]

You don't want to carry on with those cartridges.
 
I know it's disheartening, but the problem is they're working in a way that isn't healthy or productive to your tank's health, long term. The chemicals in the cartridge you have at the moment are stripping the ammonia from the water. Imagine that a chemical media works by having millions of little hands that grab molecules of ammonia out of the water as they pass and hang on to them. Once all the 'hands' are full, all that ammonia will pass over the filter, back into your tank and kill your fish. There will be no way of knowing when all the hands are full, so you'll have to keep on buying cartridges.
 
In a biological filter, instead of hands, you have mouths that eat the ammonia and spit out nitrite; they're never full, so your filter will work for ever.
 
All you need to do is take the cartridges out of your filter and replace them with plain filter sponges; no carbon, no zeolite, just plain sponge. They will not need replacing (well, maybe after five or ten years).
 
Then you have to dose your 1.5/2mls of ammonia, until it reads 2 or 3ppm on your ammonia test, and start again from there.
 
I'm sorry no-one thought of this possibility ages ago; well done to goldfinger for thinking of it!

 

[JayP]

Ok thanks for explaining that so early! I've had time to 'calm down' slightly and have thought of a few possibilities.

Keep the filter, test the water frequently, buy the cartridges, introduce fish.

Keep the filter, introduce a piece of sponge bit by bit as the bacteria should be there after three weeks.

Get a new filter? Start again?

Get a new filter and run in conjunction with this filter?

I think after three long, boring weeks I really want to add fish. The filter I have is obviously fit for purpose and has its benefits. It would cost roughly £1 a month to run which isn't much at all. I think I'm going to stick with it, replace the filters regularly, clean them out regularly and introduce fish.

Thanks for everyone's help and advice however I feel it's time to do what I feel would work. I can't sit and stare at an empty tank for another 4-6 weeks folks, I'm sorry. Ill let you know how it goes.

Regards

Jason

 

[Mamashack]

If we had known what filter it was from the start we may have given the advice sooner, but I believe you only mentioned which one and which cartridges you have yesterday.
If you are adamant about going the fish-in route please please read the beginners resource centre advice on fish-in cycling however almost all members would advise you to reconsider and start fishless cycling again by adding the foam all at once. I doubt many bacteria will have developed if the ammonia has been grabbed by the cartridges. Patience really is a virtue in fish-keeping and the health and longevity of your future fish are at stake if you decide to add fish now.
However at the end of the day the decision is yours and I am sure we will still support you through all the problems of multiple water changes a day for several more weeks than going the fishless route.
Good luck, Jason!

 

[JayP]

Mamashack, this is what I'm confused about now though! If the filter I have effectively grabs the ammonia, odours etc from the water there would be no need to cycle the tank? Jus change the filter? Is this not the whole point of this filter? I really need to talk to someone about this, I'm losing the will to live going to pop into my lfs later to discuss.

 

[JayP]

Came across this! Answers my questions perfectly, I'll do the same. Add two new ammo lock cartridges today, put in a new piece of foam, run the tank for a few weeks and hopefully that'll allow me to keep the filter, lose the expensive cartridges, build up the bacteria and use the sponge! Thoughts? http/www.fishforums.net/index.php?/topic/367090-marina-s15-filter-sponge-question/

 

[Mamashack]

That sounds ok at first glance altho the thread you linked to was about an established tank I believe and therefore they were trying to give the established bacterial colony time to migrate from those cartridges to the foam sponge. Your cartridges haven't had time to develop an adequate bacterial colony yet. Ammo-lock cartridges will lock away the food for any bacteria in your tank i.e the ammonia and effectively starve them so they cannot develop in sufficient numbers to make the tank safe for future fish. The way the ammo-lock cartridges work is as discussed before and therefore need replacing every 2 weeks or so to be effective as fluttermoth described.
I think the best way is to replace with the foam medium, but it is up to you to pick one way or the other. Either stick with ammo-lock and be changing cartridges religiously every 2 weeks ad infinitum or go the foam route and allow a decent colony of bacteria to develop over a few weeks before adding fish and then you're set for several years until the foam needs replacing (when it is disintegrating and not before).
All the best with whatever you decide!

 

[JayP]

Well I've done what the post said, I've added a new ammo lock pad, added a piece of sponge going all the way down the back so hopefully the sponge will over time grow the bacteria and allow me to lose the expensive pads. Keep you updated

 

[the_lock_man]

Yeah the only thing keeping me going is this forum just now!!

do any of you know of any local fish shows/conventions/ meetings etc that take place in Scotland?

 
The Clubs & Societies section is undergoing a revamp at the mo. Have a quick look here

Ah!!!
 
Are you using the BioClear cartridges?!
 
Because they're a chemical filter that will be adsorbing your ammonia! You want to ditch those and get some normal sponge in there.
 
Someone will probably ask why we don't just use those media all the time. The reason is, as they need constant replacement (because they lock the ammonia onto the surface and the surface gets full), they're expensive and because when they're full, they let the ammonia build up in your tank, which doesn't happen with a bacterial colony, if it's well looked after.

 
Oh gawd, why didn't we think of that sooner.......

 

[fluttermoth]

Ah!!!
 
Are you using the BioClear cartridges?!
 
Because they're a chemical filter that will be adsorbing your ammonia! You want to ditch those and get some normal sponge in there.
 
Someone will probably ask why we don't just use those media all the time. The reason is, as they need constant replacement (because they lock the ammonia onto the surface and the surface gets full), they're expensive and because when they're full, they let the ammonia build up in your tank, which doesn't happen with a bacterial colony, if it's well looked after.

 
Oh gawd, why didn't we think of that sooner.......

I know, duh or what?!

 

[JayP]

I know! Very disappointed, you're supposed to be experts helping us newbies

 

[fluttermoth]

I know! Very disappointed, you're supposed to be experts helping us newbies

Ah, but it would never have occurred to us, because none of us experts would ever use that kind of filter cartridge 

 

[Mamashack]

Unfortunately, Jay, you didn't mention what filter you have until the top of this page (6 pages into the thread!) which is probably why no-one was able to suss why the ammonia level wasn't rising as it should. If we had had that information from the outset and you had followed the sound advice you have been given by experienced people on here you might have been well into the cycle by now. You can't expect people to give specific advice if you're not giving them the specific information they requested.
Hopefully things will proceed as they should altho I still think you would be better doing one thing or the other i.e. foam OR cartridges.

 

[Mamashack]

Sorry if I seemed a bit harsh Jay - it's difficult sometimes to tell whether someone is being serious or having a joke. I completely missed your smiley so I apologise if I came over a bit grumpy in response.

Keep up the good work and keep posting on here - it's a brilliant forum with lots of experienced people who are willing to share and help!