Never done this with a planted tank

[The Big Figfetti]

I'm sure I've read that spikes in Amonia/nitrite can overwhelm the beneficial bacteria which can cause the cycle to take longer. Could try reducing feeding frequency so there's a little less waste being produced.

Thank you. I can give that a try. My betta is currently eating about 5 pellets twice a day, or about 5 bites of frozen brine. I do try to remove the waste as well, just to keep the ammonia lower.

 

[seangee]

If its baby spinach no. You could just dunk it into boiling water for a few seconds and let it cool - but I usually don't

 

[Benji k]

May be a bit of misunderstanding here. The plants appear to be growing, so you will or should never see nitrite (unless something goes terribly wrong). Nitrate may remain zero or may eventually show up but low, depending upon the fish. The ammonia is being used by these plants as their nitrogen source, and they do not produce nitrite or nitrate like the nitrifying bacteria do. The bacteria will still establish themselves, but the benefit of live plants is that you (and the fish) will not see it.

On the ammonia...are you adding any artificially? I would hope you are not, but please confirm.

Second on the ammonia, is chloramine added to your tap water (by the water folks)?

so in planted tanks ther will be amonia they will only eat nitrates

 

[Byron]

With 3 small fish in a tank this planted, you will not see "cycling" at all. The plants will take up the ammonia/ammonium. This is their preferred source of nitrogen. Nitrite and nitrate will never show in our tests, although eventually depending upon the fish load nitrate may appear. But not in this tank with these three small fish and all these plants.

The ammonia at 0.25 or 0.5 is peculiar, but there have been several threads along the same lines. Chloramine is one reason and I asked about that and was told that chloramine is not added to the local water. The test may be faulty. Or there is something we have not been told affecting things. What is the substrate? Are any plant additives being added?

so in planted tanks ther will be amonia they will only eat nitrates

No. If I understand you correctly. Aquatic plants use ammonia/ammonium. There are situations in which some plants will turn to nitrate if the ammonia/ammonium is insufficient in balance, but their preference is ammonium.

 

[The Big Figfetti]

With 3 small fish in a tank this planted, you will not see "cycling" at all. The plants will take up the ammonia/ammonium. This is their preferred source of nitrogen. Nitrite and nitrate will never show in our tests, although eventually depending upon the fish load nitrate may appear. But not in this tank with these three small fish and all these plants.

The ammonia at 0.25 or 0.5 is peculiar, but there have been several threads along the same lines. Chloramine is one reason and I asked about that and was told that chloramine is not added to the local water. The test may be faulty. Or there is something we have not been told affecting things. What is the substrate? Are any plant additives being added?



No. If I understand you correctly. Aquatic plants use ammonia/ammonium. There are situations in which some plants will turn to nitrate if the ammonia/ammonium is insufficient in balance, but their preference is ammonium.

This is just a layer of gravel and then a layer of fluval aqua soil and I added root tabs on that with a cap of sand. Driftwood, small amount of pebbles.

Unless the pebbles are leaching ammonia, I have no idea why it’s at a constant .25-.50. They were in my backyard garden for years and then I brought them in, rinsed them, and added them to the start of the tank.

 

[Byron]

This is just a layer of gravel and then a layer of fluval aqua soil and I added root tabs on that with a cap of sand. Driftwood, small amount of pebbles.

Unless the pebbles are leaching ammonia, I have no idea why it’s at a constant .25-.50. They were in my backyard garden for years and then I brought them in, rinsed them, and added them to the start of the tank.

Ah, there is the ammonia issue, the aqua soil.

Rock (pebbles or larger) does not leech ammonia, thoughif it had absorbed liquid ammonia I suppose it could. But not likely. The soil is your issue.

 

[Charlie1978]

With 3 small fish in a tank this planted, you will not see "cycling" at all. The plants will take up the ammonia/ammonium. This is their preferred source of nitrogen. Nitrite and nitrate will never show in our tests, although eventually depending upon the fish load nitrate may appear. But not in this tank with these three small fish and all these plants.

The ammonia at 0.25 or 0.5 is peculiar, but there have been several threads along the same lines. Chloramine is one reason and I asked about that and was told that chloramine is not added to the local water. The test may be faulty. Or there is something we have not been told affecting things. What is the substrate? Are any plant additives being added?



No. If I understand you correctly. Aquatic plants use ammonia/ammonium. There are situations in which some plants will turn to nitrate if the ammonia/ammonium is insufficient in balance, but their preference is ammonium.

Potentially, but only once the plants are well established. I run mostly eco system tanks, including filter less, where the beneficial bacteria in the deep substrate and plants do all the work. But the plants need a few weeks to become properly established (root system), usually with some help from fertilizer tabs. Until that happens, where there has been plant die off and with a fish in cycle, you will see cycling particularly in that size tank.
If a rimless tank, you can also try growing houseplants with the roots in the aquarium (e.g. Peace lily, pothos... Wash all the compost off first) as they are significantly better then submerged plants at removing amonia, nitrite and nitrate from the aquarium.

 

[Charlie1978]

Ah, there is the ammonia issue, the aqua soil.

Rock (pebbles or larger) does not leech ammonia, thoughif it had absorbed liquid ammonia I suppose it could. But not likely. The soil is your issue.

Definitely a possibility. I've used fluval stratum without issue, but remember reading some reviews prior to first purchase where people had experienced amonia spikes.
Continue with water changes and it will settle down.

 

[Byron]

Potentially, but only once the plants are well established. I run mostly eco system tanks, including filter less, where the beneficial bacteria in the deep substrate and plants do all the work. But the plants need a few weeks to become properly established (root system), usually with some help from fertilizer tabs. Until that happens, where there has been plant die off and with a fish in cycle, you will see cycling particularly in that size tank.
If a rimless tank, you can also try growing houseplants with the roots in the aquarium (e.g. Peace lily, pothos... Wash all the compost off first) as they are significantly better then submerged plants at removing amonia, nitrite and nitrate from the aquarium.

Terrestrial plants do not take up ammonia/ammonium or nitrite. They take up nitrate. The ammonia is taken up either by nitrifying bacteria/archaea or aquatic plants. If there are substantial aquatic plants, they will grab the ammonia/ammonium faster than the nitrifiers can, but some will still get through.

It depends upon how one sets the aquariumupinitially. If there are sufficient fast growing plants, they will grab the majority of the ammonia/ammonium and the nitrifiers will still establish but you will never see ammonia or nitrite using out basic tests as the plants--if sufficient and fast growing--outcompete them. Aquatic plant uptake of ammonium is primarily through the leaves not the roots, and they are very quick at grabbing the ammonia in a matter of hours.

I have set up dozens of tanks over 30 years, and never once cycled any of them, and never had ammonia or nitrite test above zero. I always had plants, and included floaters, even before I understood how this was working. Now I know.