Need Help Identifying Corydoras

[Akasha72]

very interesting Byron. Out of my cories it's the bronzes that like to be apart. My peppered and panda's hang out together with the melini's sometimes joining in. I'm currently watching the panda's playing though and one of the bronzes keeps joining in. They do all interact within my tank but when resting the bronzes prefer to be alone in the back left corner. The peppered and panda's on the right side and the melini's in the middle somewhere. 
 
I really enjoy watching cory behaviour they are probably the cheekiest and most entertaining of all my fish

 

[the_lock_man]

Reading the latest posts today reminds me of an article in the current issue of Amazonas authored by Hans Georg Evers that I was reading yesterday.  It describes his collecting trip to a stream in southern Peru that until now has not been commercially fished, and he discovered what he believes are five new cory species.  But it was his description of what he observed as he snorkelled along the creek that was pertinent to what has been mentioned here.
 
The fish apparently became quite used to his presence after a time, and he describes how shoals of corys would swim within inches of his face, burying themselves continually half way into the mud/sand substrate, with the latter halves of their bodies sticking up.  It is a good observation of the normal behaviour of these fish, and why the substrate is so critical to their well being.  We obviously don't want mud in our tanks, but sand that is smooth, such as play sand, works very well.
 
Another very interesting observation involved the mixed company of two and three different cory species, shoaling together.  He describes collecting groups of fish using a seine net, as is common in the Amazon, and finding mainly one species with several individuals of a second species and sometimes a couple individuals of a third species, all together.  There is a difference of opinion among aquarists as to whether or not cory species should be mixed in an aquarium, but Mr. Evers observations show that they get along nicely in the wild.  At least these do, but I am certain the behaviour extends across most of the genus.
 
It is an interesting article if anyone want to read it.  There is a good highway that now crosses this creek, so likely we will in time see collections of these fish appearing.  The sympatric species included several characins (tetra), whiptails, farlowella, and a few plecos.
 
Byron.

 
FWIW, we've had quite a few anecdotal posts of similar behaviour between cories on the forum over the years.

 

[Baccus]

Thankfully corys will tolerate practically any other cory in existance, but as pointed out by others mixed groups in tank situation tend to mingle a bit but then seperate out into their own little species groups.
I still remember watching a whole school of 54 young peppered catfish I had bred swimming doing laps of their pond on mass, together they looked like some kind of large snake making a curcuit of the pond. An amazing site to behold and satisfying.
If you can get some more peppered to keep your girl company that will be great for her, but they still may prefer to remain secreted away because their numbers still aren't in huge numbers. I dont think anyone could hope to keep in a home aquarium the sort of numbers that cory appreciate

 .
Something that might help the corys feel safer and less exposed would be some dither fish, these can be small peaceful fish that have no fear of you and are happy to be out and about. The corys will see these other fish unafraid and will usually decide that there musnt be any predators nearby and come out to do their snuffling through the sand. Speaking about how much corys love sand, I suggested to a person that they add sand to their catfish tank because the corys would prefer it. He was sceptical but put a divider in the bottom of the tank and put sand on one side and gravel on the other. Needless to say the corys shifted their base of operations over to the sand and rarely ventured on to the gravel even for food.
For shade I find my corys adore a heavily planted with Java fern piece of timber (goldvine if memory serves correctly), this twisted/ artstic piece of wood gave me the chance to have plants at various heights in the tank. Now not only do the corys use under the shade it creates (and have masses of fun weaving through the "roots" of the timber) as their main camp, and place to hunt for uneaten food, but my riffle shrimp have also colonised it and its a living apartment block.

 

[Asmodaues]

Well, i talked with my gf last night. She said no to getting 4+ more coryies, however she said i can get 2 more as long as i buy some driftwood or slate style rock for stacking and making caves.

I was hoping for more, but will take what i get. Shes been very laid back with my fish hobby.

 

[Byron]

Well, i talked with my gf last night. She said no to getting 4+ more coryies, however she said i can get 2 more as long as i buy some driftwood or slate style rock for stacking and making caves.

I was hoping for more, but will take what i get. Shes been very laid back with my fish hobby.

 
This may sound harsh, but it is in the best interests of the fish.  Explain to her that this fish is a living creature created to fit in a very specific set of circumstances, and by denying your fish what nature has programmed them to need, you are being inhumane.  Refer to the two citations in my signature block.
 
It is a real shame that there are people who care so little for the welfare of animals, be it fish, birds, cats or dogs, that they want as "pets," that they will ignore the basic needs of the animals.  [Referring to your gf here.]  Fish like any "pet" should not be acquired if they cannot be given the proper care.
 
Byron.

 

[Akasha72]

 

Well, i talked with my gf last night. She said no to getting 4+ more coryies, however she said i can get 2 more as long as i buy some driftwood or slate style rock for stacking and making caves.

I was hoping for more, but will take what i get. Shes been very laid back with my fish hobby.

 
This may sound harsh, but it is in the best interests of the fish.  Explain to her that this fish is a living creature created to fit in a very specific set of circumstances, and by denying your fish what nature has programmed them to need, you are being inhumane.  Refer to the two citations in my signature block.
 
It is a real shame that there are people who care so little for the welfare of animals, be it fish, birds, cats or dogs, that they want as "pets," that they will ignore the basic needs of the animals.  [Referring to your gf here.]  Fish like any "pet" should not be acquired if they cannot be given the proper care.
 
Byron.
 

 
+1 

 

[Asmodaues]

Oh i didnt mean laid back in a negligent way, thats my mistake. I meant she normally lets me do as i feel, decor, plants etc. She cares about them as much as i do. We are going as far as replacing gravel with sand and redoing the decor to better suit their habitat needs this weekend.

I shold show her his posting so she can understand more. She is concerned about space as i was.

Could i do 2 to start and add more as i can? The only store around here that carries peppered cories has 4 in stock and im hoping no one buys before tomm.

 

[Byron]

Oh i didnt mean laid back in a negligent way, thats my mistake. I meant she normally lets me do as i feel, decor, plants etc. She cares about them as much as i do. We are going as far as replacing gravel with sand and redoing the decor to better suit their habitat needs this weekend.

I shold show her his posting so she can understand more. She is concerned about space as i was.

Could i do 2 to start and add more as i can? The only store around here that carries peppered cories has 4 in stock and im hoping no one buys before tomm.

 
Generally it is better acquiring the four new corys together.  Shoaling fish are always better if acquired in numbers; they are less stressed and settle in much faster.  And the impact of four corys in an established tank is minimal.
 
The issue is that the substrate change is going to affect the biology significantly, and you don't have live plants (from the photo) that would really make a difference as they take up a lot of ammonia and maintain water stability very well in other respects.  Whatever you do, when you change the substrate, do not clean the decor or filter; you can swish these in the tank water as you remove them but no more.  Bacteria live on all these surfaces.  We can discuss methods of changing the substrate if you ask.
 
Will the store hold the four corys for you, if you pay a deposit or whatever?  Explain the situation, that you want to get the new substrate in and ensure everything is working before adding new fish.  If you can do it this way, you will have no problems with adding the four corys together.  I'm suggesting this because obviously the corys will be stressed from the capture/bagging/transport to your tank.
 
What sort of sand are you intending?  I use regular play sand; it replicates the sands in Amazonia, it is smooth, and it is very inexpensive.  Corys do very well with this sand.  One bag for probably $4-$5 from Lowe's or Home Depot is all you will need.
 
Byron.

 

[Asmodaues]

The regular play sand is a great suggestion. Im making a stop at home depot tomm as well.

I never fully wash my decor, swish it around whe doing changes as needed.

For the gravel removal, i was planning at 40-50% water change and using a net to scoop and remove the gravel. I wondered about removing half of it and just layering at least 1/2" over it. I planned to heavily rinse the new sand to avoid cloudy looking appearance. Im open to suggestions as well!

I dont have live plants yet, but have thought about it some. Currently only my betta tanks have live annubis plants.

 

[Akasha72]

just wanted to add (cos no-one else has mentioned it) when you get your sand you'll need to wash is several times before adding it to the tank. There's various ways to wash it but I like to half fill a bucket with sand and run plenty of water into the bucket. A lot of the 'scum' will come to the surface to begin with - just let that run off. Keep running water into the bucket and get your hand in and swirl it round. You'll start to see any dirt come to the surface - pour that away and keep going until the water is clear. One that bucket is clean you can move on to the next one .... and the next one
 
Happy sand washing

 

[frapadoodle]

just wanted to add (cos no-one else has mentioned it) when you get your sand you'll need to wash is several times before adding it to the tank. There's various ways to wash it but I like to half fill a bucket with sand and run plenty of water into the bucket. A lot of the 'scum' will come to the surface to begin with - just let that run off. Keep running water into the bucket and get your hand in and swirl it round. You'll start to see any dirt come to the surface - pour that away and keep going until the water is clear. One that bucket is clean you can move on to the next one .... and the next one
 
Happy sand washing

Agree whole heartedly. You can't rinse sand too much.
I use the bucket method as well. I always have rinsed sand ready to go.
Now is the best time to buy it, when Home Depot has their garden supplies on sale.

 

[Ch4rlie]

Good tip from Akasha, washing sand is a must really. Helps to get rid of dust and dirt.
 
My method is very similar, put some sand in bucket, run the shower hose and put that in bucket, the motion of water from shower head moves the sand around while shifting all the dirt and dust, and i run my hand through the sand at same time, keep going until water runs clear from the bucket.

 

[Byron]

I agree with Akasha.  Play sand is usually very dirty, but it is a clean "dirty" so not harmful.

   On to the method I suggest.  I have tried changing substrate in the tank bit by bit but it was not easy.  And you absolutely do not want to mix substrate materials.  This will look hideous, believe me; the sand will filter down to the bottom quickly, leaving the gravel on top.  You want to remove all the gravel, and have just sand.
 
I have changed the substrate in all my tanks ranging from a 10g up to a 115g, from gravel to sand, and some tanks more than once due to experiments or whatever, and I recommend a temporary tank [a spare 10g works fine, and worth having on hand for emergencies] filled with water siphoned from the existing tank (from the top so as not to get any detritus), removing the decor, heater and filter to this temp tank, netting over the fish.  Cover the temp tank as fish do jump.  This gives you adequate time to do the job properly without rushing.  Drain the existing tank, scoop out all the gravel and dispose of it however you intend; it can go in a bucket and you can wash it later if you have another use for it.
 
Wash the play sand in small amounts in a pail until you can see the sand through the water.  You'll never get all the dirt out, but that doesn't matter.  Put the washed sand into the tank as you do each pail.  When you have roughly 1.5 inches of sand level throughout the new tank, or 2 inches max, you're ready to add water.  Place a large clean bowl or similar on the sand and run the fresh water into this; this stirs up very little sand.  Add about 4-5 inches; I squirt in a small amount of dechlorinator, then arrange the hardscape (wood, rocks, decor, plants).  This will likely stir up dirt, so I then siphon out the water down to the sand.  Then fill the tank about 3/4 full, using the bowl again.  Use dechlorinator at the start of the refill, and have the water just a tad warmer than the water in the temporary tank.
 
Providing the parameters between tap and tank are relatively similar, I would do a 50% water change on the temporary tank when you remove the decor.  At this point you can get the tank running by moving over the filter and heater.  Fill the tank close to the top.  Move the fish over; sometimes I just net them from tank to tank, other times I use a pail and mix the waters half/half.  The latter helps with very sensitive fish, or if parameters are not close.
 
Byron.

 

[Asmodaues]

Welll, im still being shot down on adding 4 more cories due to concern of crowding the tank. She is still agreeing to 2 right now.

Reading back, i failed to mention in the 20gal. I also have 5 neon tetras, 2 cherry shrimp, Charlie and one moody tri banded sumo loach. Charlie and Zoom(the loach) have a love/hate relationship to say the least.

What are my options at this point? Im still doing the sand and we agreed if i can find a 20long that we would add enough to get a cory school.

 

[Baccus]

I actually have a sand/ gravel mix in most of my tanks, but this is because where most of the gravel is concetrated is where I have my live plants. Natural river gravel doesnt look bad interspersed with sand in my opinion, it just makes more of a creek feel. It also helps the plants be able to spread their roots through the substrate since sand can have the habit of compacting and allowing anerobic bacteria to flourish.
While your GF is agreeing to at least 2 more corys, could you perhaps get her to agree to 3? Usually when my husband doesnt want any more of a particular species and there is only 4 in a tank and he has agreed to getting 3 I can convince him its mean/ cruel to leave one solo fish in the tank at the store. I know your GF is concerned with space, and usually I would never endorse potential over crowding but knowing how much corys love and need company its a bit of a trade off.
Sadly it seems the tri-banded loaches (do you have 1 or 2?) was a poor option for your tank. I haven't experienced them myself but some research indicates that they are territorial towards each other and generally want a fair amount of flow in their tank. If two are kept together than ample hidey holes need to be supplied to try and reduce aggression between them. I also wouldn't put it past the loaches to harass the cory(s) when it feels its territory is being invaded or when it comes to getting prefered foods. Corys have NO respect for territories, they will bumble through everything as they bulldoze looking for food. If your not overly attached to your tri-banded loaches (which can get up to 10cm apparently) then I would look at re-homing either 1 or both. This then would also allow for the extra corys. I also would not trust the tri-banded loaches with shrimp, least of all a small species like cherry shrimp.
If you really like the look of loaches (and I get very attached to mine) two species that I have found to be very peaceful is Khuli loaches and even dwarf chain loaches can be well behaved, but dwarf chain loaches also like to be in groups so they can bicker amongst themselves which they seem to enjoy without causing harm to each other. Khuli loaches also like being in a pack but I have never seen them bicker or even bother any other fish or shrimp in their tank.
The neon tetras also would much prefer being in greater numbers and would be less skittish in a large group. Neon tetras are prey species to many other fish in their natural habitat including angel fish, so neons really do feel safer in numbers.