More Danio Trouble

[M'al-finny]

Well, I had been keeping an eye on a danio who just looked skinnier than the rest. I went away Friday and had a friend feed on Saturday. Apparently he was dead (sucked up to the filter intake) by Saturday afternoon (my friend mentioned it.) I arrived home Sunday afternoon to net him out ... then did a 25% water change.

This morning, I saw another anorexic little danio FALL from the surface of the tank to the gravel, where he just lay. He is emaciated and his eyes are too dark. I don't think he'll live through my work day and I expect him dead when I arrive home. I put some mushed peas into the tank near him, hoping perhaps he'll have the strength to go over and eat a bite or two. But I really don't expect it. I am missing another danio ... I suspect he is dead in the gravel somewhere.

What killed my little danios THIS time? I seem to have terrible trouble keeping them alive!

Water stats are all good, this is a 55 gal tank who's other inhabitants are: 1 betta, 2 corys, 6 black phantom tetras and what started out as 7 danios and I suspect is now 4 danios.

I will plan on another water change tonight and I'll recheck water stats. All the rest of the danios are fat like little piglets. Why are these emaciated? What can be the issue?

 

[backtotropical]

When you say water stats are all good, what actually are they?

Ammonia?
Nitrite?
Nitrate?
PH?

 

[M'al-finny]

Ammonia = 0
Nitrite = 0
Nitrate = <5
pH = 7.5-8.0 (well water, very high sulphur content -- no change for this tank)

 

[*Fishkies*]

How long have you had these danios?
How often do you feed?

What all do you feed? Flakes, pellets, sinking food for corys??

 

[M'al-finny]

!!! I think I figured it out !!! (Sadly, my little danio did not make it.)

I went back and re-checked my water stats after posting. My tank is pH 8.8! (Or higher, that's as high as the color chart goes.) HOLY COW!!! I rechecked several times, and from the tap my water is 7.4.

I did a big water change and got the pH down to 8.2 and have not fed since then.

I feed flake, plus sinking wafers for the corys as the staple diet. I feed freeze-dried bloodworms as a treat and mushed peas as a very occasional treat.

I was feeding flake forever (long before I got the corys) and the pH was fine, so this leads me to believe the sinking wafers are the culprit. (Either that or one of the ding-dang cats dipping his litter-covered paw into the filter sump!)

I can keep doing water changes until I get some pH adjusters.

How much should I adjust the pH at a time to avoid shocking the fish? I am thinking I need to bring it to my sink pH. Please advise!

Help!



(ETA: Happily, I found my other "missing" danio between the filter plates and cup-scooped him back into the tank. He seems OK; I'm keeping an eye on him!)

 

[backtotropical]

Don't use PH adjusting chemicals. You'll make your situation worse because as soon as you add that stuff, thats you dependant on it to keep your ph right. Then, first time you don't add it, you'll have a ph crash, probably killing some fish. You are better to find out why your ph is so high and fix the cause rather than going straight for a cure.

What substrate / rock / wood / ornaments do you have in your tank?

Backtotropical

 

[M'al-finny]

Substrate is uncoated pea-sized aquarium gravel and has been in tank since inception (5 months?)

Tank is 55 gallon acrylic.

Decor is artificial plants (with some algae growing on them) and a plastic aquarium decor "rock" cave and a plastic "swamp log."

I have a couple of nice quartz stones which we added at time of first filling of the tank ... my "expert" source said quartz would be OK.

I can add some moss or bogwood (?) to buffer the pH if you think it better, just direct me where to buy or order online. How does this affect water changes?

Because if I let my aquarium stay that high, then every water change is a potential pH shock ... right? And, I know that my fish are high-pH tolerant, but there's a difference between high pH and RIDICULOUSLY high pH ... right?

What could be causing this?

 

[The-Wolf]

I find it odd that you state your well water is high in sulphur content yet you can't figure out what is killing your fish.
apart from raising the pH sulphur is highly toxic to aquatic lfe

 

[M'al-finny]

I don't believe that we are anywhere near a toxic level ... do they make a test kit for it? (This tank has been running for more than 5 months, so I believe if it were toxic that more would have died? Am I wrong?)

To zero in on the pH, which seems to need more attention, was a pH drop from 8.8 to 8.2 (via water change) too much at one time?

Edited to add: In 5 months I have lost 5 danios: 2 to (separate) filter accidents (trauma,) 1 to TB (deformed/curved spine) and now 2 this week to a new issue. During this time, I have had a betta go to a hospital tank and recover from popeye/fin rot and be returned to the main tank. So, I don't think my request for help with the danios is unreasonable ... it is NOT the same mistake again and again; the pH issue for me is new. I will certainly follow advice to HELP my tank and my fishies, so thank you all for helping me figure out what I need to check next. Like I said, is there a test kit for mineral levels?

 

[M'al-finny]

**********
Also, as I think of it, I am using tap water in the tank and the pH is 7.4. So, if the culprit is sulphur, which is originating from the tap water, why is the tank pH so much higher?

I think that may be a component, but my gut says that's not the complete story! Good get, though!

 

[Terriann]

I hope this helps. I was told that plants help lower your ph as does aged bogwater. I have also been informed that RO water could help, I don't know what that is though so maybe you could google it?


http/fins.actwin.com/mirror/begin-chem.html

Tan

 

[M'al-finny]

RO is reverse osmosis -- it pushes the water through a series of membranes to remove impurities. A lot of bottled water is purified this way. Coincidentally, we have a full-on RO setup (including 2.5 gallon holding tank under the sink) on my kitchen sink. If my fishtank were smaller, this might be a possibility, but it takes several HOURS to produce 2.5 gallons of RO water. (Hence the holding tank for drinking water.)

I will also look into plants, as I wanted to do that anyway, but have no idea how to transition a tank with a super-huge filter on it into a plant-only filtered setup (my eventual goal for down the road.)

So, can someone help me:

1) figure out how to get moss? Should I get moss?
2) tell me definitively the steps to transition to a planted tank?
3) help me find a sulphur test kit?
4) tell me if my food or substrate could be a problem?
5) tell me if I should keep doing water changes to bring the pH back down?
6) tell me how much I can adjust the pH by water change safely.

Wow. I am terribly demanding, sorry. But I believe that the collective wisdom of TFF will save me from blundering and hurting my fishies without meaning to!

You guys ROCK!