im no expert at all, but from having ich recently (still treating it) it really does sound like ich. someone told me that you couldnt see ich floating around, but i definitly saw them. they tended to stay at the surface, except when they would drift under the filter and be pushed down. today they all disappeared though, im not sure if its from the treatment (this is the third day of treatment) or if its the ich life cycle. also as i was changing the water i noticed slightly large white things in the gravel, and they sunk. i dont know if theyre dead ich, or another life stage *shrug* just passin on the info.
Millions of white dots......can anyone help!!??
- Thread starter AngelKay
- Start date
Wasserpest
Fish Fanatic
This seems to be highly contagious 
'cause now I have the same stuff in my tank... It's only visible when you are close to the tank, from 3 feet distance it's not noticeable. It does look like dust, and not actively moving around, definitely no hydras or cyclops.
I added some fish recently from a store that has major ich infestations, so that could be a possibility, although there are truly millions... None of my fishies has any signs of an outbreak though (yet... knocking on driftwood).
The other thing that I thought could have happened is that these are floating particles from my substrate. Among the fishies I recently added were some Yoyo loaches, and they do some slight digging, which might have disturbed the loam in my substrate.
I also started feeding something called "Variety wafers" which is basically compressed dust, and while fishies chew on it some of it gets dispersed in the water column.
Well I hope you see something in the microscope, I thought about ordering one too... any good links? I know that Intel makes one you can connect to a PC, than do screen shots... sounds sweet to me.
'cause now I have the same stuff in my tank... It's only visible when you are close to the tank, from 3 feet distance it's not noticeable. It does look like dust, and not actively moving around, definitely no hydras or cyclops.I added some fish recently from a store that has major ich infestations, so that could be a possibility, although there are truly millions... None of my fishies has any signs of an outbreak though (yet... knocking on driftwood).
The other thing that I thought could have happened is that these are floating particles from my substrate. Among the fishies I recently added were some Yoyo loaches, and they do some slight digging, which might have disturbed the loam in my substrate.
I also started feeding something called "Variety wafers" which is basically compressed dust, and while fishies chew on it some of it gets dispersed in the water column.
Well I hope you see something in the microscope, I thought about ordering one too... any good links? I know that Intel makes one you can connect to a PC, than do screen shots... sounds sweet to me.
Mogo
Fishaholic
Hello AngelKay...
Haven't had a lot of time recently to log on, but have just caught myself up on the thread. I hope you get your microscope soon.
I was thinking the same thing as Alien Anna that it could possibly be copepods. These are small aquatic crustaceans and can be super tiny, barely visible to the naked eye or can be up to 2cm (although there are a few species that can reach over 30cm). Most of the freshwater copepods are non parasitic but there is a few species that are parasitic to fish. However, if your tank is carrying a large burden of these little buggers, it's not surprising that your fish are irritated. It's kind of like after having your hair cut, the little hair snippets are not attacking you, but the mere presence of enough of them on your skin is enough to annoy and drive you crazy.
Once you get your microscope, sorting out what you have shouldn't be a problem. Getting a good picture takes a bit of practice, as you'll have to play around with the angle you hold the camera on the optical lens until you get it right. A little while back I did some microscopy pages for Feline, and have put up some slide photos of some common microrganisms you can find in your aquarium. You might find it useful right now, as you may have one of the ones I've already covered. More will be coming, I've just been really busy. If you don't find it there, post a pic and I'll let you know what you have. I'll put the link at the bottom of the page, I have a few pics of a harpacticoid copepod on page six.
As for using the copper, I would hold back for now, as copper can be stressful to fish, especially if your dosage is off. As a result of our massive power outage here, tank temps went up with no AC and and I now have quite a nice population of copepods, they like the warmer temps. I have been working on some experiments to figure out what is the lowest salt solution that will whipe them out. It's a time consuming process, and am hoping to have the results by mid next week. Finding the lowest salt solution would be ideal to use on fish who are less tolerant to salt, however scaleless fish and others who do not tolerate salt would have to be removed during treatment.
Please keep us posted...Heres the link
Microrganisms
Haven't had a lot of time recently to log on, but have just caught myself up on the thread. I hope you get your microscope soon.
I was thinking the same thing as Alien Anna that it could possibly be copepods. These are small aquatic crustaceans and can be super tiny, barely visible to the naked eye or can be up to 2cm (although there are a few species that can reach over 30cm). Most of the freshwater copepods are non parasitic but there is a few species that are parasitic to fish. However, if your tank is carrying a large burden of these little buggers, it's not surprising that your fish are irritated. It's kind of like after having your hair cut, the little hair snippets are not attacking you, but the mere presence of enough of them on your skin is enough to annoy and drive you crazy.
Once you get your microscope, sorting out what you have shouldn't be a problem. Getting a good picture takes a bit of practice, as you'll have to play around with the angle you hold the camera on the optical lens until you get it right. A little while back I did some microscopy pages for Feline, and have put up some slide photos of some common microrganisms you can find in your aquarium. You might find it useful right now, as you may have one of the ones I've already covered. More will be coming, I've just been really busy. If you don't find it there, post a pic and I'll let you know what you have. I'll put the link at the bottom of the page, I have a few pics of a harpacticoid copepod on page six.
As for using the copper, I would hold back for now, as copper can be stressful to fish, especially if your dosage is off. As a result of our massive power outage here, tank temps went up with no AC and and I now have quite a nice population of copepods, they like the warmer temps. I have been working on some experiments to figure out what is the lowest salt solution that will whipe them out. It's a time consuming process, and am hoping to have the results by mid next week. Finding the lowest salt solution would be ideal to use on fish who are less tolerant to salt, however scaleless fish and others who do not tolerate salt would have to be removed during treatment.
Please keep us posted...Heres the link
Microrganisms
Wasserpest
Fish Fanatic
Beautiful pictures Mogo. It's a fascinating world.
What seemed to be dust is alive indeed. Looking through a camera lens shows them little balls moving around.
There are much less of them in my tank right now, hopefully it was just a temporary instability. None of the fishies seemed to be affected either.
What seemed to be dust is alive indeed. Looking through a camera lens shows them little balls moving around.
There are much less of them in my tank right now, hopefully it was just a temporary instability. None of the fishies seemed to be affected either.
Mogo
Fishaholic
Thanks Wesserpest 
These things come and go, and if your fish didn't seem bothered, I think it's safe to assume it was just one of the regular inhabitants. It's actually quite surprising the multitude of critters than live in our tanks that we just can't see. Copepods don't look like balls (more like little white splinters that kind of swim in a hopping zig zag motion), so I'll do a good thorough check of all my tanks and see if I can find any of the mysterious white balls. If I find any, I'll give them a look under the microscope and see what they are. How do they move? Do they spin and rotate, do they go up to the water surface..a good description of how the things move will make it easier for me to spot them if I have a few but not a big population. I have this huge magnifying glass thing, about 8 inches in diameter, that I snagged from my mom. It's supposed to be used for needlepoint work, but has come in handy especially for checking sick fish
These things come and go, and if your fish didn't seem bothered, I think it's safe to assume it was just one of the regular inhabitants. It's actually quite surprising the multitude of critters than live in our tanks that we just can't see. Copepods don't look like balls (more like little white splinters that kind of swim in a hopping zig zag motion), so I'll do a good thorough check of all my tanks and see if I can find any of the mysterious white balls. If I find any, I'll give them a look under the microscope and see what they are. How do they move? Do they spin and rotate, do they go up to the water surface..a good description of how the things move will make it easier for me to spot them if I have a few but not a big population. I have this huge magnifying glass thing, about 8 inches in diameter, that I snagged from my mom. It's supposed to be used for needlepoint work, but has come in handy especially for checking sick fish Wasserpest
Fish Fanatic
I am familiar with Copepods of the genus Cyclops, which move with little jumps, especially when a fish tries to eat them 
The little white balls in my tank are much, much smaller, more in the range of paramecium (which I recall being transparent though), and they move in continuous spinning and rotating fashion. The are passively drifting in the currents, so I can't say if they are attracted to light or not or prefer to be close to the surface or bottom.
Unfortunately they are too small to take a picture of them... I might have introduced them with the daphnias, cyclops and mosquito larvae that I catch once in a while... as you say, there are all kind of strange critters in our tanks.
BTW, my Pearl Gouramies are still thankful for your help with the anchor worms
The little white balls in my tank are much, much smaller, more in the range of paramecium (which I recall being transparent though), and they move in continuous spinning and rotating fashion. The are passively drifting in the currents, so I can't say if they are attracted to light or not or prefer to be close to the surface or bottom.
Unfortunately they are too small to take a picture of them... I might have introduced them with the daphnias, cyclops and mosquito larvae that I catch once in a while... as you say, there are all kind of strange critters in our tanks.
BTW, my Pearl Gouramies are still thankful for your help with the anchor worms
Mogo
Fishaholic
I did do a good check in my tanks, and I haven't spotted any of the round little critters yet. I'll keep an eye out for them and maybe I'll catch a few sometime. It's very possible that it was introduced with the daphnia etc, and perhaps that is why I've never seen them as I have never fed any of those sorts, as most of my cichlids are too big to even look twice at such things Kind of drives me nuts when I have an influx of copepods
Good to hear the gourami's are doing better, I never did catch an update on the whole situation, I've just kind of been popping in and out recently and probably missed it. That's great news, glad things worked out, glad to help
Kind of drives me nuts when I have an influx of copepods Good to hear the gourami's are doing better, I never did catch an update on the whole situation, I've just kind of been popping in and out recently and probably missed it. That's great news, glad things worked out, glad to help
AngelKay
New Member
Hello everyone, the microscope finally came!!Hurray!! I got a very good look at the little buggers. In one drop of water there were about 20-30 of them swimming around, I took several samples & that was about the same in each drop. They are different sizes (I guess babies,adults) the side view looks like a flea kinda and the top view is an oval, when they flip over it looked like they are flat on the bottom & round on top (like a leech). The little ones move very fast darting back & forth, going in circles etc., the bigger ones are slower(but still fast) & constantly moving. They are transparent, you can see darker shades of their insides and in one really close look I got of a top view of one it was oval and had several little legs going around the whole body!! I have tried to get some pictures, their not as clear as I see them in the microscope but maybe someone will be able to tell what these are & then help me find a way to get rid of them. I will take more samples under the scope & try to get better pictures, o.k. They are constantly moving & it's hard to get a good, clear picture!!They don't look like any of the pictures yal have shown me, more like a microscopic thing!
I will keep ya posted, my fish are hanging in there!! Thanks,
AngelKay
Oh No!!!!
How do I put my pictures up in my letter?? Great, another set back until I hear from yal!!!!! PLEASE HELP, HURRY!!!! I NEED TO SHOW YAL THESE BUGS!!Feline
Fish Herder
Glad to hear ur microscope arrived!! I've been following this thread from the start coz i'm interested to know those microscopic darlings altho I dont hav any knowledge/opinion to give u...
Anyway, u can post the pictures in "members aquarium pictures" section, n put a link here.
Looking forward to seeing ur pics!!
I've been following this thread from the start coz i'm interested to know those microscopic darlings altho I dont hav any knowledge/opinion to give u...Anyway, u can post the pictures in "members aquarium pictures" section, n put a link here.
Looking forward to seeing ur pics!!
Wasserpest
Fish Fanatic
I wonder if it is perhaps Paramecium. Oval, legs around the body... sounds like it.
Mogo
Fishaholic
Hi AngelKay,
I just got your email. Glad to hear you finally got your microscope. It would probably be best to post the images on the forum, that way, anyone who is interested in this sort of thing can see them. There is a pinned thread in members aquarium photos, that gives instructions on how to post the images. In the meantime, if you want to email them to me, I can take a look. From your description, it sounds like it can be many things, and I want to see the photos before I start guessing.
Some tips and tricks on taking the photos with a microscope. First of all, you'll want to slow or kill the little buggers so they are not moving. This can be done in many ways, but simple salt can be added and should do the trick on most little creatures. If this doesn't work, just plain old white vinegar can be used. Using the zoom on your camera will also get better pictures, but the only problem with that is the size is inaccurate, make sure you post at least one image without using the zoom and provide the magnification, as knowing the size of the organism will help eliminate some possibilities. Other than that, it's basically just playing around with the angle you hold the camera on. Hope that helps...
Can't wait to see the photos!!!
I just got your email. Glad to hear you finally got your microscope. It would probably be best to post the images on the forum, that way, anyone who is interested in this sort of thing can see them. There is a pinned thread in members aquarium photos, that gives instructions on how to post the images. In the meantime, if you want to email them to me, I can take a look. From your description, it sounds like it can be many things, and I want to see the photos before I start guessing.
Some tips and tricks on taking the photos with a microscope. First of all, you'll want to slow or kill the little buggers so they are not moving. This can be done in many ways, but simple salt can be added and should do the trick on most little creatures. If this doesn't work, just plain old white vinegar can be used. Using the zoom on your camera will also get better pictures, but the only problem with that is the size is inaccurate, make sure you post at least one image without using the zoom and provide the magnification, as knowing the size of the organism will help eliminate some possibilities. Other than that, it's basically just playing around with the angle you hold the camera on. Hope that helps...
Can't wait to see the photos!!!
Alien Anna
Fish Gatherer
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Methylene blue will not only stun the b**tids, it should also stain them and make them more visible - if you happen to have any hanging around, that is.
I still say call a university or something. I remember studying about some cyclops sorta thing that lived in the water. Very small invertebrate, I can't quite remember all of its life stages. I think it started out in snails and hatched out as a free swimmer then infested fish. It sounds like some little creature like that. I have heard it is very difficult to get copper out of your water after you add it as a treatment, that may only pertain to saltwater, but I am not sure. UV sterilization kills anything alive. Scientists use it to genetically alter fruit flies and things ( they don't leave them under the light long enough to kill them) if they were left longer they would surely die. It can genetically alter your genes too just think of skin cancer. Hospitals and some restaurants use UV lamps to kill airborne bacteria and stuff. People that have sump filtration can add a UV sterilizer to kill bacteria and protozoa that are in the water being filtered, so you can't expose your fish to it. If you had a temporary holding tank you could UV your tank and then put your fish back in after your treatment is done. You need to figure out what it is so you can figure out what its life stages are so you can treat it properly. Whether it has a fish as the host or if it lives in the substrate. Sounds like you should cycle some brand new water and thoroughly clean out the other. You have a real battle going on. Seriously though, try to contact the water company or a Biologist that deals with water they can surely help you.
Mogo
Fishaholic
Ginger,
Although many copepods are parasitic, the "cyclops" or cyclopoid copepod, is not parasitic, it is free swimming. I have never found one in my tanks, but have on many occassions found harpacticoid copepods, which are also free swimming, but much smaller than the cyclopoid variety. The population comes and goes, and I did have a good sized population a couple weeks ago and was doing some experiments on them, but the population disappeared and will have to wait till get a new population so I can continue my experiments.
As AlienAnna said, MB can be used, along with many others, but I recommended salt or vinegar because it is cheaper, and safer than using chemicals.
Although many copepods are parasitic, the "cyclops" or cyclopoid copepod, is not parasitic, it is free swimming. I have never found one in my tanks, but have on many occassions found harpacticoid copepods, which are also free swimming, but much smaller than the cyclopoid variety. The population comes and goes, and I did have a good sized population a couple weeks ago and was doing some experiments on them, but the population disappeared and will have to wait till get a new population so I can continue my experiments.
As AlienAnna said, MB can be used, along with many others, but I recommended salt or vinegar because it is cheaper, and safer than using chemicals.
AngelKay
New Member
HELLO EVERYONE WHO HAS BEEN SO HELPFUL AND PATIENT WITH MY PROBLEM!!! I WAS HAVING TROUBLE POSTING MY PICTURES SO I SENT THEM TO A COUPLE OF FORUM FRIENDS TO SEE IF THEY COULD TAKE A LOOK AND MAYBE GET THEM POSTED SO EVERYONE CAN SEE!! I JUST CAN'T FIGURE IT OUT!! HOPEFULLY THIS WILL WORK AND SOMEONE WILL BE ABLE TO TELL WHAT THEY ARE AND HOW TO GET RID OF THEM. THEY ARE REALLY STARTING TO BOTHER MY FISH NOW.... 1 ANGEL GETS WHITE SPOTS THEN THEY DISAPPEAR AND HIS SCALE WHERE THE SPOT WAS POPS OFF, IT HANGS ON FOR A WHILE THEN JUST FALLS OFF!! I ALSO NOTICED ANOTHER ANGEL WHOSE FEELER WAS ATE OFF BY THE BUGS (AND GREW BACK HALF WAY) IS BEING EATEN OFF AGAIN!! IT LOOKS AS IF THEY GET IN THE SKIN OF THEIR FINS AND HATCH OR SOMETHING. MY SMALLER FISH THAT STAY MAINLY ON THE BOTTOM HAVE BEEN SCRATCHING ON THE ROCKS... THERE ARE SO MANY (BUGS) THAT I GUESS THE FISH REALLY FEEL THEM NOW EVEN THOUGH THEY (BUGS) ARE SO SMALL!!!! THE PICTURES ARE DIFFERENT, IN SOME YOU SEE A LIMA BEAN SHAPED THING, IN OTHERS THERES A CLUSTER OF EGGS OR SOMETHING (I THINK THEY WERE ACTUALLY HATCHING),IN ONE WAS AN OVAL SHAPED THING WITH A TAIL, & OTHERS LOOKED LIKE LITTLE PIECES OF RICE!!! THANKS TO EVERYONE WHO HAS TRIED TO HELP WITH ALL THE GREAT INPUT, I KNOW WE WILL ALL BE GLAD TO FINALLY FIGURE OUT WHAT THESE LITTLE BUGGERS ARE!!!
THANKS AGAIN,
ANGELKAY
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