Marine Set up

[FrankSlapperinni]

how about this
1 dwarf flame angel (a lot smaller that the bi color)
2 occelarous clow fish
3 yellowtail damselfish
1 bicolor psudochromus/ or a royal gamma basslet
1 electric blue hermit crab

with the hermit crab, do you have to buy bigger shells for it to live in as it gets older, ordoes it just stay in its own shell in the aquarium?

 

[ostrow]

You're going with a 75G, right? That should be fine.

All of these fish are pretty small. If I were you, I'd stick with the larger bicolor or go with one tang ... something so that you have differential size ... nicer for viewing. 75G tank is large enough to have one decent sized fish. In mine, I have at the moment 1 large salfin tang, 3 green chromis (2 perished -- I had 5), 2 small percula clowns, 1 royal gramma, and one lawnmower blenny. Gonna probably add 1 atlantic pygmy angel and/or a yellowhead wrasse or cleaner goby.

No point to adding 1 hermit crab. First you need to decide, live rock? Sandbed? Both? If to you go with either, you need a cleanup crew that is roughly equal to the number of gallons of water in the tank. So we're talking somewhere in the neighborhood of 60 critters (remember, rock/sand will displace some water so you won't in fact have 75G.) Many places sell packages, or you can find folks on reefcentral.com selling lots of them. Even ebay.

Nassarius snails sift sand and eat the garbage. Of course, mine don't go near the sand they stay on the glass so my sand looks like hell

Cerith snails are supposed to eat lots of nasty algae and stir the sand.

Nerite snails eat all sorts of algae.

Turbos (Astreas are supposed to be the best, I have none) are allegedly the best algae cleaners. I'm out to get some soon.

Crabs: mine eat my snails and I don't like that. Others have had similar problems and have had to decide between them and snails. But most places combine them in packages so I have no idea what the norm is.

Emerald crabs are great hair algae eaters and will wipe out bubble algae (never had it, supposed to be a real drag so worth having one in the tank).

Red, blue, or black and white hermits all have virtues. I find them all to be murderous.

The right-handed hermits are definitely psychotic.

So decide and get a bunch.

OH -- I would definitely at least have live rock in the tank. It is pretty, it is a natural filter, will keep the water clean, and will be interesting to watch. You can do this cheaply, too. Get a bunch of dead, dry base rock. Again, look on reefcentral for someone in your area getting out of the hobby, or just search around for baserock. It's cheap, dry rubble. But you can't use just any rock. Had to at one time have been live.

Then add 2-3 pieces of live rock -- either buy them from a store or find someone to give you a couple or buy them from someone. The corralline algae will spread fast, the critters will multiply, and you'll have a really interesting tank.

 

[FrankSlapperinni]

wa wa wait, 60 critters? that sounds like a lot. is this for a tank with only them or fish to?
I was going to have live rock only, not live sand, because then it would be expensive.waht about starfish? ive seen some amazing starfish in other peoples aquariums and I was wondering if there were any apropriet for the beginer.
also, what is ditrius?
can you realy keep a sailfin tang in a 75 gallon? becase I saw this beautiful one at this pet store near me, but I had heard they need an aquarium of 125 gallons or more because they grow 15"

 

[ostrow]

15"? A Sailfin Tang? Maybe after 20 years. Mine is about 5" or so and is I think 3 yrs old. He's been in this tank the whole time and he is happy as can be. Very territorial. Add him last.

That is exactly what I said when I started. No way I was going to put 60 snails in my tank. Wish I had from the start. The guy I got the setup from had bad, bad algae problems. He had maybe 10 Turbo snails and 3-5 hermit crabs. That was it. My problems are worse than his, and I've been adding snails and crabs slowly.
Go to liveaquaria.com and see the size of their 75G cleanup crew.

No sand, no starfish. At least, that's my understanding of them. I don't have any but may get a brittle star.

In FOWLR you can perhaps get away with fewer critters, but you still need them to eat the detritus (leftover food, waste, etc) and the inevitable algae on the glass and rock. With sand they tend to be less visible. I guess they'd still hide in and on the rock, but you'll see them on the glass.

Were you going to go with a glass bottom? Or crushed coral? If it isn't a glass bottom, I'd say you really want to have them but I think I'll hope GL jumps in on this soon!

 

[FrankSlapperinni]

I was going to have gravel, not crushed corral or anything. my water is the perfect thing for salt water, its like 8.2 without any buffer.
but I read on live aquaria that they get 15 inches
I just checked on live aquaria.com, how could all of those little creachers fit in the tank? the tank would just be swarming with them.
whats FOWLR?

 

[ostrow]

Fish only with live rock = FOWLR.

Gravel? Like what people use in goldfish and freshwater tanks? Not a good idea in a reef tank. You really should go with crushed coral if not sand. Trust me, if you have live rock as recommended -- 1lb per gallon, you won't see too many at once. The crab shells get corraline encrusted, for one, and they get in all the nooks and crannies, for two. Yeah, you'll see snails on the glass. They'll help clean that glass, so you want them there.

As for the salfin, generally you buy these at around 2"-3". Gonna take a long time for it to get even to 6 or 7, and by that time you'll have gotten a larger tank! Or, when it's that big, you can sell him so that you will then have the money for the larger tank

pH out of the tap doesn't matter so much. Virtually every salt like Instant Ocean or the various competitors buffers to proper pH anyway. In any case, if you use tap water you are just begging for trouble. Your glass will be a dark green and you'll spend more time with a putty knife scraping the surface than enjoying the tank -- even with a magnet (an essential item, by the way).

You'll want to get an ro/di system ... they are available cheap for the next couple weeks on ebay from a guy who used to have a bad reputation but seems to have straightened himself out. Search on reefkeeper and find the sale items. Or get one of the other models that pulls up (but DO NOT get the one advertising 85 G per day ... that one is not reputable for one, and is not telling the truth as there is no RO membrane on the market that produces at 85GPD).

I started with the inexpensive Tap Water Purifier that is just a DI filter. I was changing cartridges about every 2 weeks. The RO/DI will last much longer and within 6 months will have paid for itself

If you haven't read the article on the home page of this forum on starting a saltwater system, do yourself a favor and read it right now. I'm about to repeat much of what is here:

http/fish.orbust.net/reefstart.html

Hope this helps.

 

[FrankSlapperinni]

I've read a long book on how to keep a saltwater aquarium, but one this it did not mention was how long a membrane lasts in a RO filter, because I've looked at the prices on some of those things, and there really expensive! son are $100 for just one membrane.
how would it have paid for itself in six months?
If I use sand, wont it all get sucked up if I try to use a bottem vacume? or is there some marine invention that takes care of this?
also, how long do all of the fish I mentioned live? and where would I sell a fish? because all of the local pet stores will only take fish for free, they would never dream of actualy paying moey for them, no matter how valuable they are.
if I have live rock, I wont have to invest on a huge lighting setup like with coral right?
and what does it require to have scallops? I heard alot about theses things, but do they need extensive lighting or pristine water conditions?
on last question, what do power heads do for fish, are they neaded in a FO system?

 

[ostrow]

By my last posts I'd forgotten the first ones you wrote. Yes, you would need strong lighting for a tank with live rock and sand. If a fish only tank looks good to your eyes, then you should just start with that. In that case, I'd get not only a protein skimmer, and a good one at that, but I'd also look into a cannister filter like a Filstar or something and I'd use all the racks ... bioballs, phosphate and carbon, and all the various size foam pads.

The lights are a one-time investment, though. MH bulbs last a good 18 months. But you can get good deals on powercompact hoods. Again, check ebay and reefcentral for used deals.

And that's where you sell fish down the road: reefcentral.com. If you haven't checked out that site yet, you aren't ready to begin. I'm telling you, the buy/sell forums and the club forums (of which there are many for the New England region) are quite active and you can get pretty good deals if you look regularly.

Membranes are costly. But not over $100, if you buy at the right places. They last 3 years though.

How has it paid off already? Well, the TWP cartridges run $15 at bigalsonline.com.
At the rate of one per month, in 6 months that's $90. I bought a 4stage, 100GPH ro/di for $80 ... but the sale is running out, soon (maybe already) there will be reserve prices. I know he's selling one starting at $60 today on aquabid. Not sure but I think there's a reserve there. I'm guessing the reserve is $90 or so.

These fish you are looking at can all live several years.

Power heads create circulation and oxygenate the water if you are agitating at the surface. Fish like both. Corals need both.

 

[FrankSlapperinni]

what is an overflow box and a prefilter? I've heard these terms a lot but I've never figured out what they mean.
could you explain what goes into a canister filter, how they work ect.? I know that will be a alo, but I don't understand all of the things you put in them or how they work or anything. what does it mean when RO units hve threestages or two? do they last longer or somthing?
how big of a hood should I get for a 75 gallon tank, from what I've seen on ebay, they don't fit the top of a 75 gallon aquarium very well.
Is there any other equipment I need besides a protein skimmer, a canister filter, a PC hood and lights, powerheads,and a RO system. thats all going to run over $500 is there anything I don't need?
now, tell me if this would be a good setup
1 Bi-color angel
3 yellowtail damsels
2 occelarious clowndish
1 bicolor psudochromus
Cleanup crew
Scarlet Hermit Crabs 12
Mexican Turbo Snails 24
Dwarf Red Tip Hermit 35

 

[Great Lakes]

Frank, confusion is the most common attribute for a new marine hobbiest.

We can and will certainly help you all we can, but I have a good suggestion. Find out if you have a local saltwater/reef club. We love to show off and discuss our hobby with other folks who can appreciate paying 100 dollars for a piece of rock!!

I have been doing this for four years and I still research and read continually.

And definately shop used. I just bought a complete 125 gal reef system with all the bells and whistles for 530 dollars. Even had fish and corals and 120 lbs of live rock!

The right place, at the right time.

GL

 

[FrankSlapperinni]

aw thats no fun, you got fish with it?. I always thoght the funnest part was going to the store and seeing all of the fish. maybe it wares of after awhile. where did you buy the setup?

 

[ostrow]

You get to do that after you kill the ones you get with the setup

Hey, GL ... what gives? You got 50G more than me for the same money. You swine!!! And, more to the point, you call BUYING A 120g REEF TANK SCALING BACK?!@?!?

grrrrr.....

Listen, if you do sell stuff prior to move I'll no doubt be in the market for some stuff. Things like pumps and other gizmos for circulation increase, maybe a fuge setup, skimmer upgrade, etc. Don't forget to contact me first if you scale back.

Frank, do google searches on some of those questions and follow the links. The answers will raise questions, which will lead to more answers and questions. You'll easily find answers to the ones you ask here.

 

[Great Lakes]

I did say I was scaling back didn't I. Well, the smaller tank wasn't working out as well as we thought it would. Patti put out the ultimatum of giving up on it till after Texas, or upscaling it till it was of greater importance to us. So now I have a 125 with between 200 and 250lbs of live rock, buches of corals, and a half dozen fish.

Now I am trying to sort out my sump system to include a refugium and mangrove syustem, and I need to get building a new canopy with some serious lighting. L am trying to figure how to get about a 1000 watts with VHO and PC.

And Frank, I got it on Ebay.

 

[ostrow]

GL was it local? Have fun with the DIY.

Curious. Do you use a Calcium Reactor? My levels are low. Been using Kent Liquid Reactor but now am gonna get Turbo Calcium. Using kH buffer too so shouldn't have the sea-saw effect. But this is becoming a pain... can't get CA above 400.

 

[FrankSlapperinni]

Well, I decided (agian) that a salt water tank is just to much money for me to spend. sorry for asking for all this help for nothing