Male & Female Betas Together

[MartinD]

Oh dear here goes another thread!!!!!

I really get the feeling Martin that you knew exactly the response you would get from your post. The mere fact that you said goodbye when you didn't hear what you wanted and yet still stayed logged in watching your thread, makes me think you're just looking for a row.

Only one person gave a negative response, so instead of ranting, why not address those who gave constructive advice.

It has nothing to do with not hearing what I wanted. I haven't received what I asked for in my original post!! I know that people recommend you don't keep them. I also know that there are very, very few success stories. Does that mean I shouldn't ask?

Seems to me the exact opposite is happening and you (along with others) are taking the hump because I'm not taking your advice as Gospel and DARING to think something else might be possible.

I'd happily address those that give constructive advice (as I have in other posts in this forum long before now and also, before some of you had even joined). Don't sit there thinking that because you're more proficient in the world of Bettas any other opinions are down right wrong.

 

[newfishy]

I haven't received what I asked for in my original post!!

I told you my exact experiences, which is what you asked for. No it cant be done in house size tanks. pond size tanks with massive water volume yes, but not what the average fish keeper is able to have.

 

[Netty]

I understand you sticking up for your partner but as he stated he was 20 mins away from releasing the fish, advice was given from the people logged in at that time. It's unfortunate that Danni left such a negative response but it does get frustrating when this subject comes up time and time again, only for the advice given to be ignored.

If you need proof then here is a pic of one of our females after the male jumped the divider. He was in with her for a mere 10mins and this is the damage that was done to her. If he had been in overnight with her then we would have woken up to a dead fish. Luckily we were in the middle of tank cleaning and feeding so were able to get him out quick.

 

[Sofia]

New fishy...your response is also not helping the topic either....don't post if you have nothing constructive to add, you're just adding fuel to the fire.

Just to add, before he had even posted and after we had read the FAQ's and topics on the subject we decided to leave the male betta in his bag in the tank and release the two females into the tank, we're going to go to the fish shop tomorrow and get another tank to house the male.

We're not stupid and cruel, if 99% of the consensus on here is to not have them together then we won't take the risk, but imo he's right some people on this forum cause arguments unnecessarily.

It's not about sticking up for him...he does that perfectly well himself, it's just that silly non comments that add nothing to the topic aggravate me and it is the main reason why i don't visit this site as much as i used to, I used to be on here every day until about 6 months ago and the first day i'm back i'm seeing a repeat of the immature behaviour that made my experience on this site unbearable.

We didn't ignore your advice, we were merely seeking the opinion of people who MAY have had success.

 

[newfishy]

New fishy...your response is also not helping the topic either....don't post if you have nothing constructive to add, you're just adding fuel to the fire.

that particular post was a joke not to the op but to netty. so stop trying to be the forum police, we have many of those. and I did give several helpfull posts to the op as well.

 

[Sofia]

Comment deleted.

 

[modaz]

glad to hear that your gunna get a seperate tank, anyways here something I experience today.

If you don't know already I own a LFS and breed and sell bettas on a weekly basis. A customer the other week came into the shop, he is in his 70s but thats beside the point but he asked about the same question. I gave him my asnwer and I got the filthiest look ever given to me and was told that I didnt have a clue as he had been keeping fish for 30 odd years and had bred gourami for the past 10 years and he knew what he was talking about. My repsonse was to ask him, if he knew what he was talking about then why was he asking me? I have no fear of being direct with people whether they are my customers or on forums and my customers always come back. He told me that the LFS down the road said that it was ok to house male and females together and he thought he would come and ask for my opinion as he knew we were well known as betta breeders, the answer I gave him was not one he wanted so off he goes muttering under his breath.
Today he arrives and asks if we have any gourami, these, I get for him, then in the next breath he tells me that he lost 2 female and the male and couldn't understand what had happened, he description clearly showed that they had been fighting but again he refused to accept that what i was saying was right and blamed the other shop for selling him dodgy fish.

Excuse me for saying but I do know what I'm talking about and how these fish should be kept to ensure their safety and if anyone wishes, like this customer of mine, to think that I'm big headed is their opinion b/c at the end of the day I know I'm correct in what I say. Myself and netty (dont know many others experience of bettas on here) have learnt to look after them over the duration we have been keeping and raising fry and advice people in the right way, we have learnt from experience and from this we answer the questions.

I'm not getting nasty whatsoever as many will tell you that this is my usual tone when something has to be said.

 

[MartinD]

Modaz - Thank you for your reply. It's been very useful.

I appreciate your experience and I've taken it onboard. As said previously, we will be buying a separate tank for the male tomorrow morning first thing so that's no longer an issue.

Just as a ponderment, and this isn't to get a rise. You say that you *know* you're right and experience has taught you this. Most people will respect this and the fact you do this for a living will hold some weight - i'm sure most will agree.
My LFS has also been doing this for years and he doesn't throw fish out the door just to get a sale. He has refused to sell me fish when I was starting out because they weren't suitable and the tank hadn't cycled. He will also make sure the tank any fish are going into are suitable for the 'new' fish and if not, he wont sell. He's in it for the love of tropical and marine fish just as much as the cash. I know that he *knows* he's right and so far, 100% of the advice, tips and tricks he's given me have been right. He's really helped me out with some problems in the past. What reason have I got to doubt the advice he's given me?

Even on here, there is conflicting advice for different diseases/problems and people suggest different ways to remedy different problems. Bearing this in mind, why shouldn't I question the advice given so far and think that maybe the advice so far isn't 100% accurate?

Many will swear that methyl blue is the best cure for whitespot. Others will say add a drop of salt. Others will tell you to raise the temperature. 2 of these methods work for me yes some will have you believe that 1 or the other is incredibly bad for the fish.

So I guess all I'm saying is this: When advice is sought, it's good to give it. Everyone has their own experience to draw on and methods to combat issues. Not all of them are right but not all of them are wrong. On this occasion, it is clear that 99% of the time, keeping male and female bettas together will NOT work. Now that I've received this advice, i'm taking the necessary action to avoid any casualties. At the same time, my LFS has had both male and females in the same tank with no problems so he is also correct, just as much as other posters here have been.

 

[modaz]

its a long lasting debate that will be around for as long as bettas exist i suppose. Everyone is different and have different ways, very true, we have to deal with them every single day but thats part of fish keeping. Times have changed seriously since the 80s when fish keeping was at it peak before this new peak period and sadly so many people are stuck in the 80s and refuse to learn new ways and blend the 2 together to produce something useful for fish keepers, not saying that the 80s was full of nonsense but now a days is far much easier than before when blended with the 80s.

 

[Sofia]

Just another question, any advice would be appreciated

Would users recommend we get a 10 gallon for our two girls and use the 5 gallon for the male? I know that it has been posted that we get another 3 females but our LFS will not have any until thursday, will they be ok till then or should we partition the female tank?

 

[LauraFrog]

Depends on how much the females are fighting. Sometimes females will live together with just two or three if they have been raised in the same tank and are used to each other, but this is rare. If they fight a lot you might have to divide.

 

[modaz]

to be on the safe side i would add one female to a floating trap or similar, its only for a few days and wont do any harm, when you get the other females you will need, if you dont already know, to remove the 2 females from the tank for about 30 mins and then add all of the females back together, this neutralizes the pecking order and starts it again thus giving each female a chance to be top betta, otherwize the weakest of one of the group will be killed if introduced like you would community fish.

The larger the tank is always better for females and loads of hiding spaces.

 

[Sofia]

Thanks for all your advice

 

[Amerce]

Hi your lfs has created a very stressful situation for his bettas if he has male and females all in one tank, what is happening is that because of the large number of mixed sexes the aggression is being shared by all of the tank inhabitants and no one fish is being selected (unless of course it becomes sick and then the others will pick on it till it dies).

However a smaller group like you were suggesting is not big enough to defray the aggression so selection of a single fish is more likely.

So in short you shop has managed to find a way to keep a large group of bettas together (however what do their fins look like (if they aren't too bad then that is because a pecking order has been established) but as more of the fish are sold and the number of fish in his tank goes down more of their fins will be damaged and bite marks will appear. But this will only work if you have a tank full of bettas.

Think of factory chickens, they can't fight there isn't enough room they spend all their time trying to find somewhere to sit down

 

[Sofia]

Hi Amerce The bettas we bought are in perfect condition, and every time I have been to his shop I have never seen ill looking or damaged fish. I would never buy ill looking or fish with frayed fins etc so I can only assume that they were not fighting, but in saying that these bettas were added to the tanks on thursday so the bettas have only been together in the tanks for a few days.

When I go to my lfs today I shall speak to him about all of your points about keeping bettas and passing on the information you have all given me. I've been reading up on the betta forum about keeping bettas and will post if we need any further help about making them as happy as possible.

I'll post some pics up of them when i get them all into their new tanks today.