Juwel Rekord 800

[Thomasino]

i am confused, you started this thread off well but it appears you dont know how cycling of filters works? have you had a read through the beginners resource section for information? you should really be doing a fishless cycle by dosing with household ammonia to get your filter functional, which could take a few weeks even months. The last thing you want to do is put fish in the tank then start doing daily water changes especially if you have the choice. Im confused. Plus driftwood with bacteria on it? what? ^^

I know how fishless cycling works but I also know how fish-in cycling works. One thing I've learned from reading through the beginners guide, other websites and actually talking to people is that the fishless cycle isn't the be all or end all. I am aware of how the cycling of filters work and the growth of bacteria in the filter media but I chose to do a fish-in cycle since my friend gave away the fish, so you gotta start at the start. I know its not the preferred method but its still a method.

By the bacteria on the drift wood, I meant that since it was in an established tank at the fish shop, there would be some bacteria grown on it, right? Since the bacteria grow on surface areas in the tank and filter, ie rocks, plants, wood, gravel, and mainly filter media. Suggestions to speed up the cycling process did include taking gravel, media or other ornaments from an established tank, so thats exactly what I did.

 

[Tizer]

If your friend is giving away his fish and you have taken them on, what exactly is his filter going to be doing? Would it not have been a wise move to get his filters mature media (or at least some of it) and get it into your filter for an instant cycle (or shorter cycle)?

As for bacteria being present on tank decor and substrate, we are talking a very small amount and im sure its mentioned in the beginners section that its probably close to less than 1% of your overall beneficial bacteria, with 99% of it or more being in the filter media.

I personally always do fish-in-cycle, always have done because i know i can do a daily water change without much hastle. But i have always done it with hardy fish. The ones you listed are not ideal for fish-in-cycle, but i guess they were free and if they snuff it, no loss right?

Edit: Sorry, i did skim read most of this thread, noticed you mentioned mature media from your friend, i guess that didnt work out?

 

[Thomasino]

If your friend is giving away his fish and you have taken them on, what exactly is his filter going to be doing? Would it not have been a wise move to get his filters mature media (or at least some of it) and get it into your filter for an instant cycle (or shorter cycle)?

As for bacteria being present on tank decor and substrate, we are talking a very small amount and im sure its mentioned in the beginners section that its probably close to less than 1% of your overall beneficial bacteria, with 99% of it or more being in the filter media.

I personally always do fish-in-cycle, always have done because i know i can do a daily water change without much hastle. But i have always done it with hardy fish. The ones you listed are not ideal for fish-in-cycle, but i guess they were free and if they snuff it, no loss right?

Only 1%? #41####.
Taking his media would have been a much better option, I guess I didn't think of that at the time. He basically went home and brought them right over. Tomorrow morning I will try to get some mature media from another friend. Do you think the LFS would be willing to sell any mature media?

And I know what you're getting at with the last comment. I'm not some horrible little kid who who doesn't care for living creatures. I do not want them to die, I thought the log would carry much more bacteria and they might make it though. Would planting any more plants help the situation? Or do plants only absorb Nitrate, and not ammonia? How big of a water change should I do? Also, I am using Seachem Prime, which helps break down ammonia, nitrite and nitrate.

Edit: As I said the fish were introduced earlier then expected, so I haven't had mature just yet. As I said though, will try to get some tomorrow morning.

 

[Tizer]

The amount of water you change generally depends on the ammonia and nitrite readings mate.

If you got say, 0.5ppm Ammonia, a 50% water change will bring it down to 0.25ppm, which means you should really do a 75% water change.

As mentioned, I always fish in cycle, but i always keep ammonia and nitrite below 0.25ppm so i water change every 24 hours accordingly and on the odd occasion i've had to water change every 12 hours.

Just remember, some cycles take months to kick in which is why fish in cycle is such an #14###, unless you are a freak like me who likes doing water changes.

Sorry i didnt mean to be harsh in my comment but it does seem like you are rushing things a little, its going to be a great little tank when its up and going but all good tanks take time to get right

Yes plants can help absorb ammonia, but you need it jam packed with plants for them to have an impact. Also, with ammonia in the tank and light, its going to start creating Algae, which can be a nightmare to keep under control. Which is why i always advise to plant the tank once its cycled and there are only trace amounts of ammonia present.

You best get into daily water tests and changes soon...like...now


Filter media from your mate would ace though, save you weeks of hastle.

 

[Thomasino]

So the fish have survived the first two nights. I did a water change when you suggested, about to do another now (50%). I couldn't get any media but I picked up some synthetic stuff in a bottle from the aquarium store which is supposed to kickstart the growth of bacteria. I also put a Purigen sack in my filter to deal with the wood and general filtration. I also bought a large piece of drift wood which is pretty much the reason why I bought it, but I'm still soaking that (might try to boil, but tis huge and will have to do half at a time). The fish seem healthy, the Neon has bright colours (wasn't so bright when I put him in), and every is eating which is good.

Here's a photo update. Right after I first put water in.

With my Anubius and as soon as the fish were put in.

Water still rather cloudy.

It seems crewel to leave him on his own but I don't want to put any more in until the filter is established. Is this a good idea or do neons not produce much ammonia? Would it be ok to get only 2 more, just so he's not on his own? I plan to get at least 10 in the future, but just for now, or should I just leave it?

Red tail.

I bought some rocks as the fish were huddling around the wood and did not want to go into the open. I also got a Banana lilly and some...of those things. I forgot their name.

This is Small Dot. He's the bigger of the two but has small dots on his head. He seems rather dominated by Big Dot (the smaller of the two, with big dots). I'm not sure if its just the fish or if he's sick, but on his back he has some white colouring that the other doesn't. My mate said its just how he is. He's eating ok, but usually waits for the smaller one to finish.

Red Tail with my Anubius. Do the roots usually look like this? Slightly browned? I bought some Flourish Excel and doing regular water changes so hopefully its colouring.

Full tank shot as it sits now.

Pretty happy with it, except for the fact its been rushed. I just need to let it settle for a while and keep doing changes.
If anyone has any more advice for me, please let me know (especially about the BN catfish, his spots seem pretty dull too).

 

[Tizer]

Nice one, looks good.

Generally speaking neons dont do very well in new tanks let alone being in a fish in cycle so i certainly wouldnt add any more just yet. Your fish will still pump out ammonia, it might not be a huge amount but that takes the pressure off doing daily water changes, because it might rise slowly allowing you to do it every other day instead. I would just sit on your hands and not touch it for a month now, keep testing and keep water changing. It will be hard to do, take it from me, but once the month is over you can slowly add new fish to the tank.

 

[Thomasino]

Nice one, looks good.

Generally speaking neons dont do very well in new tanks let alone being in a fish in cycle so i certainly wouldnt add any more just yet. Your fish will still pump out ammonia, it might not be a huge amount but that takes the pressure off doing daily water changes, because it might rise slowly allowing you to do it every other day instead. I would just sit on your hands and not touch it for a month now, keep testing and keep water changing. It will be hard to do, take it from me, but once the month is over you can slowly add new fish to the tank.

Awesome, thanks for the advice. Hopefully it will give the plants time to get their roots in also.

My cat is finding it rather interesting to watch too, although I think she's thinking different about it to how I am...

 

[L_Plates]

Fish Tanks are the best Cat TV ever

Mine is also fascinated by them.

LP

 

[Thomasino]

Thought I'd do a little update. Its only been two weeks since setup but everything seems to be going ok. Everyone is eating and living happily, well, sort of. The red tail shark is not really friendly and loves to chase anyone around if they get too close, and the one neon I was given seems very dull. I bought him two friends but they don't school much with him and they seem much brighter then he is. My two BN catfish are both eating, however the larger of the two is dominated by the smaller one, who chases him when food is around. He still manages to get a feed in though. I bought 5 Bronze catfish to clean up the bottom of the tank as I noticed a lot of bits and pieces being sucked up when I do my water changes. Today I noticed my powerhead isn't producing a high flow rate, leaving the far corner of the tank stagnent. I syphoned inside the filter box where the powerhead picks up from and retrieved a few dead leaves which only helped a little bit, the stagnant point is still not flowing much.

My fern things grew fast and I had to snip the tops off a few. I re-planted them at the front (brighter light, the rear light is a 'warm' light, I want to change it as its more yellow light then white light). I also received some trimmings form my mate which I planted at the front right, they have almost doubled in size in less then a week! And finally my banana lily has sprouted a shoot headed for the surface! I also bought some tall growing leafy plants.

The pair I bought, to keep my single company until I can get a larger school.

The original. I don't know how old he is as he was given to me, or he might be stressed out from the tank change/introduction of new friends. I don't know.

The gift form my mate, sprouting to the side too! I cut some of these off when I got them, really small ones, and even they have grown like wild fire!

These are the cut offs. I actually considered throwing them away as they were so small it looked like they would die!

The trimmings form my fern things and the banana lily shooting behind it.

The original fern things, cut, and new shoots coming off the side. I may let these grow, cut them and bin the original if it continues to brown.

The leafy plant, wanting light so bad it decided it didn't want to be an aquatic plant anymore!

Thats it for now! Thanks for reading.

 

[Thomasino]

Today the pump seems even slower and now about half the surface of the water is still. I can see a slight white milky finish on top of the water that breaks apart when interrupted. Can anyone give me any advice? Is there an easier way to clean inside the filter of these types of tanks? A way to check inside my powerhead for blockages?

 

[xamy_valox]

Today the pump seems even slower and now about half the surface of the water is still. I can see a slight white milky finish on top of the water that breaks apart when interrupted. Can anyone give me any advice? Is there an easier way to clean inside the filter of these types of tanks? A way to check inside my powerhead for blockages?

Hi there,
I have the tank down from this (the 700) and have just started experiencing the same thing with regards to the filter not seeming as powerful anymore. I have squeezed out all my sponges so make sure there's nothing huge blocking the flow and got my arm as far down as I can into the cavity where the sponges sit and can't find anything.
Next water change I'm gonna get some pipe cleaners into the actual power head and make sure it's not clogged as sometimes the impellor can get stuck.
The film across the top has happened to me and I've figured it's normally if I have soap or products on my arms/hands that come off in the tank water and sit on the top. Obviously I'm not covered in soap but if I've had a shower in the morning it's still there! Don't know if this could be the case for you? May also be any products you've added to the tank (eg Stress Zyme or something) without shaking the bottle enough as I've had before lol.
Let me know if you figure out the problem with your filter!
Amy xx

 

[Thomasino]

Today the pump seems even slower and now about half the surface of the water is still. I can see a slight white milky finish on top of the water that breaks apart when interrupted. Can anyone give me any advice? Is there an easier way to clean inside the filter of these types of tanks? A way to check inside my powerhead for blockages?

Hi there,
I have the tank down from this (the 700) and have just started experiencing the same thing with regards to the filter not seeming as powerful anymore. I have squeezed out all my sponges so make sure there's nothing huge blocking the flow and got my arm as far down as I can into the cavity where the sponges sit and can't find anything.
Next water change I'm gonna get some pipe cleaners into the actual power head and make sure it's not clogged as sometimes the impellor can get stuck.
The film across the top has happened to me and I've figured it's normally if I have soap or products on my arms/hands that come off in the tank water and sit on the top. Obviously I'm not covered in soap but if I've had a shower in the morning it's still there! Don't know if this could be the case for you? May also be any products you've added to the tank (eg Stress Zyme or something) without shaking the bottle enough as I've had before lol.
Let me know if you figure out the problem with your filter!
Amy xx

Hey I also squeezed out my filter sponges and got a few leaves out from where the pump sucks up the water, it helped a little but it still seems a bit slow.
And that actually makes sense, I always wash my hands/arm before going into the tank and try to get all the soap off but I suppose it could explain it! At the moment I have the outlet directed so there's enough current in the tank but little surface disruption, not quite sure what to do about it yet.

Also, my lilly now has 2 pads to the top and one half way up!

 

[BigbruiserAl]

What test kit are you using for the water, i know you said you have been through the beginers section but didt see what kit you choose to test your water with all the things you pouring into the tank?

 

[Wilky87]

Its nice, love the rocks, and that little shark

 

[Thomasino]

Hey guys, long time no post! Rough times were had, and I have to admit to being a noob and understand I still am, probably doing something wrong now (please correct me if I am), and taking bad advice gave bad results.
 
Here's a little debrief:
So since my last post, about the standard pump being too slow, well I can't recall exactly what I did then, but long story short, plants expired at some stage, I bought a Eheim classic 600 (2217) canister filter, got help setting up and asked about how to change over, was told to put my old media in my new filter, along with the new media. I did this, and the tank turned to sh*t. Probably contributed by a lack of a timer, and me just turning the light on/off whenever I could (no regular pattarn, long hours on). Algea grew fast on the glass. got these furry algea (see photos), fish and plants started dying, I was confused as I expected the new filter to have a positive effect, not a negative one.
I ended up buying a digital timer for the light (the reason I removed the mechanical one was it kept me awake at night), cleaned and did water changes more regularly (done about 3 weeks in a row now, missed this weekends due to uni work), and at the moment it's just 4 Rosboras and 1 Loach left, and my anubias on the wood is still hanging in there. I had bought some swords and other plants throughout the precoess but they just died before even putting new leaves out. Everything seemed to be collecting algea like it was settling on anything it could, just like you can see on the rocks in the photos below.
 

 

 
You can see this furry algea taking over my wood and plant, it's very attatched and difficult to remove.

 
Bit hard to see, but the dark rock has not been turned over, the far rock has. The dark one is naturally darker, but you can kind of see the algea thats sattling on them.

 
My loach, and you can see more of that furry algea growing on the old filter box.

 
Now, explaining the new filter setup, I have the intake where the old sponges sat (in that black box), and the output is using a rain bar on the left of tank, submerged and pointing slightly up to cause a ripple. When setting it up my mate didn't install the shut off valves as he thought they were jsut used to limit flow, however I since told him they're used to isolate the filter so you can remove it from the tank for cleaning, and am now realising, it can be used to prevent air from entering the filter when doing a water change, which is proving to be a problem. The damn filter was driving me insane, I was ready to drive a metal stake through the tank some nights when trying to sleep and every 30 seconds or so a random rushing sound of air passing through the filter would jerk me from my slumber. To fix this, I've tried turning the canister on tis side slightly, or turning it on and off, and this releases some air, but never all of it. I think the ebst result I got when doing a change was blowing back into the outlet, which cleared the air in the inlet pipe, then sucking on it slightly to get the air out the outlet pipe, and turning it on (I suppose this later step isn't required, as the water will push the air back out anyway). I still occasionall get the gushing air sound and bubbled out the outlet.
 
As for population, I'm too scared to put any more fish in at the moment, even if the loach normally lives in a school of 4 I've bene told. I'm just trying to make sure its cycled through as is, with a regular light pattern and water changes, before putting any more fish or plants in. I think I might get another loach or two and was considering 4 or 5 bronze catfish, but they may not be needed with the loaches (he's doing an ok job taking care of the snails so far, although they do come out at night more).
 
As for aquascape, I'm not sure how long my anubias will last, and the wood is starting to break when I move it to clean. I have a large branch I bought from an old fish shop which I haven't used, however I will need to break it into smaller pieces to make it fit. I'd still love a ncie and green tank with moss and shrimp but not sure how they'll go with the flow rate I have and the loach looking for a feed.
 
Any advice would be appreciated, thanks guys.