Journey From The Darkside (bit Of A Journal Type Thing)

CageUK

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Having got into freshwater tanks last year and accumulated 5 of them in various sizes we've decided to venture over to the salty side.

After getting an ebay bargain of second hand but UNUSED Orca 450tl + stand + Aragonite live sand + carbon and other filter medium for the grand total of £75.00 we were ready to take the plunge so to speak.

As usual there were a number of things I wasn't clear on and answers from this and other forums have gotten me on the right track.

It was clear for instance that the bog standard equipment isn't really sufficient for a nano reef tank and some modifications needed to be made.

These are now underway and with improved flow created and a replacement skimmer on the way I'm now well on the way to be a mod freak.

We got our cured live rock (approx 7.5 kg + some live rubble) from our local LFS and two days later the tank was fully cycled. The live rock came out of their tanks and had been maturing in there for around 5 weeks. A little while for the tank to settle down then the clean up crew were added to get to work on the algae etc now cluttering up the tank. There wasn't a ridiculas amount to be honest but the little guys have been busy and they are doing a great job.

They were:

2 x turbo like snails (were told by lfs that they weren't turbos but very like them).
2 x nerite snails...these have been a little disappointing and seem to sleep most of the time.
2 x sand shifting snails...upon introduction to the tank they dived into the sand immediately and only make their presence known by an occasional periscope popping up out of the sand.
5 x Hermit crabs...they were labelled as blue legged hermits but they only have blue bands on the leg joints and not all over so we are hoping they they are actually blue knuckle hermits that we have read are better of temperament. These guys have been the real stars of the show and have worked virtually non stop on clean up duty.

We have not had anything spectacular hitch hiker wise but have had quite a few small to tiny feathers, plenty of pods of various kinds and a crab...this is the first critter I want to ID please, see below.

We have now added the first of the fish and have two Clowns to grace our presence. Great guys and they have really brought the tank to life. We have also added a red feather (not sure of it's proper name).

We intend to add a yellow watchman goby and a cleaner shrimp later on, plus a few small inverts when the tank matures. Do you think we may be able to squeeze a royal gamma in there as well?

Here are some pics as the tank is at the moment. Obviously a little bare but I'm hoping it will improve in time.

This is just before we added the cuc. I'll have to find a way of disguising all the wires!
orca_weba1.jpg


After CUC and Clowns added:
orca_web10.jpg


One of the Clowns
orca_web13.jpg


Our feather (the shells on the sand are new homes for the hermits when they are ready).
orca_web12.jpg




Critter 1 (CRAB)

He is very shy and I've not seen him in his entirety but I did find an empty shell which gave me the clue that he was around. I searched the live rock until I found him cowering in a small hole. I can't get a photo of him so I'm hoping a description will suffice.

Size about 1cm across

He is a classic crab shape and sort of red shell and claws and white legs in colour I think (I've only ever seen him buried in his hole). He looks very similar to the kinds of crabs you might catch at the seaside in the UK.
Any ideas? Is he likely to be a goodie or a baddie (I suspect the latter)?
He is small at the moment but I'm sure I'm going to have to remove him when he gets bigger (if I can ever get to him).

Critter 2 (Mollusc)

This guy looks a bit like a muscle. He is about 12 or 13mm long and is brownish in colour. He opens his shell a little at night and out comes a 'foot'. Most nights he doesn't move, but when I put him into the middle of the tank (for better vision) that night he moved himself back into the corner where I have left him.
I suspect that he is benign but would like to be sure.

orca_web16.jpg


Critter 3 (little stars)


These are tiny star shaped creatures clinging to the glass. They are slightly larger than a pin head (including legs) and are white in colour. I have not seen them move but they multiplying somehow and the current blows there bristles (legs) slightly. There was only one a few days ago now there are seven altogether. I think they are just copepod type creatures but it would be nice if they were baby brittles or something (or would it?).

First there was one...
orca_web19.jpg


...and then there were three (well seven in fact but these three were where the first one was).
orca_web18.jpg



Anyway I'll update when somthing interesting happens, hope you enjoy!

Oh and I shall be asking lots more questions no doubt.

Thanks

Mark
 
Those little things almost look like a type of jellyfish to me...
 
Im really glad you posted such clear photos of those star-shaped stickers.

I have them as well.


I believe those are either some type of an anenome or zoas.


Id like confirmation as well though bc Im obviously not sure.
 
Hi Mark,

Congrats on the tank. It looks like you are progressing very well. How long has your tank been running? I started mine on Jan. 31st. I think that one of my hitchhikers (mollusk) is the same as yours. Sounds the same, from your description. Mine usually clamps onto a small rock. Let me know if you get and ID for this little guy. I attached a pic of mine, clamped onto a rock.
Hitchhiker_008.jpg
 
Not sure what the volume of the tank is, but based on the photos I wouldn't put a Royal Grammar in there.

I think a Goby / shrimp pair would work well, although you'll need to be careful of aggression from the clowns whatever you add. Despite their friendly "nemo" image, they can beligerant little sods at times.

Hard to say without a photo, but where crabs are concerned, I 'd assume it was a pest until identified as otherwise.

In terms of the hermits, blue knuckles are pretty easy to identify, so if you're unsure which it is, I'd assume it's just a regular blue legged hermit. I'd agree about the blue knuckle having a better temprement and are definitely more attractive.

Blue Knuckle

Blue%20Knuckle%20Hermit%20Crab.jpg


Blue Legged

Blue_legged_Hermit_crab.JPG
 
Hi Mark,

Congrats on the tank. It looks like you are progressing very well. How long has your tank been running? I started mine on Jan. 31st. I think that one of my hitchhikers (mollusk) is the same as yours. Sounds the same, from your description. Mine usually clamps onto a small rock. Let me know if you get and ID for this little guy. I attached a pic of mine, clamped onto a rock.
View attachment 49599

Cheers fishinessex

I put the water in the day before you started yours. I was very lucky with the live rock as the lfs let me select what I wanted from her display tanks so it was very mature. It was only out of the tank for about 30-45 mins before going into my tank and during that time it was secured wet in a poly box so I must have had very little die off. I had a .25 ammonia spike the day after, but no reading on the nitrites. The ammonia was 0 the day after that as was nitrites and has been that way since. My nitrates have stayed less than, or around 5ppm which tells me there was not a great deal of ammonia generated.

Re: the mollusc, I'll have to try placing him on a rock to see if that will make him happy.

I will let you know if I get an ID.



@ombomb,
Going by your pics my hermits are def blue knuckles, she obviously had them marked up wrongly in the lfs.

My other half has been intrigued by the goby/shrimp relationships and has been looking to see what might be suitable. I was quite surprised to see in your nano journal you have a pairing with a pistol shrimp as I've read that they can predate snails and small fish! If not then that may be worth me thinking about although we would have liked a shrimp that was a little more public like the skunk cleaner for instance.
The tank is only a 58ltr so I hear what you are saying and won't be adding a Royal Grammar based on your advice. We did think it may be stretching it a bit.

Skifletch,
Interesting what you say of the possibility of the star things being jelly fish. If so would they be goodies or baddies? Although it is not clear from the photos, they are not free floating but are attached to the glass and haven't moved since so I don't know if that makes any difference.



An interesting thing happened last night when I went to feed the clowns.
Virtually the second the miniscule amount of flake that I added, hit the water all hell let loose. The clowns were diving up to the surface, the hermits made a mad dash for the sand bed and the sand shifters sufaced from beneath the sand like some kind of 1960's sci fi creature with probosis extended and qivering in the air.
Athletic little blighters too! One of them fell from a piece of rock he was moving over and landed upside down. I was just about to reach in to right him when he twisted his body like a cat then did as sort of back flip to bring his shell around. It was amazing to watch.
He then found a piece of flake and extended yet another probosis type of elephants trunk to start eating it.

Who'd have thought that snails could be so interesting.

I have started to run my skimmer at night only then switching to an air stone in one of the chambers for the day time. This is in an attempt to keep the PH as stable as possible day/night.

Once my replacement skimmer comes I will probably run it 24/7 as long as it doesn't give me the dreaded microbubbles.


On the PH subject, I've read that running a sump with a refugium with an alternate photo cycle (ie lights on when tanks lights are off) is a good way to keep ph stable through the night time period.
Any thoughts?

I won't be starting a sump for this tank but maybe on a future project! :rolleyes:

Cheers

Mark
 
Larger pistol shrimps in the wild will predate on other inverts, but the smaller types that pair with Gobies are reef safe.

Are you sure you're not getting them confused with Mantis shrimp?

Bit of good fortune with the hermits, I'll never have a blue legged hermit in my tank again, they're very aggressive IME red legged and blue knuckle or much better suited to life in an aquarium.
 
Larger pistol shrimps in the wild will predate on other inverts, but the smaller types that pair with Gobies are reef safe.

Are you sure you're not getting them confused with Mantis shrimp?

Bit of good fortune with the hermits, I'll never have a blue legged hermit in my tank again, they're very aggressive IME red legged and blue knuckle or much better suited to life in an aquarium.


That's good to know then we will consider them. The blurb I had read mentioned that pistol shrimps stun their prey with a loud clicking noise (hence the name 'Pistol') then get to work on them.
I know that Mantis shrimps are a no no with small creatures but hunt their prey differently.

Re: the hermits, we were looking for them as blue knuckles and were 95% sure that these were them but it's good to know we made a right decision (doesn't happen that often :look: ).


Cheers

Mark
 
Update on the star type things, they DO move on the glass, I'd just never noticed it before I took the photos. They are now in a different position to the photo!

Not that it will make ID any easier but just thought I'd mention it.

Cheers

Mark
 
Just done my daily params check

I have a small Ammonia spike which I wasn't expecting. It is .25 or less so I'm going to heat up and aerate some pre mixed water just in case. The Nitrites are zero and the Nitrates are stable at around 5ppm

SG 1.024
PH 8.13
Temp 25.5

It may have been the cumulative result of 2 days feeding (minimal though) or I may have lost one of my nerites. I can account for everyone else but can't find the smaller of the Nerite snails.

Will keep an eye on it.

Cheers
 
I never had any luck with Nerites.

I know you can get a type of Nerite snail in UK waters so I think a lot of them that are available are really more suited to colder water.
 
Update on the star type things, they DO move on the glass, I'd just never noticed it before I took the photos. They are now in a different position to the photo!

Not that it will make ID any easier but just thought I'd mention it.

Cheers

Mark

Yup. Mine too. Ill try and post some of my own photos but you'll notice them start to grow. Try looking at them under a moonlight or with very little room lighting if possible.

They look very much like anenomes with heads and tentacles. But then the can move or just shrink up to nothing. Very weird.

They seem to be multiplying in my tank.
 
Im really glad you posted such clear photos of those star-shaped stickers.

I have them as well.


I believe those are either some type of an anenome or zoas.


Id like confirmation as well though bc Im obviously not sure.

Well piranha_trader, after much searching I finally managed to ID the little star critters. Ski was spot on and they are some kind of hydroid jellyfish - hydromedusae (Staurocladia oahuensis). Harmless and are food for large creatures in a similar way to copepods. The best link I've found for these is http://www.wetwebmedia.com/jellyidfaqs.htm and also http://www.ronshimek.com/Animal%20Groups%2...0Cnidarians.htm

Glad that one's sorted.

Cheers

Mark
 
Im really glad you posted such clear photos of those star-shaped stickers.

I have them as well.


I believe those are either some type of an anenome or zoas.


Id like confirmation as well though bc Im obviously not sure.

Well piranha_trader, after much searching I finally managed to ID the little star critters. Ski was spot on and they are some kind of hydroid jellyfish - hydromedusae (Staurocladia oahuensis). Harmless and are food for large creatures in a similar way to copepods. The best link I've found for these is [URL="http://www.wetwebmedia.com/jellyidfaqs.htm"]http://www.wetwebmedia.com/jellyidfaqs.htm[/URL] and also [URL="http://www.ronshimek.com/Animal%20Groups%2...0Cnidarians.htm"]http://www.ronshimek.com/Animal%20Groups%2...0Cnidarians.htm[/URL]

Glad that one's sorted.

Cheers

Mark


Really awesome Mark...nice work especially that last link. Never knew of jellyfish polyps before and they do mimic anenomes which Ive seen allover my tank.
 
Blue legs can be supper grumpy, but I keep a mix and find they only ever pick on their own species. I also have orange claw and redlegs too. The beauty of blue legs is their apetite, they are the best thing out there for cleaning rock work of algae of most types where other CUC wont touch. If you want good clean up with a easy going tempremant you want orange claw hermits. These also look pretty cool too, dont scrap, but nosh for england!!.. red legs look pretty, but are useless for anything else..lol as they have to be laziest creature in my tank :) All in all tough a marine tank without hermits its just unthinkable ;) IMO :)
 

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