I'm So Confused - Cycling 5 Gallon

[DragonFox91]

My first betta I just let the tank sit overnight. He lasted a week, so I decided to try cycling

I let it sit for 3 weeks. Ammonia stayed at 2. Wasn't getting nitrites or nitrates. Supposedly ammonia needs to get up to least 4 before cycle starts. Was putting in a few fish food pellets every day.

Got impatient & put another betta fish in. Had her for 3 weeks. Lot of glass surfing. A couple days after I got her, finally got positive test for nitrites & nitrates. But Other than that one positive test for nitrites & nitrates, nothing. She finally appeared to be calming down w/ the glass surfing but got ick. Died a week later. Ammonia continued to test 2 all thru out. I got a 4 once & did water change.

I'm so confused.
Why after 3 weeks wasn't I getting nitrites or nitrates? It was 5-6 weeks, counting the time the fish was in.
Pellets seem to take a while to break down so this time I'm trying flakes. Do those work better?
I'm not cleaning/wiping everything down to get rid of the ick b/c I think it's the ammonia/uncycled tank that got to her. Is that okay or even in a cycled tank will the ick come back?
How do you cycle a 5 gallon tank & get ammonia high enough to start getting nitrites & nitrates?

It's so frustrating knowing it could be another month minimum before I can try another fish again.

 

[Sunnyspots]

Hello. Just a couple of questions first. It sounds like you tried cycling with food to make ammonia. Is that right?

 

[Sunnyspots]

And did you have a filter and heater both switched on?

 

[DragonFox91]

Yes, correct, I am trying to cycle it w/ fish food flakes. (last time I was trying fish food pellets but ammonia was just staying around 2)
I do have heater & filter on. Pre-set heater to 82.

 

[Sunnyspots]

Hmm. Would you consider getting ammonia? It works out simpler as you can tailor the doses, and it is easy enough to buy online.

 

[Slaphppy7]

Yes, correct, I am trying to cycle it w/ fish food flakes. (last time I was trying fish food pellets but ammonia was just staying around 2)
I do have heater & filter on. Pre-set heater to 82.

Welcome to the forum.

This is not how fish-in cycling works.
If you have a fish in the tank, the ammonia produced by the fish is what will start the cycling process...overfeeding just causes major water param issues.

You would be better off doing a fishless cycle, then adding a betta once the cycle is complete: https://www.fishforums.net/threads/cycling-your-new-fresh-water-tank-read-this-first.421488/

 

[Sunnyspots]

It also takes a good long while. I did 6 weeks of cycling using bottled ammonia.

 

[DragonFox91]

I just picked up some ammonia from Ace's Hardware store. Apparently this is the kind to use. Not sure if I should put some of it in. Just tested ammonia & it's between 1-2 like it usually is.

Welcome to the forum.

This is not how fish-in cycling works.
If you have a fish in the tank, the ammonia produced by the fish is what will start the cycling process...overfeeding just causes major water param issues.

You would be better off doing a fishless cycle, then adding a betta once the cycle is complete: https://www.fishforums.net/threads/cycling-your-new-fresh-water-tank-read-this-first.421488/

Right but my fish died so trying fishless cycle again. I was never trying to fish-in cycle by overfeeding.

 

[Sunnyspots]

If you follow the forum thread slaphppy7 posted it'll walk you through a fishless cycle step by step. If your level is 1-2 ammonia you'll need to add some more, but check the thread for advice on quantities. Unfortunately it can be a bit of trial and error to get the amount just right, plus the tests for ammonia don't show 3ppm so you'll have to judge it by eye.

Stick to it. It really is worth it in the end!

 

[Slaphppy7]

You will need a liquid testing kit, the paper strips can be unreliable and inaccurate, get one of these ASAP: https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000255NCI/?tag=ff0d01-20

You will also need a good quality water conditioner, such as Seachem Prime, or API Tap Water Conditioner...no other chemicals (besides the ammonia) are needed.

Follow the directions in the fishless cycling sticky I provided above, and post back here with any questions you may have.

Cycling is not hard, but it takes time, so patience is key...it may take weeks to get the tank cycled before adding fish, but it is necessary to make sure that your fish is happy and healthy.

Good luck!

 

[DragonFox91]

Well looks like I got a 3-4 on the ammonia test tonight, so off to a good start. Let's go nitrites!!!! Fingers crossed I get a positive test for them in a couple days!

Also, for my 1st betta I did have the test strips. The big problem w/ them is that they didn't have ammonia on it, at least the kind I had. Hardness & pH it was hard to tell what color best matched the number on the bottle. I regret buying the strips.

So then I got a liquid ammonia test, then when I was consistently getting a 2 reading, I got the nitrate test. But then i realized I really should be testing for nitrites too. Problem is, they don't sell the nitrite tests individually like ammonia & nitrate, so I bought the master kit yesterday.

 

[FroFro]

My first betta I just let the tank sit overnight. He lasted a week, so I decided to try cycling

I let it sit for 3 weeks. Ammonia stayed at 2. Wasn't getting nitrites or nitrates. Supposedly ammonia needs to get up to least 4 before cycle starts. Was putting in a few fish food pellets every day.

Got impatient & put another betta fish in. Had her for 3 weeks. Lot of glass surfing. A couple days after I got her, finally got positive test for nitrites & nitrates. But Other than that one positive test for nitrites & nitrates, nothing. She finally appeared to be calming down w/ the glass surfing but got ick. Died a week later. Ammonia continued to test 2 all thru out. I got a 4 once & did water change.

I'm so confused.
Why after 3 weeks wasn't I getting nitrites or nitrates? It was 5-6 weeks, counting the time the fish was in.
Pellets seem to take a while to break down so this time I'm trying flakes. Do those work better?
I'm not cleaning/wiping everything down to get rid of the ick b/c I think it's the ammonia/uncycled tank that got to her. Is that okay or even in a cycled tank will the ick come back?
How do you cycle a 5 gallon tank & get ammonia high enough to start getting nitrites & nitrates?

It's so frustrating knowing it could be another month minimum before I can try another fish again.

I’d also recommend borrowing some filter media. If you know anyone else with a healthy, pest free freshwater tank who is willing to part with a small portion of filter media you can use this to help seed your tank and sort of “kickstart” your bacterial colony. I do this with my dad or fathers tanks, i cut a small portion of filter floss from the HoB filters and stick it right into the back of my own. Or, when using a sponge filter, I use some tied of panty house to stash it in and stick it into the tank via suction cup or zip tie, usually right next to or attached to the sponge filter.

 

[Colin_T]

Don't let ammonia levels go above 5ppm or the cycle will stop.

If you are using dead fish, prawn or fish food to produce ammonia, remove it now while the ammonia is below 5ppm otherwise it will keep going up.

You can help speed up the cycling process by having the pH around 7.0, temperature around 30C (86F), and have lots of aeration in the tank. Keep the top of the tank open to the air too and this helps bacteria land in the water and start things up.

You can buy liquid filter bacteria supplements online or form pet shops. Add them at a double dose every day for a week, and then pour the remaining contents into the tank. try to add the supplement near the filter intake so it gets drawn into the filter where it belongs.

Do not clean the filter for the first 6-8 weeks otherwise you can wash out the filter bacteria. After that time, you can clean the filter once a month by washing the filter media/ materials in a bucket of tank water, and re-using the media. the bucket of dirty tank water can be poured on the lawn/ garden.

If you have filter pads/ cartridges in the filter, do not replace these until they start to fall apart otherwise you will get rid of the good bacteria. If you need to replace them, buy a sponge from another brand of power filter and use a pair of scissors to cut the sponge to fit in your filter. You can add sponge now and let it cycle with the remaining filter media if you want to.

 

[DragonFox91]

I'm not sure liquid bacteria is any good. I used it for my last betta the first few days It seemed to keep ammonia down in the 1-2 range, but I never got any nitrates. Since I'm trying to grow ammonia, it seems counterproductive.

Question on de-clorinator: when it says 'fill this amount for X gallons', is that how much total water is in the tank, or how much new water you're putting in?

Family is telling me I should completely restart since my fish had ick. Shoud I completely re-start, or will the ick die between now & when I get my tank cycled & add new fish? Some sources say ick is always in tank & healthy fish are able to fight it off. Some say it dies in a couple weeks without fish.

At this point I've had filter/tank set up for 6-8 weeks. (1 week w/ first betta, 3 weeks trying to cycle without fish, 3 weeks w/ second betta in it). Should I replace filter? I do not have ntirates or nitrites.
(I was going to replace it but they didn't have the kind I need in stock yetserday)

 

[Sunnyspots]

I can't comment on the ich I'm afraid, but don't throw away the filter. There are 2 types of helpful bacteria. One turns ammonia to nitrite. If you have fed them by adding ammonia, as you have, they will start to build up. It is when enough are there and working that you see nitrites.
The second type of bacteria turn nitrites to nitrates. They take longer to build up so you won't see nitrates until they are also working.
At the moment your filter should have at least some ammonia eating bacteria so it is worth keeping.