I Recall....

[crazyelece]

There are other ways to deal with evaporation. I only have about two gallons in my return chamber and my tank can go almost two weeks before it is mandatory that I replace water from evaporation. You can still have overflow problems with drilling as it is just as likely to get a snail or other obstruction as it is to get an air bubble capable of breaking a siphon. Murphy's Law - if it can fail it will. Most that will ever happen to my tank is a burnt up pump from running dry - cost $60 to replace.

On a side note with evaporation, if you have to top off that much water you may want to check your salinity swings because that seems like your salinty would vary a noticeable amount.

Again I'm not saying that drilling doesn't work, I just think you can go without it to save money and it isn't a problem for most situations

 

[andywg]

220 gallons would be expected to lose a good 5 or so gallons a week, maybe more depending on the size and shape of the sump.

Drilling is actually cheaper than buying/constructing an overflow. And there is less to go wrong. Everything that can happen to a drilled tank can happen to an overflow tank and overflows have the additional problem of loss of syphon.

And most people who run overflows for a few years find it does at one point or another break. Others have no problem, but I know of far more people who have had loss of syphon than a drilled tank get blocked. Grills and covers prevent snails getting in, you can't stop the snail getting in.

 

[superman]

There are other ways to deal with evaporation. I only have about two gallons in my return chamber and my tank can go almost two weeks before it is mandatory that I replace water from evaporation. You can still have overflow problems with drilling as it is just as likely to get a snail or other obstruction as it is to get an air bubble capable of breaking a siphon. Murphy's Law - if it can fail it will. Most that will ever happen to my tank is a burnt up pump from running dry - cost $60 to replace.

On a side note with evaporation, if you have to top off that much water you may want to check your salinity swings because that seems like your salinty would vary a noticeable amount.

Again I'm not saying that drilling doesn't work, I just think you can go without it to save money and it isn't a problem for most situations

You didn't mention how you deal with evap when your return chamber is only 2 gallons, other than an auto top off system, I see no way that you could go 2 weeks without topping off.

As far as the reference to my salinity swings, I top off about 5 gallons every 2 days (during the dry winter months) So going a week without topping off my tank would leave me at a loss of just over 15 gallons, which doesn't cause much of a salinity swing on a system with a total true water volume of about 260 gallons. Keep in mind that this small salinity swing would be over the course of a whole week, which would not harm any livestock in the slightest.

With the tanks I care for I would not be so happy to simply replace a sump pump, I use sequence pumps which are not very cheap pumps (but VERY reliable) I guess that if you use an inexpensive pump for your sump pump than there is no problem, except for the fact that if your sump pump fries, you're gone for the weekend and your heater is in your sump...

 

[crazyelece]

I am not really arguing that a siphon is better than drilling, just cheaper. You can always get the tank drilled down the road. And lets face it if it the first tank, you are either going to not like saltwater (rarely happens) or you are going to get a bigger better tank. You can buy a wet/dry and use it for the sump and most of them come with a siphon overflow.

My argument is that for a beginer's tank that is going to be setup as a FOWLR it is cheaper to get a used non drilled tank ($200 for 125 with stand and light strip), a wet/dry ($200), a heater ($30), salt and hydrometer/refractometer ($50), skimmer ($150).

You have to remember its his first tank and shouldn't be overly complicated. And a FOWLR has a much lower demand than you would need for a reef. I mean if you wanted to start it up really cheap hold off on the sump filtration for awhile. Get a tank, a heater, salt and a HOB or canister filter and you would be good for 5-6 months while you built up the stock in the tank. I have found with saltwater if you start with a small budget it helps you to not over do it. You can't afford to throw 5 fish in at the same time. It helps the impatient to build the tank up gradually and actually learn alot in the process.

Also, I don't really understand why I have so little evaporation. I have glass canopies and no MH lighting so that helps, but I only lose about a gallon and a half (give or take I don't actually measure it) every other week. My fresh water tanks have more evaporation than my saltwater does at least considering the volume diffferences.

 

[andywg]

The cost of having a hole drilled is far cheaper than buying a wet-dry. Even if you don't like SW, you still have the sump for FW, and I wouldn't do without mine. If I was just setting up a tank, I would want as little as possible to be able to go wrong, and would therefore go for a drilled.

 

[superman]

The cost of having a hole drilled is far cheaper than buying a wet-dry. Even if you don't like SW, you still have the sump for FW, and I wouldn't do without mine. If I was just setting up a tank, I would want as little as possible to be able to go wrong, and would therefore go for a drilled.

I wholeheartedly agree andy, it is far more easy to just get it drilled BEFORE you set it up, I don't know why crazyelece would say "You can always get the tank drilled down the road." It is a HUGE pain in the but to drill a tank after it has been set up. A person can just have the tank drilled, and plug the whole if they are unsure if they want to connect a sump. What is important is that people start out on the right foot, instead of going two steps forward then one step back, when they realize how they SHOULD have started their tank. Suggesting starting out with a drilled tank is a simple economical way to go, it will help take pointless frustration out of the initial start up of the tank, I have talked to way too many rookies that can't get their overflow to start siphon.