How Many Water Changes Are Nessicary During Fish-In Cycling?

[Arei]

I've gotten so many different responses @_@

This is my first tank in many years, and the first time I'm really responsible for my own tank. I had no idea about the cycling process until a few days ago, so a few fish added not long after the tank was set up died so now I'm gonna focus on letting the cycle complete itself before more fish are added. Right now there are 5 platies in the tank.

The tank was set up last Friday. Fish were added Sunday, so its been a week from tomorrow when fish were first introduced, and I've done one water change 3-4 days ago. Should I do another today, tomorrow, or just make it a weekly thing? I probably made a 40% change last time.

I've been monitoring the levels but I am using the test strips which I've heard aren't very accurate, but now I don't have the money yet to afford that API master kit, but I will ASAP. It's been saying the nitrites are 0, and yesterday I noticed the nitrates started to rise (to the color that says 20ppm) PH is 7, the water is very hard, and ammonia has been steady for a few days at 1.0. I know that's a bit stressful to the fish but is that normal at this point in the cycle? Should I do a water change now to help lower the ammonia or wait until Tuesday or so (and that will be a week) to change the water again?

 

[toshapetriji]

Well the answer is you need to change enough water to keep your amonia at zero.

Of course you are not really able to measure that until you get an alternative to your test strips.

All I can suggest is that you change around 30% a day until you can measure more accurately.

 

[Arei]

Ah ok. I'll do that then, and I'll try to get that test kit next week as soon as I can

 

[toshapetriji]

You can usually find a complete API mater test kit on ebay for around 15 or 20 quid if you are in the UK.

This will enable you to measure all the important parameters.

 

[Arei]

I'm in the US ^^ And I think it was $25-30 something in the store.

I've never ever had a problem with a fish tank before, such as fish dying in a new set-up, and like I said I hadn't even heard of cycling anymore. Should I have known, I would've waited til I had a bit more saved up before embarking on this hobby again. I'm trying to make sure everything stays good for the fish already in there until the cycle is complete.

 

[N0body Of The Goat]

Until you know what your ammonia and nitrite results are for sure, I suggest you do massive water changes daily, in the region of 80% (basically removing almost all water, just leaving enough to cover your fish).

You say ammonia has been a steady 1mg/l. You need to dilute this by an absolute minimum of 4, so it is under 0.25mg/l. Even at this level, you are jepardising your fishes' short and long term health.

Try and "vacuum" the tank floor to remove any rotting food, plus very gently rinse the filter sponges in the removed tank water.

 

[Assaye]

I've gotten so many different responses @_@

This is my first tank in many years, and the first time I'm really responsible for my own tank. I had no idea about the cycling process until a few days ago, so a few fish added not long after the tank was set up died so now I'm gonna focus on letting the cycle complete itself before more fish are added. Right now there are 5 platies in the tank.

The tank was set up last Friday. Fish were added Sunday, so its been a week from tomorrow when fish were first introduced, and I've done one water change 3-4 days ago. Should I do another today, tomorrow, or just make it a weekly thing? I probably made a 40% change last time.

I've been monitoring the levels but I am using the test strips which I've heard aren't very accurate, but now I don't have the money yet to afford that API master kit, but I will ASAP. It's been saying the nitrites are 0, and yesterday I noticed the nitrates started to rise (to the color that says 20ppm) PH is 7, the water is very hard, and ammonia has been steady for a few days at 1.0. I know that's a bit stressful to the fish but is that normal at this point in the cycle? Should I do a water change now to help lower the ammonia or wait until Tuesday or so (and that will be a week) to change the water again?

Yes, 1.0 of ammonia is normal at this point in a tank with too few water changes.

Your sole aim during a fish-in cycle is to keep your fish healthy. This means keeping toxic chemicals at undetectable levels. Some people like to make things "easier" for you by saying "do a water change twice a week" or "do 25% a day". However, this is just confusing because so many people will say different things. I can't tell you how often to change the water as every tank is different however I *can* tell you that you need to keep your ammonia and nitrite at *zero*. This may mean doing two 90% water changes a day! You need to test the water twice a day and do as large a water change as necessary to bring the ammonia and nitrite (if there is any) right down to a level that is undetectable (this also means testing about 10 minutes after each water change to check). If the ammonia isn't right down, do another water change, and so on.

It's not "a bit stressful" for the fish - it could kill them.

 

[Arei]

Whoa ok, then more daily water changes it is. Just did another and vacuumed the bottom, I think I have fed them a bit too much with what I've been finding so I'll definately lower the amount and frequency for awhile and change water daily. Also did a good cleaning of the filter sponge. I am using double filtration too.

Thanks guys, the info is extremely helpful, as I really want to keep these little guys in good shape. I'll get paid Monday and I'll immediately go out and get the master test kit, but as for now they'll get a daily water changes/vacuum to keep the ammonia down.

I'm really amazed in the past I've been able to put fish in the tank without cycling and them live but now that I know it's an irresponsible move I won't be doing that again. Thanks for the helpful info, I appreciate it~

 

[N0body Of The Goat]

As a guide for feeding, look at the size of one eye per fish...

This much food per day is enough.

Any more, they either greddily eat (producing more waste and so more ammonia), or leave to rot in the tank and filter (producing ammonia).

 

[Assaye]

Whoa ok, then more daily water changes it is. Just did another and vacuumed the bottom, I think I have fed them a bit too much with what I've been finding so I'll definately lower the amount and frequency for awhile and change water daily. Also did a good cleaning of the filter sponge. I am using double filtration too.

Thanks guys, the info is extremely helpful, as I really want to keep these little guys in good shape. I'll get paid Monday and I'll immediately go out and get the master test kit, but as for now they'll get a daily water changes/vacuum to keep the ammonia down.

I'm really amazed in the past I've been able to put fish in the tank without cycling and them live but now that I know it's an irresponsible move I won't be doing that again. Thanks for the helpful info, I appreciate it~

You cleaned the sponges in tank water, right? Not tap water? Don't be over keen to clean the filter - a check to make sure it isn't too gunky every 2-3 weeks is usually enough.

Keep up the good work!

 

[OldMan47]

In the US, I got my API kit for about $20 delivered from one of the on line sources. I don't recall if it was e-bay or Dr Foster Smith or one of the many other sources. As you say, the kit is close to $30 at the LFS. As long as you are changing plenty of water daily, your fish can afford to wait a few days until you can afford the proper kit. One problem with not being able to measure things is that you will not be able to back off the water changes unless you can measure your progress.

 

[Arei]

I got the kit today, and I've noticed a tremendous improvement in water clarity. It's perfectly clear (had been slightly hazy, bacterial bloom) and its lost the strong fishy smell, and now the ammonia is at 0.5 according to the liquid test. I haven't disturbed the tank since Saturday (and I just fed them a tiny bit, and that was the first they've had since Saturday). I will continue to monitor it.

Edit: And yes I rinsed the sponge in the removed tank water, just to get the waste off..

 

[waterdrop]

OK, sounds like you've made great progress in both your tank and in your understanding of the problem. Please remember the details of what Assaye said up there: Any amount of ammonia is damaging (it causes permanent gill damage, even in small amounts.)

Since you've measured a 0.50ppm ammonia level with your new API kit, that is telling you that a massive water change is called for as soon as you are able to do it.

Another way of stating the same goal that Assaye is talking about is to say that you want to figure out what percentage and frequency of water changes will keep both ammonia and nitrite below 0.25ppm until you can be home again to re-test and potentially change water again. Its the crossing of the line at about 0.25ppm or 0.30ppm (API kit is easier to see at 0.25, Nutrafin kit easier to see at 0.30) that we worry about - when we see 0.50ppm we know the likelihood of damage is more real.

Always use good technique on water changes: gravel-clean-siphon the water out, treat the new tap water with conditioner (to remove chlorine/chloramines) and roughly temperature match (your hand is good enough for this.)

~~waterdrop~~

 

[Arei]

Hmmm, did another water change, siphoned the gravel, but the ammonia isn't moving. I've probably been removing 60-70%, tomorrow should I try removing nearly all of the water? I was going to take all the decorations out and give the gravel a good siphoning until the water was extremely low. I see you're supposed to do frequent water changes when cycling, but won't huge daily changes be detrimental? Or is it just the price to pay to keep the fish healthy? I just want to be sure I'm not overdoing it. But since the levels aren't changing much I suppose I do as large of a change as possible to make the levels go down?

The 20 gallon is so getting cycled fishless, well, months down the line when my sanity has recovered from this adventure.

 

[StingRay999]

I am no expert in the field, and unfortunately I started out the wrong way as well. I finally got the right advice from the people on the forum and started testing my water. I did aabout 2 tests a day and 3 water changes a day. When the levels were above 0.25ppm I did a 90 % water change and if they were below 0.25ppm I did a 70 % water change. As waterdrop told me, you should not be to scared to do big water changes, after all the main concern is the health of the fish, and making sure the water is constantly safe will help make sure that the fish stay healthy and dont get poisoned. Just make sure that when you do such big water changes your filter stays wet.